By Barney Burnham
November 24 2006

Simon Shaw is now in his tenth season with Wasps, and closing in on his 250th appearance for the club. He’s also won 34 England caps, and been on two Lions tours. He’s enjoying a busy but richly deserved Benefit Year.
In between a training session and an appointment in the physio room at Twyford Avenue, Shawsie found time to talk to Barney Burnham about his long, distinguished career.

--ooOoo--

BB: Let’s go right back to the very beginning. You were born in Kenya. How long did you spend there, before coming back to live in England?

SS: I think it was about nine years, but I don’t recall too much about it – apart from a few run-ins with lions!

BB: Did you find them at the bottom of the garden?

SS: No, we had a couple of incidents at school. Instead of a fire alarm, they had a wild animal alarm, and we had to be escorted out by the teachers. We had a couple of those!

BB: Very formative! So, were you always large for your age?

SS: Yes, I think so. I was twelve pounds when I was born and obviously I was larger than average most of the time. But it wasn’t until I was about fifteen or sixteen that I had a growth spurt and really towered over everybody.

BB: What did you do, in terms of sport? Did the rugby only start when you came back to England?

SS: No, because when I left Kenya, I only had about six months in England before the family moved out to Spain. So it meant that a lot of my sport was soccer, basketball, swimming, tennis – a lot of summer sports. I knew nothing about rugby, apart from during Five Nations games, when my dad would scream across the drive at our next-door neighbours, who were Welsh! I never really watched any games, and I didn’t come across a rugby ball until I came to the U.K., when I was about fifteen, sixteen. Then I played a bit of rugby at school – nothing terribly serious, though. It wasn’t until I went to Godalming Sixth Form College that I really took it up. I tried out for the soccer team and the rugby team. The soccer coach said: “You’re a gifted player, but we feel that your future’s probably in a different game!” (laughing). So I was sent over to the rugby field, where I really started to play seriously.

BB: And presumably, they took one look at you and said:”Second row for you, mate”.

SS: Well, they didn’t, actually. There was nobody of equal stature, so I ended up playing at number eight, and I just found it incredibly easy! If you ask my parents, they’ll tell you that it’s always been the trend for me to save my concentration for the things I found easiest. So I went full steam ahead with it then, and got into England under-18s in my first year. I was probably sixteen. The following year, I got spotted by a Kiwi coach, who was the brother-in-law of one of my teachers. He offered a sort of scholarship type deal to go to New Zealand and play. Very similar to the sort of thing Martin Johnson did. To be honest, I couldn’t wait to get away from home (laughing), so I grasped it with both hands, and I had a whale of a time.

BB: So when did Bristol snap you up? You started playing for them when you were still pretty young, didn’t you?

SS: Yes, I was eighteen. When I came back from New Zealand – 1992, I think it was – I’d played the whole season there, so I was too late for university entrance. I was going through the clearing system and I remembered one of the school’s coaches had told me that I shouldn’t be afraid to get in touch, if I was having trouble getting a place. So one of the things that came up was the chance to go to Bristol. At the time, I fancied doing art, and Bristol had a pretty good art school, so the intention was to go there and do that. But then, the focus became more about the rugby than university and what degree I’d be doing – so I ended up doing a pretty boring degree, just to play rugby, really. So I didn’t play any rugby at university, I just played at the Bristol club.

BB: From what I’ve read about it, it sounds like it was a fun time and a fun team to play in.

SS: Yes. Obviously, it was still amateur, and I was at uni, which – as everyone knows – was always a lot of fun, anyway. But I did perhaps concentrate a bit too much on the rugby in the first couple of years and didn’t really have too much of a university life. But amateur rugby in those days involved a fair amount of beer-swilling and having a good craic anyway, so I did have a great time. Then, the game went professional in the year I finished at university, so it was a bit of a no-brainer at that point, to just give it a go.

I think the opinion back then was that professional rugby probably wouldn’t last – given the numbers that were attending in those days. So everyone thought; “Sod it. We’ll do it for a couple of years and see how we get on!” The set-up was still pretty amateur, but we were getting paid, so it was the best of both worlds, really (chuckling).

BB: A lot of people who remember the amateur era are often heard saying: “Modern players don’t have as much fun as we used to!”. Do you have as much fun now, or is it just a different sort of fun?

SS: I think, especially here at Wasps, we’ve tried to maintain a balance between having fun and also aiming for success on the pitch. It was probably the main reason why I came here from Bristol. At that stage, Bristol were having a few financial problems and they didn’t strike me as being particularly ambitious, in terms of where they were going and what they were looking to achieve, honours-wise. I’d had a lot of fun, but I really wanted to couple that with winning something. Wasps struck me as being a club with a good bunch of guys, and they’d won the Courage League in 1996/7, so I joined that summer.

I knew a lot of the guys from playing representative rugby for London. Even though I was playing down in Bristol, I represented London, so I was coming to Sudbury to train twice a week anyway, with Rob Smith. He kept on badgering me about joining Wasps. I knew several of the players – Peter Scrivener, Jonny Ufton, Laurence Scrase, so it was another no-brainer, really.

BB: Can you remember your first game, a Heineken Cup tie in Swansea? We won 31-25, with a certain Mr. Logan scoring a late try to make the game safe.

SS: Yes, I do! I think I came off the bench. After the Lions tour (of South Africa), I’d caught a bit of a virus. I came back and was pretty ill for the start of the season, so it took me a while to get into it. But I think I came off the bench and re-acquainted myself with Scott Gibbs (grins) with a pretty good tackle, and I think we might have scored from it, so I felt pretty good about myself!

BB: There have been a lot of highs since then. I imagine winning the Heineken Cup must be up at the very top.

SS: Yes. Like I said, I came to Wasps to win things, and the first season was a bit dire. I remember we got thrashed by Saracens in the Cup Final, but we made up for that in the next couple of years, against Newcastle and Northampton. That was my first taste of success at club level. Although a lot of the success in recent years has possibly been more important than those cup wins, I do look back on those early years at Wasps with really fond memories. A lot of guys of my age group were playing then – obviously, there aren’t so many now! In those years, Will Green, Peter Scrivener, Kenny Logan were all really good mates. They’ve all left. Also, I was still single then (chuckles and smiles wistfully)! In terms of the mix of off-the-pitch fun, drinks and socialising, coupled with the successes on the pitch – that was probably my golden time. But obviously, the Heineken Cup and Premiership double was a big highlight.

BB: Most seasoned observers of the game think it’s ridiculous that you’ve only won 34 caps for England. Are you okay with that now, or are there times when you think “Hey, I should have had more than that!”?

SS: I always think that. People in the press use a lot of excuses, like:”He’s been injured at the wrong time.” or that I was too heavy to lift. Given that I’ve been in the game for such a long time, at the top level, I don’t see either of those as valid excuses, really. I’ve played more Premiership games than most people, so I certainly haven't had an injury-blighted career. It’s just a case that the guys in charge at the top simply didn’t fancy me as a player. Had Jack Rowell stuck around a bit longer, it would probably have been different. Likewise with John Mitchell. But it wasn’t the case - other people have come in, and they’ve had every right to make their decisions and choose who they think’s right.

BB: Is it true that you gave your World Cup winner’s medal away – or is that just an urban myth?

SS: Urban myth! It’s just not on display, but nor are any of my medals or honours. I’d rather regard it as a good memory than have it permanently displayed in a cabinet.

BB: Inevitably, you have to start looking at another career. Presumably, you had a different career in mind when you started playing, as the game was still amateur. Do you have clear plans for the time when you do eventually hang up those giant boots?

SS: I’ve always had a passion for property. Even when I was a kid, I used to look through the Property Sections of the newspapers, when there was clearly no way I could afford anything. I used to love Monopoly! The whole renovation and development area is something which really interests me, so that’s probably where I’ll end up. Who I’ll be working for, or whether I’ll be working for myself, I don’t know – but I’ve got a couple of years left playing, hopefully.

BB: Let’s talk about your Benefit Year, and the charities you’ve chosen to support.

SS: Yes, they’re SPARKS (Sport aiding medical research for kids) and the NSPCC. They were obvious choices when you look at the work they do – although I suppose you can say that about any charity.

In the case of SPARKS, when I first came to London, I did bits and bobs for them – golf days, clay pigeon shooting, things like that. The staff, and everyone involved with SPARKS – they’re all just incredible people. I just really warmed to that charity, particularly because – and I know this sounds bad – they make everything so easy, to get involved and to participate. A lot of people think we have a lot of time on our hands to do what we want to do, but that’s really not the case. Time off the pitch is pretty precious. I’m a family man, with three kids now, so my time constraints are pretty tight. Being involved in SPARKS, with them working the way they do, allows me to try and help out as much as possible Anything I can do for them, I will try to do.

As for the NSPCC, we got involved with them at England level for a couple of seasons. I think the commitment, at that stage, was for a longer term than two years, but it’s rather dwindled - obviously, performances and the need for greater concentration on rugby than on charity are behind that. But I think there’s always time to be allocated. Even if you’re not performing, there’s always time for a bit of charity, so that’s why I’ve included them.