Bath
Get Up and Go Again...
By Devonport Boy
January 24 2024
….It’s a familiar coaching mantra and rugby players of all levels will have had it drummed into them as a fundamental basic of the game from an early age. Some things don’t change and after the heroic effort in Toulouse, the boys in BB&W have to face up to another big challenge at Ashton Gate in the final game of this block of the Premiership prior to the start of the 6 Nations.
Having played on Friday evening at Connacht, Bristol were always going to have more time to recover and prepare than Bath following our Sunday afternoon game at the Stade Ernest-Wallon. We could also have done without Storm Isha intervening; a cancelled flight on Sunday meant that the boys didn’t fly back until Monday which really compresses the preparation timescale for what is always a difficult away fixture at Ashton Gate.
So now we know; after an inspiring performance at Toulouse, arguably the best team in the competition right now, it’ll be Sandy Park in the round of 16. Leaving aside for now the discussion about the idiosyncrasies of the format which might see us playing Toulouse or Racing 92 again, let’s take a moment to recognise what we’ve achieved. OK not getting the home game in the next round is a bit disappointing but we should be well pleased with what we’ve achieved, especially in the context of recent seasons. Three bonus point wins and matching Toulouse for most of the game at their seemingly impregnable home fortress are incredible achievements. Those of us of a certain age are beginning to get the strangest feeling of déjà vu!
The players have told us that the mindset has changed from hoping to win to expectation that we will, and that’s infectious. There’s no doubt that with the players that we have and the ones who are due to return, we have the capability of going further in this competition. At the very least, the pool stage of the competition has shown the top clubs in Europe what the Premiership teams have known for some time – Bath are back!
The away game at Bristol hasn’t been the happiest one for us in recent seasons. It was the season opener for a few years during the time when Bristol Bears were able to showcase some world class talent and were playing a brand of fluent attacking rugby that we, and others, found difficult to compete with. No disrespect at all to Bristol or Pat Lam but they haven’t quite managed to find that sort of form consistently over the last couple of seasons. That said, they will always lift their game against Bath and a packed Ashton Gate will give them an extra boost. Yes, our Premiership form in both attack and defence has been very impressive and we deserve our position in the table, but success always has a downside, and we will go into Saturday’s game missing a number of key players who have rightly won call ups to their National squads. Bristol won’t be affected to anything like the same extent.
Throughout the season, JvG has implemented a squad rotation policy, giving match experience to as many players as possible, and there is plenty left in the tank at Farleigh – or so I thought before Steve Borthwick sent for Max Ojomoh and Will Muir! It will now inevitably be a significantly rotated squad, especially if the Scottish contingent aren’t available, but such is our strength in depth that we will still field a competitive team. Bristol will be smarting from last weekend’s result against Connacht and would dearly love to give their supporters a win against their nearest but not necessarily dearest!
It’s too early in the week for me to try to predict the team, but whoever goes to Ashton Gate will be buoyed up by the Champions Cup run and will be expecting to win. It’ll be close but the boys who play will want to step up and send their national squad teammates off to the 6 Nations with a win. I think they’ll deliver.
COYB
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Discussion started by Comeonmylovers.co.uk (IP Logged), 24/01/2024 10:08
24/01/2024 10:08
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Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2024:02:14:11:48:20 by CoochieCoo.
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Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2024:02:14:11:48:20 by CoochieCoo.
Good read !
Have to agree with the mentality change, could see players and players posted that were genuinely disappointed to not only not come away with anything but beat a full strength bar a few Toulouse side at home
If that doesn’t say enough about where we’ve come from.
Have to agree with the mentality change, could see players and players posted that were genuinely disappointed to not only not come away with anything but beat a full strength bar a few Toulouse side at home
If that doesn’t say enough about where we’ve come from.
Do we know if the Scottish lads are definitely unavailable?
They are currently with Scotland. (See link below). But presume being Scottish playing in England they have to report back to their club for this weekends fixtures. Bad enough missing Barberry and the now many (7) England lads, never mind the three Scottish boys.
Is there a limit where Bath can say “the international teams have pillaged us so much we don’t have a team”?
[x.com]
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:24:10:22:46 by ChippenhamRoman.
They are currently with Scotland. (See link below). But presume being Scottish playing in England they have to report back to their club for this weekends fixtures. Bad enough missing Barberry and the now many (7) England lads, never mind the three Scottish boys.
Is there a limit where Bath can say “the international teams have pillaged us so much we don’t have a team”?
[x.com]
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:24:10:22:46 by ChippenhamRoman.
Scotland boys will be available but no English lads.
Team picks itself bar a few selections
What I would go for
1. Schoeman
2. Annett
3. TDT
4. Ewels
5. Stooke
6. GJ Van Velze
7. Bayliss
8. Reid
9. TCS
10. Russell
11. Mcconochie
12. Butt
13. Redpath
14. Cokansiga
15. TDG
16. Dunn
17. Cordwell
18. Griffin
19. Roux
20. Richards
21. Schreuder
22. Bailey
23. Harris
Backline is where the most debate is or tough selections. Wingers and fullback could be any of the combos could have TDG on the wing or Gallagher possibly even Harris at 15
Team picks itself bar a few selections
What I would go for
1. Schoeman
2. Annett
3. TDT
4. Ewels
5. Stooke
6. GJ Van Velze
7. Bayliss
8. Reid
9. TCS
10. Russell
11. Mcconochie
12. Butt
13. Redpath
14. Cokansiga
15. TDG
16. Dunn
17. Cordwell
18. Griffin
19. Roux
20. Richards
21. Schreuder
22. Bailey
23. Harris
Backline is where the most debate is or tough selections. Wingers and fullback could be any of the combos could have TDG on the wing or Gallagher possibly even Harris at 15
Coetzee definitely out HK890?
Dropped cloete from the 23? I like your back 5 selections tbf.
No chance of underhill or mojo/muir being released back? Is underhill fit now?
Dropped cloete from the 23? I like your back 5 selections tbf.
No chance of underhill or mojo/muir being released back? Is underhill fit now?
I would definitely opt for Gallagher in the starting XV-his kicking could be essential.
Cloete is a JvG favourite and his jackalling could be a significant part of the plan.
Jonker may secure a place too- probably at expense of Cordwell, unless JvG wants to take a gamble on Summerfield.
Otherwise I agree with HK890 that the 23 virtually picks itself.
Lack of preparation for the Scots lads does not help, which is another reason I think to employ Gallagher who has played more recently than McConnochie.
PG
Cloete is a JvG favourite and his jackalling could be a significant part of the plan.
Jonker may secure a place too- probably at expense of Cordwell, unless JvG wants to take a gamble on Summerfield.
Otherwise I agree with HK890 that the 23 virtually picks itself.
Lack of preparation for the Scots lads does not help, which is another reason I think to employ Gallagher who has played more recently than McConnochie.
PG
Apparently we've not won at Ashton Gate for 7 years. Would love to break that stat and even with the absentees that is a very decent 23. Much stronger than many we put out in the dark days 2/3 years ago
A win is very possible against a Briz side that are really struggling to find consistency. I reckon the first quarter will be crucial. They will come out flying. We will need to contain that, get back to low error, zero pen and then start to impose our game
A win is very possible against a Briz side that are really struggling to find consistency. I reckon the first quarter will be crucial. They will come out flying. We will need to contain that, get back to low error, zero pen and then start to impose our game
Thought provoking report.....hard to write Devonport Boy with so many unknowns and variables.
Always a tough match as the stats above evidence.
Lets hope it is not a case of "after the Lord Mayor's Show"!!!
Always a tough match as the stats above evidence.
Lets hope it is not a case of "after the Lord Mayor's Show"!!!
Personally would go for + 6/2 split on bench - Maybe Bayliss or Reid or both need a bench rest given their exertions in Toulouse - couple Bayliss travelling on top of that.
1. Schoeman
2. Dunn (His passion for a Derby just makes him a nail on for me)
3. Du Toit
4. Stooke
5. Ewels
6. GJ VV
7. Underhill (if fit - he needs desperately needs game time in the same way as Genge)/Cloete
8. Coetzee (Have not seen his name on the injured list)/Reid/Bayliss
9. TCS
10. Russell
11. TDG
12. Redpath
13. Butt
14. Joe C
15. Gallagher
16. Annett
17. Cordwell
18. Griffin
19. Roux
20. Bayliss/Richards
21 Reid/Bayliss
22. Schreuder
23. Bailey
1. Schoeman
2. Dunn (His passion for a Derby just makes him a nail on for me)
3. Du Toit
4. Stooke
5. Ewels
6. GJ VV
7. Underhill (if fit - he needs desperately needs game time in the same way as Genge)/Cloete
8. Coetzee (Have not seen his name on the injured list)/Reid/Bayliss
9. TCS
10. Russell
11. TDG
12. Redpath
13. Butt
14. Joe C
15. Gallagher
16. Annett
17. Cordwell
18. Griffin
19. Roux
20. Bayliss/Richards
21 Reid/Bayliss
22. Schreuder
23. Bailey
Mentally, both camps are in different places. Bristol, who were awful in Connacht and it showed in the players body language, must have spent Saturday and Sunday lamenting their inability to even drop into the Challenge Cup whilst watching other English clubs prosper. Bath in comparison potentially could have ended up as number 1 seed, it wasn't to be but they and the numerous Bath fans who went to Toulouse can be proud of their effort, demonstrating Bath can mix it with the best. Both clubs disappointed but on totally different anguish levels. 1-0 to Bath at the weekend. JVG appears to be a respected D o R whilst the jury is out on Pat Lam, bound to be affecting some players, that's 2-0 to Bath. Bath being poached and messed around by England, delayed flight home and shortened turnaround seriously affecting team selection and preparation, that's 2-1 to Bath. Both camps will have a lot to prove, Bristol surely will be highly motivated to redeem themselves particularly over their closest rivals. Bath will have squad players desperate to prove themselves but if Bristol click we are now at 2-2. It makes for a fascinating match up and with a sell out home advantage that, for me, tips it in Bristol's favour 3-2. I hope JVG goes with his strongest starting 15 and Bath manage to gain an early advantage, if that happens the mental confidence of the Bristol players could disintegrate. I hope Cloete starts with the proviso he manages his emotions and Gallagher a must for me with TDG and Joe on the wings. I'm sensing Bath can edge it but a losing bonus point wouldn't be a disaster.
Depending on availability I would go:
Tdg
Coko
Butt
Cam
Rmc
Finn
TCS
Schoeman
Dunn
Tdt
Stooke
Ewels
Gj vv
Underhill?
Reid
Bench: annett, cordwell, griffin, roux, bayliss, coetzee, schreuder, bailey
If mojo/muir get released back I would put them in the xv.
Can't decide if better to switch tdt across and have both jonker and griffin in 23 rather than cordwell.
Nice to bring in to the 23 dunn, gj vv, underhill, coetzee, TCS, rmc, butt and tdg all fresh.
If anyone out in back 5 of scrum always happy to see richards be selected.
Tdg
Coko
Butt
Cam
Rmc
Finn
TCS
Schoeman
Dunn
Tdt
Stooke
Ewels
Gj vv
Underhill?
Reid
Bench: annett, cordwell, griffin, roux, bayliss, coetzee, schreuder, bailey
If mojo/muir get released back I would put them in the xv.
Can't decide if better to switch tdt across and have both jonker and griffin in 23 rather than cordwell.
Nice to bring in to the 23 dunn, gj vv, underhill, coetzee, TCS, rmc, butt and tdg all fresh.
If anyone out in back 5 of scrum always happy to see richards be selected.
Quote:charlieboa
Coetzee definitely out HK890?
Dropped cloete from the 23? I like your back 5 selections tbf.
No chance of underhill or mojo/muir being released back? Is underhill fit now?
Completely forgot Coetzee was available- transfer rumours muddling with my head
He definitely starts with Reid at 7 then
6. GJ
7. Reid
8. Coetzee
19. Richards
20. Bayliss
Yep for me Cloete just doesn’t bring enough and gives away so many pens for not much return. Never been the biggest fan came with a lot of hope and hasn’t lived up imo.
England wise I don’t think so they’re in Spain currently and with game on Saturday can’t see them coming back. Underhill now fit yes.
Thanks hk890.
Any idea when they travel back from Spain?
I am really hoping that genge doesn't get released back whilst all 7 of ours get retained.
Any idea when they travel back from Spain?
I am really hoping that genge doesn't get released back whilst all 7 of ours get retained.
Quote:charlieboa
Depending on availability I would go:
Can't decide if better to switch tdt across and have both jonker and griffin in 23 rather than cordwell.
If anyone out in back 5 of scrum always happy to see richards be selected.
Agree props are tough
TDT has the fitness to last 70 minutes or so, so I would be tempted to go
1. Schoeman
3. TDT
17. Cordwell
18. Griffin
Then take Schoeman off at 50/60 - Move TDT to Tighthead with Griffin at 3
Then if TDT needs to come off in the last 10 we won’t notice it too much
Bristol’s scrum is nothing special however Thacker still out atm.
Likely to be Woolmore Oghre Sinckler
Don’t like to hedge bets but it should be a good way to get into the game.
Coetzee went off with a shoulder injury against Glaws. No idea if he'll be back.
I thought Cloete played well enough against Toulouse, but yeah I'd probably have GJ and Bayliss ahead of him.
I thought Cloete played well enough against Toulouse, but yeah I'd probably have GJ and Bayliss ahead of him.
Pretty sure they're spending a week in Spain - I don't think anyone's back.
ETA: From the Indy
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:24:13:26:09 by hasta.
ETA: From the Indy
Quote:The draw has been kind to England, a trip to Italy and home game against Wales about as favourable an opening itinerary as this demanding championship offers. England will remain on the continent ahead of their opener, jetting straight across over Corsica and in to the Italian capital to name their opening round team next Thursday.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:24:13:26:09 by hasta.
I think the Genge rumour came from his own mouth when he commented on the progress he was making with his injury and how he hoped to be fit for the Bath game. I expect he hadn't taken into account how this clashed with England, so I'm betting that he's not available, nor are any of our lot. Which is tough! Especially with Mojo and Muir holding tackle bags (although delighted for them!).
Thank goodness our injury list stands at... 1. T Hill! (might be 2 now with Lawrence crocked). If we had c10 injured + 7 with Eng then I'd be writing this one off. But our squad has performed well this year.
Interestingly this is the squad that lost narrowly to a 74th-minute pen away at Sale in November:
De Glanville; McConnochie, Ojomoh, Butt, Gallagher; Russell, Schreuder; Du Toit, Annett, Jonker; McNally, Van Velze, Richards, Cloete, Coetzee.
Replacements: Dunn, Schoeman, Griffin, Lee-Warner, Merigan, Spencer, Bailey, Redpath.
We can field that squad again, minus only Mojo, L-W and Spencer but including Roux, Ewels, JCok, Stooke, Reid, Bayliss and I'd imagine some others I'm not thinking of. Bristol away should be an easier game than Sale away. So, despite the call ups, I've got a feeling we might sneak a significant win.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Thank goodness our injury list stands at... 1. T Hill! (might be 2 now with Lawrence crocked). If we had c10 injured + 7 with Eng then I'd be writing this one off. But our squad has performed well this year.
Interestingly this is the squad that lost narrowly to a 74th-minute pen away at Sale in November:
De Glanville; McConnochie, Ojomoh, Butt, Gallagher; Russell, Schreuder; Du Toit, Annett, Jonker; McNally, Van Velze, Richards, Cloete, Coetzee.
Replacements: Dunn, Schoeman, Griffin, Lee-Warner, Merigan, Spencer, Bailey, Redpath.
We can field that squad again, minus only Mojo, L-W and Spencer but including Roux, Ewels, JCok, Stooke, Reid, Bayliss and I'd imagine some others I'm not thinking of. Bristol away should be an easier game than Sale away. So, despite the call ups, I've got a feeling we might sneak a significant win.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Quote:charlieboa
Thanks hk890.
Any idea when they travel back from Spain?
I am really hoping that genge doesn't get released back whilst all 7 of ours get retained.
Travel from camp to camp so would be very surprised to see Genge back. If he was allowed to play it would throw up a load of questions about other players. Underhill and George notably who haven’t played for a while.
No Randall for bears aswell which makes the 9 battle a little less one sided. Bristol fan expecting this team apparently
1. Woolmore
2. Oghre
3. Sinckler
4. Batley
5. Caufield
6. Luatua
7. Harding
8. Bradbury
9. Marmion
10. AJ
11. Ibitoye
12. BJVR
13. Vakatawa
14. Ravouvou
15. Malins
Don't mind those match ups assuming tdt is OK.
They have the edge at centre I would say with mojo and lawrence out.
They have the edge at centre I would say with mojo and lawrence out.
I hadn't seen that Caulfield red was rescinded actually. Nigel Owens doesn't think much of that decision! Lets hope he watches where he puts his feet at the weekend.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Both Underhill and Genge are in the camp. I’d be surprised if they travelled back. Especially after comments made by Borthwick talking up the importance of having 2 weeks with the players.
I’d also like to see a 6:2 split. Same starting back 5 as last week with GJVV and hopefully Coetzee coming off the bench, along without whoever isn’t starting out of Roux or Stooke.
It’s been highlighted how Bristol tend to drop off as the game goes on, partly fitness but also the step down in quality of their replacements. Might be worth loading the bench and go after them in the second half, TDT coming on at 50 minutes is a scary prospect.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:25:13:51:08 by by.
It’s been highlighted how Bristol tend to drop off as the game goes on, partly fitness but also the step down in quality of their replacements. Might be worth loading the bench and go after them in the second half, TDT coming on at 50 minutes is a scary prospect.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:25:13:51:08 by by.
It had to happen at some time this season -
Official for the match - Ian Tempest
Not been good to us in the past but like the Ashton Gate voodoo it has to end at some point.
Official for the match - Ian Tempest
Not been good to us in the past but like the Ashton Gate voodoo it has to end at some point.
So which player is going to be the one with the microphone then? Player in Bristol Bath game to be miked up.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Quote:hasta
...It's gonna be Finn isn't it
Bristol player.
Wont this be rather dangerous having to wear some form of battery pack too? Not sure what it will add to the occasion!
They have a GPS tracker between their shoulder blades, so could probably have a small battery pack in the same place.
Not sure what the benefit of it will be other than apologies for the bad language comments on commentary!
Can't believe someone suggested it would be Finn or does he play for Bristol now??
I would suggest as has been on Bristol site Max Lahiff - he has the type of personality which TV would find pleasing.
I didn't see that it would be a Bristol player. If TNT are gonna mic one player in that game, they would pick Finn.
Quote:Ali1969
I would suggest as has been on Bristol site Max Lahiff - he has the type of personality which TV would find pleasing.
….and he’s mostly on the bench! 😉
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:25:19:59:38 by CoochieCoo.
Ridiculous innovation.
It's annoying enough when the commentators talk over the ref, or apologise for the language through the ref's mic.
I don't see what it can add, and I don't want any of the players thinking about anything other than the game they're in.
Bah humbug.
Get off my lawn.
Has anyone seen my glasses?
A man who cannot change his mind, cannot change anything
RAEBURN SHIELD
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:25:21:56:30 by Quel Carreleur.
It's annoying enough when the commentators talk over the ref, or apologise for the language through the ref's mic.
I don't see what it can add, and I don't want any of the players thinking about anything other than the game they're in.
Bah humbug.
Get off my lawn.
Has anyone seen my glasses?
RAEBURN SHIELD
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:25:21:56:30 by Quel Carreleur.
To clarify, we won’t hear anything live from the player’s mic, they’ll play clips at half time/breaks in play.
Quote:Quel Carreleur
Bah humbug.
Get off my lawn.
Has anyone seen my glasses?
Exactly, default position of some people on this board = NO! ITS RUINING THE GAME etc. blah.
I saw a rugby league game years ago where they had something similar (Ashton Sims I think), it was interesting but be prepared to wince every time there is contact, its brutal. Anything which potentially adds to the spectacle is good for me. Even better if they can add it as an option as they have done with other interactive tools so you can pick and choose. This gives the option for some on this board to jump into a patch of thistles and watch it in silence.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
It is not new cricket has been doing it for years - for me personally I think it is a good thing to listen to the perspective of someone actually in the game - their view will often be different to the view of commentators & spectators.
An example will be up front - they will know pretty much straight away whether they have dominance over the opposition - way before it shows - also how the official's interpretation is actually affecting their game. You have a choice at the end of the day - if you don't want to listen to it - "mute" it or do something else.
An example will be up front - they will know pretty much straight away whether they have dominance over the opposition - way before it shows - also how the official's interpretation is actually affecting their game. You have a choice at the end of the day - if you don't want to listen to it - "mute" it or do something else.
Reckon there’s going to be an awful lot of apologies for swearing picked up on the player mic
Quote:OutsideBath
Reckon there’s going to be an awful lot of apologies for swearing picked up on the player mic
It’s not going to be broadcast live OB they’ll review & plays some clips in breaks of play. Pat Lam said he’s got 3 players lined up who don’t swear as much as others 😂
Widcombe Garçon
Quote:Widcombe boyQuote:OutsideBath
Reckon there’s going to be an awful lot of apologies for swearing picked up on the player mic
It’s not going to be broadcast live OB they’ll review & plays some clips in breaks of play. Pat Lam said he’s got 3 players lined up who don’t swear as much as others 😂
Going to be very short clips… 🤣
Charlie Ewels has been called up to England replacing the ill Nick Isiekwe
Means he will not be available this weekend
Means he will not be available this weekend
Quote:HK890
Charlie Ewels has been called up to England replacing the ill Nick Isiekwe
Means he will not be available this weekend
Definitely or will he join up with them next week?
This is getting really very daft and not helping relations with clubs no doubt....
This is getting quite frankly ridiculous now. I appreciate it is only one game that overlaps, which is better than in previous seasons for all involved, but we're going to be hugely disadvantaged now in a massively important match. You can see why certain clubs (ours included) like importing South Africans. Madness having anyone who might get anywhere near the England squad on your books.
Oh, but congratulations to Charlie. 100% deserved.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Oh, but congratulations to Charlie. 100% deserved.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Does focus on how ridiculous dropping squad numbers would be however!
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
More dropped points this weekend then. After this, 6 games left. If we miss out on the play offs because of a point the decision to abandon the Tigers game is going to look really stupid.
Quote:bathonian80
More dropped points this weekend then. After this, 6 games left. If we miss out on the play offs because of a point the decision to abandon the Tigers game is going to look really stupid.
Yeah we should just forfeit don’t you reckon? Borthwick obviously doing this intentionally because he found out Bath fans are still upset over something to do with programme notes from a couple of years ago
Quote:charlieboaQuote:HK890
Charlie Ewels has been called up to England replacing the ill Nick Isiekwe
Means he will not be available this weekend
Definitely or will he join up with them next week?
This is getting really very daft and not helping relations with clubs no doubt....
Definitely Isiekwe has left camp with illness so Ewels immediately takes his place. Bath will have been aware of this during the week I’m sure.
Not sure this is the reason to start throwing the toys out the pram like some have shown.
4. Stooke
5. Roux
19. Richards
Is still more than good enough and I still think we should be winning this game. Plainly put Russell starts this game so that in itself gives us a shot at winning.
We still have decent options , it's just very unfortunate we are now missing 8 and bris are missing 1.
It doesn't feel completely illogical to feel a bit peaved about that when the league is incredibly tight and this could completely skew the result in a key game (every game is key now cos its so tight in the race for top 4)
It doesn't feel completely illogical to feel a bit peaved about that when the league is incredibly tight and this could completely skew the result in a key game (every game is key now cos its so tight in the race for top 4)
Quote:charlieboa
We still have decent options , it's just very unfortunate we are now missing 8 and bris are missing 1.
It doesn't feel completely illogical to feel a bit peaved about that when the league is incredibly tight and this could completely skew the result in a key game (every game is key now cos its so tight in the race for top 4)
Annoyed is fine. Some of the reactions have been pretty over the top. If I had a pound for every time I’ve seen the word ‘decimated’ this morning…
I’d also suggest that some of the rotation may pay off in a situation like this where players are coming in with more game time than they otherwise would have done.
Finally, yes it’s a derby but Bristol are a bit of a shambles at the moment and it’s not like we’re sending lambs to the slaughter tomorrow
Can't see us putting in a decent performance with so many out.
Love the 6 nations but the league should take a break whilst it's on.
Love the 6 nations but the league should take a break whilst it's on.
Bath Rugby: 1 Juan Schoeman, 2 Tom Dunn, 3 Thomas du Toit, 4 Elliott Stooke, 5 Quinn Roux, 6 GJ van Velze (c), 7 Miles Reid, 8 Jaco Coetzee, 9 Louis Schreuder, 10 Finn Russell, 11 Matt Gallagher, 12 Will Butt, 13 Cameron Redpath, 14 Joe Cokanasiga, 15 Tom de Glanville
Replacements: 16 Niall Annett, 17 Arthur Cordwell, 18 Archie Griffin, 19 Josh McNally, 20 Josh Bayliss, 21 Tom Carr-Smith, 22 Orlando Bailey, 23 Chris Cloete
No sign of Richards...
Replacements: 16 Niall Annett, 17 Arthur Cordwell, 18 Archie Griffin, 19 Josh McNally, 20 Josh Bayliss, 21 Tom Carr-Smith, 22 Orlando Bailey, 23 Chris Cloete
No sign of Richards...
And the Bears:
Bristol Bears: 1 Jake Woolmore, 2 Will Capon, 3 Kyle Sinckler, 4 James Dun, 5 Joe Batley, 6 Steven Luatua, 7 Fitz Harding (c), 8 Magnus Bradbury, 9 Harry Randall, 10 AJ McGinty, 11 Gabriel Ibitoye, 12 James Williams, 13 Benhard JV Rensburg, 14 Noah Heward, 15 Rich Lane
Replacements: 16 Fred Davies, 17 Sam Grahamslaw, 18 Max Lahiff, 19 Josh Caulfield, 20 Jake Heenan, 21 Kieran Marmion, 22 Virimi Vakatawa, 23 Siva Naulago
PG
Bristol Bears: 1 Jake Woolmore, 2 Will Capon, 3 Kyle Sinckler, 4 James Dun, 5 Joe Batley, 6 Steven Luatua, 7 Fitz Harding (c), 8 Magnus Bradbury, 9 Harry Randall, 10 AJ McGinty, 11 Gabriel Ibitoye, 12 James Williams, 13 Benhard JV Rensburg, 14 Noah Heward, 15 Rich Lane
Replacements: 16 Fred Davies, 17 Sam Grahamslaw, 18 Max Lahiff, 19 Josh Caulfield, 20 Jake Heenan, 21 Kieran Marmion, 22 Virimi Vakatawa, 23 Siva Naulago
PG
Top top team put out going circumstances bench is slightly weak yes but that is a very good team.
I still think we should be winning.
Schreduer and Gallagher on the wing are probably the only positions where I would say we look weak or a bit out of place.
Every other player has either played a big part in this season or looked very good when called upon.
Front row is very good and we should win that battle
Backrow is very good our form Backrow for lots of the season with Bayliss off the bench
Russell still there
Back 3 is exciting with the security of Gallagher
Redpath been sensational and you know what you’re getting with Butt
Should be a cracker but we are a much better drilled side then Bears
I still think we should be winning.
Schreduer and Gallagher on the wing are probably the only positions where I would say we look weak or a bit out of place.
Every other player has either played a big part in this season or looked very good when called upon.
Front row is very good and we should win that battle
Backrow is very good our form Backrow for lots of the season with Bayliss off the bench
Russell still there
Back 3 is exciting with the security of Gallagher
Redpath been sensational and you know what you’re getting with Butt
Should be a cracker but we are a much better drilled side then Bears
Sort of agree HK, about the bench but there should be several on there desperate to put in a good showing, having had little game time.
I don't just mean the young and promising- McNally has not had many games and of course Bayliss only recently back from injury- we know what he can do when on form.
A tough ask at Ashton Gate, but not insurmountable.
PG
I don't just mean the young and promising- McNally has not had many games and of course Bayliss only recently back from injury- we know what he can do when on form.
A tough ask at Ashton Gate, but not insurmountable.
PG
Amazing that, even with all those call ups, my one-eyed view is that a joint team would only have 2 or 3 Bris players in it (Randall, Luatua). I like Rensburg but wouldn't swap Cam R for him.
Skybet odds are still within a point, so all to play for. COYB!!
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Skybet odds are still within a point, so all to play for. COYB!!
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Quote:bathonian80
More dropped points this weekend then. After this, 6 games left. If we miss out on the play offs because of a point the decision to abandon the Tigers game is going to look really stupid.
wut?
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
An excellent 23 considering all the abstractions - Borthwick really testing our resolve excellent recognition for players who potentially should have been in the squad initially especially Charlie and Will as Borthwick keeps banging on about selecting players on form - but overlooked both.
See Bristol are trying to shore up the slump they have been experiencing recently in the final quarter by keeping some big hitters back on the bench. They have some big players missing as well no Genge (as expected) - no Malins is a shock and for Bath a positive.
Good to see Cordwell given a chance like the option of Cordwell and Griffin with the experience of Annett in the middle - hope Josh McNally has learnt his lessons in relation to stupid penalties especially with Mr Tempest officiating and his stupid defence lapses in his last outing.
It is a Derby form is somewhat irrelevant it comes down to aggression and drive and I am sure like all the other recent matches will be decided within 7 points - 2 points if you look at recent past.
See Bristol are trying to shore up the slump they have been experiencing recently in the final quarter by keeping some big hitters back on the bench. They have some big players missing as well no Genge (as expected) - no Malins is a shock and for Bath a positive.
Good to see Cordwell given a chance like the option of Cordwell and Griffin with the experience of Annett in the middle - hope Josh McNally has learnt his lessons in relation to stupid penalties especially with Mr Tempest officiating and his stupid defence lapses in his last outing.
It is a Derby form is somewhat irrelevant it comes down to aggression and drive and I am sure like all the other recent matches will be decided within 7 points - 2 points if you look at recent past.
It is remarkable how our vastly improved injury situation and the consistency of our performances this season from the squad means that despite our best being with England, that's still a very strong squad, with enough star power to get a win. A lot falls on Finn but if we get influential games out of the front row, Reid and Coetzee and Redpath, too, then we will be there or thereabouts.
I thought Randall was injured – glad he's alright but a shame as he was brilliant at The Rec in November and they'll be right up for it in front of a sell-out crowd. But so will Finn, I'm sure!
If we can get some scrum dominance and win +90% of our lineouts (easier said than done without a natural lineout caller. Will Stooke or GJVV do it?) then I'm confident (ish).
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
I thought Randall was injured – glad he's alright but a shame as he was brilliant at The Rec in November and they'll be right up for it in front of a sell-out crowd. But so will Finn, I'm sure!
If we can get some scrum dominance and win +90% of our lineouts (easier said than done without a natural lineout caller. Will Stooke or GJVV do it?) then I'm confident (ish).
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Quote:Ali1969
It had to happen at some time this season -
Official for the match - Ian Tempest
Not been good to us in the past but like the Ashton Gate voodoo it has to end at some point.
His errors in the corresponding fixture 3 years ago were acknowledged by his boss - so I would expect him to be on his guard this time.
PG
When you look at our(Bris) unavailable list, i would say we were worse off than you even with only 1 international call-up. That's 7 nailed-on 1st choice missing from a squad with nothing like your depth. Not jealous at all!
UNAVAILABLE: Ellis Genge, Yann Thomas, George Kloska, Harry Thacker, Gabriel Oghre, Chris Vui, Santiago Grondona, Callum Sheedy, Jack Bates, Max Malins.
UNAVAILABLE: Ellis Genge, Yann Thomas, George Kloska, Harry Thacker, Gabriel Oghre, Chris Vui, Santiago Grondona, Callum Sheedy, Jack Bates, Max Malins.
EverOptimistic - I totally agree you have a lot of quality players out any team would suffer missing those type of players especially Genge, Vui (always a thorn in our side), Sheedy (again always causes us issues) Thacker & Malins- however we have:
Ted Hill, Alfie Barbeary, Sam Underhill, Beno Obano, Will Stuart, Charlie Ewels, Ben Spencer (Club Captain), Will Muir, Ollie Lawrence, Max O + Scotland lads Finn, Cam and Josh have had very little time this week to prepare as they have been in Scotland.
I just hope it is a great game and I am sure all the players will be 100% committed and may the best team win.
Ted Hill, Alfie Barbeary, Sam Underhill, Beno Obano, Will Stuart, Charlie Ewels, Ben Spencer (Club Captain), Will Muir, Ollie Lawrence, Max O + Scotland lads Finn, Cam and Josh have had very little time this week to prepare as they have been in Scotland.
I just hope it is a great game and I am sure all the players will be 100% committed and may the best team win.
Is Vui injured? I agree he always seems to play brilliantly vs Bath as do Thacker and Dan Thomas...so glad to see all of those missing.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Amazingly decent 23 despite the volume of call ups.
Just don't have the normal bang off the bench up front which may be an issue.
I assuming richards is unavailable so I don't have to get frustrated he doesn't get the chance ahead of mcnally.
Feel like 2 well matched teams.
2 match points would be a good return given the circumstances- think it will be tight and we get 4 tries more often than not this season.
Just don't have the normal bang off the bench up front which may be an issue.
I assuming richards is unavailable so I don't have to get frustrated he doesn't get the chance ahead of mcnally.
Feel like 2 well matched teams.
2 match points would be a good return given the circumstances- think it will be tight and we get 4 tries more often than not this season.
Quote:BathMatt53
Is Vui injured? I agree he always seems to play brilliantly vs Bath as do Thacker and Dan Thomas...so glad to see all of those missing.
Vui went back home for family reasons in October. Thomas went for a HIA in the Connacht game, guess he must have failed. Thacker injured.
Amazingly strong team given the circumstances.
If I had it my way, I'd have Coetzee and Du Toit off the bench after 50/60mins. Possibly have gone with TCS over Schreuder too - especially given who the opposite 9 is (thought/hoped he was injured).
If I had it my way, I'd have Coetzee and Du Toit off the bench after 50/60mins. Possibly have gone with TCS over Schreuder too - especially given who the opposite 9 is (thought/hoped he was injured).
Yes, a good side, certainly not our best but a testament to our low injury count this season. I reckon we should go strong early, Bristol's fragile mentality would be tested again if we built a early lead.
Quote:9215
To clarify, we won’t hear anything live from the player’s mic, they’ll play clips at half time/breaks in play.
Shame, they should wire it up to the stadium PA system
Quote:charlieboa
Amazingly decent 23 despite the volume of call ups.
Just don't have the normal bang off the bench up front which may be an issue.
Bristol bench isn't that strong either. Naulago and Vakatawa are a worry, but I'd back our bench forwards over theirs so hopefully neither of them see much ball.
Gatland stated the he elected Archie Griffin on his viewing of his scrummaging so it will be good to see how it goes on Saturday.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Interesting stats on the importance of this weekend for the playoffs
Telegraph
Telegraph
Quote:P G TipsQuote:Ali1969
It had to happen at some time this season -
Official for the match - Ian Tempest
Not been good to us in the past but like the Ashton Gate voodoo it has to end at some point.
His errors in the corresponding fixture 3 years ago were acknowledged by his boss - so I would expect him to be on his guard this time.
PG
Different boss now though! Hope the current one holds them to account as effectively
Quote:charlieboa
We still have decent options , it's just very unfortunate we are now missing 8 and bris are missing 1.
It doesn't feel completely illogical to feel a bit peaved about that when the league is incredibly tight and this could completely skew the result in a key game (every game is key now cos its so tight in the race for top 4)
Surely if the PL was better organised this issue could have been avoided?
A much weakened Bath against a near full strength Bristol is wrong and devalues the entertainment value for fans.
Will not be surprising if clubs are reluctant to have England players in the squad going forward.
It begs the question on how hybrid contracts will work. When clubs are charging £70+ a ticket to watch a game, fans will rightly feel aggrieved when the star players are rested.
Its noticeable how much rotation Bath have done this season when comparing our team to the other affected by the England call ups - despite being one the heavily impacted squads most of the players in our 23 have had ample game time.
Quote:by
Its noticeable how much rotation Bath have done this season when comparing our team to the other affected by the England call ups - despite being one the heavily impacted squads most of the players in our 23 have had ample game time.
The rotation is usually at away games so home supporters are still getting to see all their favourites even if it is costing more.
Quote:Yes, because it's completely new and unprecedented, and hasn't been the case for the last 14 or so years since the first EPS agreement meant that the RFU pay the clubs for this extra week of access.OutsideBath
A much weakened Bath against a near full strength Bristol is wrong and devalues the entertainment value for fans.
Will not be surprising if clubs are reluctant to have England players in the squad going forward.
RAEBURN SHIELD
[quote)
The rotation is usually at away games so home supporters are still getting to see all their favourites even if it is costing more.
The rotation is usually at away games so home supporters are still getting to see all their favourites even if it is costing more.
Yes but I usually go to all the away games as well and although I was unable to go the Leicester away game I would have felt short changed with the selection had I gone. Knowing you are under strength due to injuries or international selection I can live with, but knowing your best players are having a weekend off is frustrating and is making me rethink my policy of going to away games. No criticism of JVG intended he is doing a damn good job.
Quote:OutsideBathQuote:charlieboa
We still have decent options , it's just very unfortunate we are now missing 8 and bris are missing 1.
It doesn't feel completely illogical to feel a bit peaved about that when the league is incredibly tight and this could completely skew the result in a key game (every game is key now cos its so tight in the race for top 4)
Surely if the PL was better organised this issue could have been avoided?
A much weakened Bath against a near full strength Bristol is wrong and devalues the entertainment value for fans.
Will not be surprising if clubs are reluctant to have England players in the squad going forward.
This season it is so much better than previous seasons. With only his game being affected by camps. And allowing a break for players to rest. I don’t think it devalues anything - we are still favourites for this game and I would argue have put out a better side.
There is a reason we have lots of players selected and they don’t. There is even more reason to have England players now when they will less games then previous and have their wages paid partly by the RFU
Quote:HK890
There is even more reason to have England players now when they will less games then previous and have their wages paid partly by the RFU
Isn't that only 25 players HK890? I can't see Bath having half a dozen on central contracts - only shoe-in for a central contract being Lawrence IMO.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Quote:BathMatt53Quote:HK890
There is even more reason to have England players now when they will less games then previous and have their wages paid partly by the RFU
Isn't that only 25 players HK890? I can't see Bath having half a dozen on central contracts - only shoe-in for a central contract being Lawrence IMO.
Yep only key core but I wound imagine that would include - Stuart/Underhill/Lawrence
I don’t see the disadvantage of having England internationals plus Obano/Spencer/Ojomoh/Muir were not before this year and they’ve got in from their good performances. So what are we meant to get rid of them because they’re playing well ?
The best teams will always have internationals go away - but what separates them is their depth.
BoD says it’s 15 seasons since Bath won in Bristol, is that correct? 
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Quote:Old Bath Tub
BoD says it’s 15 seasons since Bath won in Bristol, is that correct?
Quite a few of those seasons we wouldn’t have had the chance because we weren’t in the championship.
Finn Russell strolls out eating strawberry sours then drops the ball into Joes C's hands who brushes past 15 then Ibitoye for the try. Simples!
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Absolute wet wipe tacklling there
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Two Bristol tries in a few minutes, tackling?
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Quote:shipwrecked
Two Bristol tries in a few minutes, tackling?
Poor…
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Yellow for Coetzee, correct I reckon.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
We’re getting too narrow again which has been a bit of an issue across several games
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Bit like last week- seem to have come out of the changing rooms not quite on it, especially in defence. Still, right in the game, and hopefully like the last few weeks we’ll build and become more powerful as the game goes on.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Anyone spot Cockansiga at that break down in the corner? Crazy!
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Not loading breakdowns
Weak first up tackles
Getting sucked in and turning shoulders infield
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Weak first up tackles
Getting sucked in and turning shoulders infield
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Jesus we are really making an absolute mess of this game
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
What an absolute mess. Our brains are fried. Soft in defence and ridiculous discipline and decision making.
Without Spencer, we’ve got no one whipping us into gear.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Without Spencer, we’ve got no one whipping us into gear.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Down to 13! Schreuder DKO
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
This is becoming very hard to watch. Very reminiscent of the dark days of the last couple of seasons.
Absolute rubbish-we haven’t played this badly in months
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Quote:JK7
This is becoming very hard to watch. Very reminiscent of the dark days of the last couple of seasons.
Hardly surprising the match is being lost as we are forced to hand over so many players to England.
Pathetic. I know we’re missing a few and our week must’ve been extremely disjointed, but the 15 guys in the shirt just aren’t on it at the moment at all.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Quote:OutsideBathQuote:JK7
This is becoming very hard to watch. Very reminiscent of the dark days of the last couple of seasons.
Hardly surprising the match is being lost as we are forced to hand over so many players to England.
On the one hand yes, we'd be stronger with them, but on the other this 15/23 should be able to put in a much, much better performance than it has so far.
AH right - why are we kicking a 3 on 2?
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
With Coetzee on the field (ie in the breakdown), we look a much better team. Discipline is everything.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
It’s not sodding touch rugby for gods sake
Woeful
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Woeful
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Quote:JK7Quote:OutsideBathQuote:JK7
This is becoming very hard to watch. Very reminiscent of the dark days of the last couple of seasons.
Hardly surprising the match is being lost as we are forced to hand over so many players to England.
On the one hand yes, we'd be stronger with them, but on the other this 15/23 should be able to put in a much, much better performance than it has so far.
Simple solution in the future for me is to reduce the number of England players in the squad then this sort of thing won’t happen.
Yeh we do look knackered. Blown away. Suppose always a danger following Toulouse and lack of training this week.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Who is going to step up for Bath?
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Absolutely horrific.
Bristol playing the best they've played since they bottled that semi 3 years ago really isn't helping.
Bristol playing the best they've played since they bottled that semi 3 years ago really isn't helping.
Can we turn up for the second half……please ?
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Dunn…
Sorry he is just costing us too much possession
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Sorry he is just costing us too much possession
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Can’t remember last time we conceded 33 points in a half.
A try before half time would’ve helped massively but, oddly, I don’t think we’re out of it. We’ve been really poor but, for me, Randall has been the major difference between the sides.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
A try before half time would’ve helped massively but, oddly, I don’t think we’re out of it. We’ve been really poor but, for me, Randall has been the major difference between the sides.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Dunn and Reid look wrecked to be fair. Joe C slows into contact again, he's such a contradiction!
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
In certain positions there’s simply too much drop off fin quality with our back up players.
That said our midfield defence is utterly awful
Worst 40 minutes of the season and it’s not even close
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
That said our midfield defence is utterly awful
Worst 40 minutes of the season and it’s not even close
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Quote:P G TipsQuote:Ali1969
It had to happen at some time this season -
Official for the match - Ian Tempest
Not been good to us in the past but like the Ashton Gate voodoo it has to end at some point.
His errors in the corresponding fixture 3 years ago were acknowledged by his boss - so I would expect him to be on his guard this time.
PG
I take that back.
Twice penalised Coetzee for playing on when he was not held after a tackle.
Not to say that we are playing well - which we mostly are not!
PG
Quote:shipwrecked
Dunn and Reid look wrecked to be fair. Joe C slows into contact again, he's such a contradiction!
All things being equal, Annett should now be our starting hooker.
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Quote:Toast and Marmite
Not loading breakdowns
Weak first up tackles
Getting sucked in and turning shoulders infield
All of this.
Plus some really stupid and avoidable decisions being made. Coetzee getting pinged twice in five mins for trying to go again after being tackled and two completely avoidable yellow cards.
Going to have to be s heck of a half time talk if we're to come out swinging! (In a totally legal way of course)
Schreuder needs to do more in defence, Randall is all over him, Butt and Redpath should swap Redpath reads the game better.
TCS at 60.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
TCS at 60.
Perfect start to 2nd half.
I think there was only one scrum in the first half.
I think there was only one scrum in the first half.
Tearing my hair out at our weak first up tackling
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Anyone seen a ruck where Bristol HAVE stayed on their feet?!
Adopted Players: All of the little blighters!!!
Adopted Players: All of the little blighters!!!
Quote:Probably as many as we've actually challengedplong
Anyone seen a ruck where Bristol HAVE stayed on their feet?!
RAEBURN SHIELD
Defence coach must have exploded with frustration by now.
Utterly unacceptable
Utterly unacceptable
Pathetic defence. The number of tackles we’ve failed to complete is absolutely ridiculous. Worst we’ve been individually in years.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Dreadful, dreadful tackling. Straight through Schreuder.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Errr why is that not a yellow card for Bristol
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
So much for being difficult to beat, the defence is embarrassing and certain players don’t look like they want to be on the pitch.
Jesus we have to just look at Bristol wrong and get 2 yellows and he is only just warning them…
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
I know let's do exactly what didn't work last week. Over and over again.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Glad I’m not watching this as the score line is reminiscent of the dark days of Hooper.
I see we’re still trying the “try and burrow over from 3m out for 15 phases before getting held up” tactic.
I actually think Tempest has been pretty good.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
I actually think Tempest has been pretty good.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Oh look the f forwards get held up again…
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
So the one that's on the line is called short and the held up short is called held up over the line!
Tempest making all the big calls in Bristol's favour........ yet again in this fixture
Tempest making all the big calls in Bristol's favour........ yet again in this fixture
So Bristol om a final warning, give away another penalty 7 m out, but the yellow stays in the pocket?
Quote:put both hands out.Dorset Boy
And again. Ibbotoye deliberate knock on, no yellow.
Consistentency?
But how they are not down to 14 is a mystery
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Quote:Toast and MarmiteQuote:put both hands out.Dorset Boy
And again. Ibbotoye deliberate knock on, no yellow.
Consistentency?
But how they are not down to 14 is a mystery
With no hope of catching it
Great.
Watch Bristol run straight through us at the restart
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Watch Bristol run straight through us at the restart
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
That’s definitely a try isn’t it? What is going on with this ref team
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Rosie is having an absolute mare.
Clearly down. as was one earlier.
Failed to force the right call when Luitua was offside stopping try earlier.
Clearly down. as was one earlier.
Failed to force the right call when Luitua was offside stopping try earlier.
Quote:Dorset Boy
Rosie is having an absolute mare.
Clearly down. as was one earlier.
Failed to force the right call when Luitua was offside stopping try earlier.
Absolutely awful
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Rosie is about to put us right back in the game with a PT and a yellow card.
I’ll say it again… game on.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
I’ll say it again… game on.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Quote:dr.bath1865
Rosie is about to put us right back in the game with a PT and a yellow card.
I’ll say it again… game on.
This is insane
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Only we could make hard work of an exit against 13 men
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
That's a terrible call from Tempest - the ball was totally available, he was looking right at it!!! Still he penalises Stooke and buys Bristol points (or at least should have) and time off the cards.
Yeah sometimes you can be too relaxed Finn
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
What a mad game. I’ve never seen a 22 drop out bounce dead before!
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
That is a terrible terrible call
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Well that’s just utterly brain dead fro Russell
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Quote:wacky? Simply not good enough for a player of his qualityJK7
Oh, Finn. That's some wacky stuff.
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Regardless of entertainment level that I was a shocker
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Utterly bonkers game.
Did well to come back into it but some suicidal plays by us, and some shockingly poor calls from the officials, although outside the big calls they were pretty good.
Did well to come back into it but some suicidal plays by us, and some shockingly poor calls from the officials, although outside the big calls they were pretty good.
Quote:hasta
What a stupid game.
I need several drinks and a couple of hours before I can pick the bones out of that.
Defence - woeful
Decision making moronic
Ref team - out of their depth
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Ridiculous. Not sure title challengers should ever concede 57 points.
Despite missing our Eng internationals, it feels like a massive missed opportunity. We dominated the second half completely, but didn’t convert enough and allowed them to score at will. Hugely frustrating.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Despite missing our Eng internationals, it feels like a massive missed opportunity. We dominated the second half completely, but didn’t convert enough and allowed them to score at will. Hugely frustrating.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
What a silly game of rugby. And to be fair Bristol do silly better than most.
Think a break will do the whole squad some good. Schreuder’s break can be as long as he likes.
Think a break will do the whole squad some good. Schreuder’s break can be as long as he likes.
Quote:OutsideBath
Conceding 8 tries is embarrassing.
Yeah, regardless of anything else, that is the key stat.
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Quote:dr.bath1865
Ridiculous. Not sure title challengers should ever concede 57 points.
Are we really title challengers though?
First half defence was non-existant, just too slack at the breakdown gave Bristol super quick ball. Defence then struggles, but we missed a lot of tackles.
Really don't understand why we didn't get an earlier penalty try when Luitua prevented the score from the offside position - exactly the reasoning given for the subsequent PT.
It was said when we signed Finn that he would lose us a few games, but win us many more.
Also a game with only 3 or 4 scrums.
Really don't understand why we didn't get an earlier penalty try when Luitua prevented the score from the offside position - exactly the reasoning given for the subsequent PT.
It was said when we signed Finn that he would lose us a few games, but win us many more.
Also a game with only 3 or 4 scrums.
Quote:OutsideBathQuote:dr.bath1865
Ridiculous. Not sure title challengers should ever concede 57 points.
Are we really title challengers though?
Depends what team you select!
Quote:shipwreckedQuote:OutsideBathQuote:dr.bath1865
Ridiculous. Not sure title challengers should ever concede 57 points.
Are we really title challengers though?
Depends what team you select!
I don’t think any team we select wins away in a semifinal and with the games left top 2 seems unlikely. So not sure we are real challengers.
Either way though we are improving and the season has mostly been fun.
Quote:OutsideBathQuote:dr.bath1865
Ridiculous. Not sure title challengers should ever concede 57 points.
Are we really title challengers though?
At one stage I thought we might be & so did the pundits but no title challengers would concede 57 points to a team not in the best of form. I thought we might snatch at least 2 bonus points but we are far to loose. We have much harder matches to come. Top 4 will be a challenge let alone top 2
I imagine that could have been an entertaining game for a neutral, not for us though
That was as unlike a Bath performance as I have seen in 12 months more akin.to Hooper era.
Write this one off - Thanks Borthwick and Townsend we looked disjointed and a team who had not trained together all week against a desperate team.
Well played Bristol.
Write this one off - Thanks Borthwick and Townsend we looked disjointed and a team who had not trained together all week against a desperate team.
Well played Bristol.
Quite a few lessons learned I’d say. TCS is ahead of Schreuder, Alfie G is the real deal, we have to trust our reserve 10, Bailey or whoever, someone needs to look at what we do 5 m out, we have to tackle first time.
Biggest factor in the game though was the turnaround was too fast.
Bristol we’re giving away penalties by the bucket load and we still lost. We were a rugby charity today!
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Biggest factor in the game though was the turnaround was too fast.
Bristol we’re giving away penalties by the bucket load and we still lost. We were a rugby charity today!
TMO had a mare
If a deliberate knock on with cover by Bath = yellow what does one by Bristol =??
Why did it take 8 defensive penalties in a row for Bris card and just one for Bath?
Should have had at least one more pen try. For illegally collapsed maul. And another for just lying in front of the ball no attempt to tackle or catch the ball.
Having said that mid field defence was of the wet lettuce variety and I think TCS needs to get promoted to second choice.
If a deliberate knock on with cover by Bath = yellow what does one by Bristol =??
Why did it take 8 defensive penalties in a row for Bris card and just one for Bath?
Should have had at least one more pen try. For illegally collapsed maul. And another for just lying in front of the ball no attempt to tackle or catch the ball.
Having said that mid field defence was of the wet lettuce variety and I think TCS needs to get promoted to second choice.
Just so disappointed by that performance. The lack of tackling was woeful at times, reminded me more of a Barbarians or a charity game. Although the Finn kick was a head in hands moment , it comes as part of the whole package that will win us many matches.
To be honest thought Coetzee was brilliant today the head in head contact was caused by another tackler changing the direction of Bradbury. Incorrectly penalised twice when not held and leniency shown by Tempest towards Bears continual infringements was unbelievable at times - the Dunn tackle Luatua not only offside throughout but also around Dunns neck.
Well played Bristol though thought we were unusual today.
Well played Bristol though thought we were unusual today.
Frustrating, feels like we got the selection wrong and allowed Bristol quick ball for the first half that truly cost us.
Can’t believe how many penalties Bristol conceded before getting a card when each out ours were marginal for single offences.
Feels like 4 point lost.
Can’t believe how many penalties Bristol conceded before getting a card when each out ours were marginal for single offences.
Feels like 4 point lost.
Russell motm.........for bears
It was entertaining and let's be honest with a full strength team we would have walked it.
It was entertaining and let's be honest with a full strength team we would have walked it.
Frustrating loss, felt like everything stuck for Bristol today.
Short turnaround from Toulouse and added disruption of 3 late call ups to the England squad who would have most likely been down to play today, was evident.
Short turnaround from Toulouse and added disruption of 3 late call ups to the England squad who would have most likely been down to play today, was evident.
Quote:Bath Blues
Russell motm.........for bears
It was entertaining and let's be honest with a full strength team we would have walked it.
We’re not going to get close to winning anything if we collapse completely when we don’t have our first choice team available. When we saw the team most of us thought it looked quite strong enough to win this match, particularly bearing in mind the Bristol absentees. We can’t turn around after we get thumped & say the team was too weak, nor can we blame the TMO etc. Those are all just excuses.
Quote:TBH, I think that's the key.by
Short turnaround from Toulouse and added disruption of 3 late call ups to the England squad who would have most likely been down to play today, was evident.
We had 1 training session in the week, with Ewels in the row, Redpath at 12, Mojo at 13 and Muir on the wing; which can't have helped.
TBH, today was about fine margins, that change would have made a difference (as would a 22 drop not going too long, or the final kick pass, or a PT&Yellow for the maul foul, or this or that or the other...)
Must have been a ridiculously entertaining match for anyone without a vested interest in the result.
RAEBURN SHIELD
That 22 drop out going dead was a killer. We had great momentum, Bris had just missed a kick, we still had men advantage, we were upping the tempo, were back within a score and had a great opportunity to put them under pressure.
Then suddenly they have a scrum back on the 22, they get a dubious penalty which takes them clear and we're having to take a lot more chances. It was really unlucky.
Then suddenly they have a scrum back on the 22, they get a dubious penalty which takes them clear and we're having to take a lot more chances. It was really unlucky.
So, next game is a ‘must win’ to stay in the hunt for top six ! 
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Quote:hasta
That 22 drop out going dead was a killer. We had great momentum, Bris had just missed a kick, we still had men advantage, we were upping the tempo, were back within a score and had a great opportunity to put them under pressure.
Then suddenly they have a scrum back on the 22, they get a dubious penalty which takes them clear and we're having to take a lot more chances. It was really unlucky.
Unlucky is right there. There was plenty of space to play to and he had Bristol scambling until the bounce kicked it towards the line. That outcome is just so unlikely
Quote:OutsideBath
Simple solution in the future for me is to reduce the number of England players in the squad then this sort of thing won’t happen.
So how will that work?
Do you really think we would make the top 3rd of the table without Obano, Stuart, Ewels, Underhill, Spencer, Lawrence, Ojomoh & Muir?
Then look at the last 20 years of Premiership winners. Please tell me how having large numbers of England players on their books hampered the trophy winning ambitions of firstt Wasps, then Leicester, then Saracens - even Exeter?
PG
Cracking game for the neutral.
Feel for Russell. A very bad mistake but some players have an "always try and win" rather than "mitigate a loss" mindset and that's not necessarily a bad thing.
Looking forward to watching it again.
Feel for Russell. A very bad mistake but some players have an "always try and win" rather than "mitigate a loss" mindset and that's not necessarily a bad thing.
Looking forward to watching it again.
Quote:The gamble lost us a point but could have earned 3 so I’m fine with him trying it, wouldn’t have been happy with kicking it out to bank the lbpOldMarovian
Cracking game for the neutral.
Feel for Russell. A very bad mistake but some players have an "always try and win" rather than "mitigate a loss" mindset and that's not necessarily a bad thing.
Looking forward to watching it again.
Defence was shocking but we were really absent of anybody trying to slow the ball down, particularly in the first half. GJ and Reid unfortunately didn't influence much.
Seeing what looked like a good team on paper underperform in let phases had a certain retro feel.
Seeing what looked like a good team on paper underperform in let phases had a certain retro feel.
Just watched the game. I'm not really sure what I have just witnessed. Rugby as basketball, perhaps. We didn't seem to play especially badly but Briz just destroyed our defence for 30 minutes. Then when we actually concentrated, we destroyed theirs for 30 minutes, instead. And then, when we could have put the game away, we revert to making bad decisions. I don't mean Finn in this case - we pay him to make those calls and they're not always going to come off, but the set-up for the tapped penalties, for instance, looked positively amateurish. We can chalk it up to experience but, while we have that side to our game, we are not going to be champions of anything. On the upside, that win will keep Pat Lam in his job. On the downside, it might have cost us a top 4 place.
My MotM - Archie Griffin. Looked totally at home at this level.
A word for the ref. I thought Tempest was excellent. He got right everything is was possible to get right and his judgement calls (ie calls against us) were perfectly reasonable, if (by definition) wrong.
... IMHO, of course.
Now in Honolulu
My MotM - Archie Griffin. Looked totally at home at this level.
A word for the ref. I thought Tempest was excellent. He got right everything is was possible to get right and his judgement calls (ie calls against us) were perfectly reasonable, if (by definition) wrong.
... IMHO, of course.
Now in Honolulu
Quote:P G TipsQuote:OutsideBath
Simple solution in the future for me is to reduce the number of England players in the squad then this sort of thing won’t happen.
So how will that work?
Do you really think we would make the top 3rd of the table without Obano, Stuart, Ewels, Underhill, Spencer, Lawrence, Ojomoh & Muir?
PG
When their contracts are up replace them with Saffers who would be available nearly all the time and it could work.
Losing all our England players cost us the win today and possibly the chance of top 2.
I’m probably alone in this forum by not caring that much what England do, but really want to see a trophy winning Bath.
Quote:9215Quote:The gamble lost us a point but could have earned 3 so I’m fine with him trying it, wouldn’t have been happy with kicking it out to bank the lbpOldMarovian
Cracking game for the neutral.
Feel for Russell. A very bad mistake but some players have an "always try and win" rather than "mitigate a loss" mindset and that's not necessarily a bad thing.
Looking forward to watching it again.
I take the opposite view sacrificing an extra 1 point in the bag to possibly get a winning extra 4 points was well worth the gamble.
So are these the same South Africans that shouldn’t be allowed as they are not part of Europe then OB?
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Quote:CoochieCooQuote:9215Quote:The gamble lost us a point but could have earned 3 so I’m fine with him trying it, wouldn’t have been happy with kicking it out to bank the lbpOldMarovian
Cracking game for the neutral.
Feel for Russell. A very bad mistake but some players have an "always try and win" rather than "mitigate a loss" mindset and that's not necessarily a bad thing.
Looking forward to watching it again.
I take the opposite view sacrificing an extra 1 point in the bag to possibly get a winning extra 4 points was well worth the gamble.
I think that’s the same view!
Quote:9215Quote:CoochieCooQuote:9215Quote:The gamble lost us a point but could have earned 3 so I’m fine with him trying it, wouldn’t have been happy with kicking it out to bank the lbpOldMarovian
Cracking game for the neutral.
Feel for Russell. A very bad mistake but some players have an "always try and win" rather than "mitigate a loss" mindset and that's not necessarily a bad thing.
Looking forward to watching it again.
I take the opposite view sacrificing an extra 1 point in the bag to possibly get a winning extra 4 points was well worth the gamble.
I think that’s the same view!
Apologies it is!
I don’t know if we can say we have progressed greatly compared to our nearest neighbours. We won by a single point at home with a full complement of players & we lost to them by 13 points away with both teams denuded of players. We’ve won more than we’ve lost but our performances have been quite patchy. We could end up anywhere comethe end of the season but at least have been entertaining.
Quote:shipwrecked
So are these the same South Africans that shouldn’t be allowed as they are not part of Europe then OB?
I think I’ve been clear that SA teams aren’t welcome and aren’t part of Europe. The individuals are more than welcome and the more the merrier.
BH as the season has progressed Bath have improved greatly so I think we have progressed compared to our neighbours. There’s no way a full strength Bath loses to the current Bristol team.
Quote:OutsideBath
BH as the season has progressed Bath have improved greatly so I think we have progressed compared to our neighbours. There’s no way a full strength Bath loses to the current Bristol team.
We have to bear in mind that Bristol were not at full strength either. We can rest assured that that question will be answered based on how we perform in our remaining fixtures, none of which, I believe, are easy. I really hope your estimate is right.
Had to go for a long walk to calm down after that game.
I have become accustomed to us defending, being physical and not doing loads of really stupid, suicidal , undisciplined things.
Yesterday shocked me. Lots of reasons for it but they are excuses really- the league table doesn't caveat a 6 day turnaround and cancelled flight, or 5 call ups and then 3 more late call ups.
Hats off to reid who always seems to be excellent no matter the circumstances and to archie griffin who was great off the bench. That's it from me for the positives (tho no bad injuries again that I saw).
One selection gripe- looked like Richards was a travelling reserve. No idea in a game like that what a athletic, very quick, v physical, big lump who made a big impact off the bench vs leic could offer....
Rest and reset now- 6 massive games now. Need 4 wins maybe to make top 4 (possibly sneak top 2 with that?)?
I have become accustomed to us defending, being physical and not doing loads of really stupid, suicidal , undisciplined things.
Yesterday shocked me. Lots of reasons for it but they are excuses really- the league table doesn't caveat a 6 day turnaround and cancelled flight, or 5 call ups and then 3 more late call ups.
Hats off to reid who always seems to be excellent no matter the circumstances and to archie griffin who was great off the bench. That's it from me for the positives (tho no bad injuries again that I saw).
One selection gripe- looked like Richards was a travelling reserve. No idea in a game like that what a athletic, very quick, v physical, big lump who made a big impact off the bench vs leic could offer....
Rest and reset now- 6 massive games now. Need 4 wins maybe to make top 4 (possibly sneak top 2 with that?)?
Quote:9215Quote:The gamble lost us a point but could have earned 3 so I’m fine with him trying it, wouldn’t have been happy with kicking it out to bank the lbpOldMarovian
Cracking game for the neutral.
Feel for Russell. A very bad mistake but some players have an "always try and win" rather than "mitigate a loss" mindset and that's not necessarily a bad thing.
Looking forward to watching it again.
No major issue with it.
Once we had lost 8 players I did think 2 match points would be a v v good result in the circumstances so frustrating we had that and lost it but ambition is good.
I just personally feel that once we'd had about 5 bites at going 90 yds and it wasn't working then maybe cut our losses and bag the 2 pts. Just with the league being so tight it feels 1 point could mean you lose out on top 4 or top 2 come the final day of regular season
Quote:OutsideBathQuote:P G TipsQuote:OutsideBath
Simple solution in the future for me is to reduce the number of England players in the squad then this sort of thing won’t happen.
So how will that work?
Do you really think we would make the top 3rd of the table without Obano, Stuart, Ewels, Underhill, Spencer, Lawrence, Ojomoh & Muir?
PG
When their contracts are up replace them with Saffers who would be available nearly all the time and it could work.
Losing all our England players cost us the win today and possibly the chance of top 2.
I’m probably alone in this forum by not caring that much what England do, but really want to see a trophy winning Bath.
I think the rules on foreigners change after this season the Kolpek and Bosman rule I believe is no longer valid after this season, so SA players and EU and Fijians etc will be foreigners. I think that the new rule will be 15 of the 23 of a match day squad have to be EQP.
Officiating was a bit of a weird one.
No real howlers but felt every marginal call didn't go our way which I guess is just the way it goes.
Commentators (whether right or wrong) thought coetzee yellow was a touch harsh, took forever to give bris a yellow, luatua offside was given as a pen so assume they think Randall was stopping dunn from 2 yds. They felt tdt scored & coetzee scored but question asked dictated decisions.
All very odd. Just so much going on all the way through the game- felt tempest and Rose were never quite on the same wavelength.
It's all irrelevant, as I say no howlers, no major complaints from me.... they got lots right...schreuder yellow, cam pen, bris cardings. if you concede 8 tries to a bottom half team you deserve to lose.
bris are seriously brittle- played lots of lovely stuff but zero mental toughness. We couldn't have gifted them the game more times and it took til the last play to secure it. Hats off to them for their attacking rugby, bet it was serious fun for their fans and the neutrals. May give them a shot in the arm- hopefully beat some more teams in the mix for top 4!
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:28:08:59:23 by charlieboa.
No real howlers but felt every marginal call didn't go our way which I guess is just the way it goes.
Commentators (whether right or wrong) thought coetzee yellow was a touch harsh, took forever to give bris a yellow, luatua offside was given as a pen so assume they think Randall was stopping dunn from 2 yds. They felt tdt scored & coetzee scored but question asked dictated decisions.
All very odd. Just so much going on all the way through the game- felt tempest and Rose were never quite on the same wavelength.
It's all irrelevant, as I say no howlers, no major complaints from me.... they got lots right...schreuder yellow, cam pen, bris cardings. if you concede 8 tries to a bottom half team you deserve to lose.
bris are seriously brittle- played lots of lovely stuff but zero mental toughness. We couldn't have gifted them the game more times and it took til the last play to secure it. Hats off to them for their attacking rugby, bet it was serious fun for their fans and the neutrals. May give them a shot in the arm- hopefully beat some more teams in the mix for top 4!
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:28:08:59:23 by charlieboa.
Agree charlie, no howlers and I can see how they came to most decisions, which given the subjective nature of every single decision in rugby, isn’t a bad showing! I also think Tempest has improved his communication with the players.
Only gripe for me, because it was such a pivotal moment, was the pen against Stooke for not rolling away when we were 6 behind and they had 13. Not Stooke’s fault… can’t see what else he can do… but can see why it might be a pen… but just SO infuriating given the game situation! A good defensive set there and we win the game I reckon and the conversation this morning is a sensational win by our B team away from home in a local derby. Fine margins…
Still can’t stand the 15 phases of burrowing, mind!
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Only gripe for me, because it was such a pivotal moment, was the pen against Stooke for not rolling away when we were 6 behind and they had 13. Not Stooke’s fault… can’t see what else he can do… but can see why it might be a pen… but just SO infuriating given the game situation! A good defensive set there and we win the game I reckon and the conversation this morning is a sensational win by our B team away from home in a local derby. Fine margins…
Still can’t stand the 15 phases of burrowing, mind!
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Stooke one was tight call. Was offside but the ball was there and available and not slowed up but as with most 9s Randall milked it.
One that annoyed me was jvr after 5 mins when he was tackled, released ball, we counterrucked and he just got the ball again and placed it further back whilst still lying on the floor. Led to their first try.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:28:09:31:47 by charlieboa.
One that annoyed me was jvr after 5 mins when he was tackled, released ball, we counterrucked and he just got the ball again and placed it further back whilst still lying on the floor. Led to their first try.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:28:09:31:47 by charlieboa.
Quote:joethefanatic
A word for the ref. I thought Tempest was excellent. He got right everything is was possible to get right and his judgement calls (ie calls against us) were perfectly reasonable, if (by definition) wrong.
This is what irritated me. I'd have no problem with reffing calls today IF they were conducted in the same manner by all refs every week. But they're not. It's just so infuriatingly inconsistent.
Can someone explain how - despite losing 3 teams last year - we are still in this position of not having players available for league games? Yes I know, squad game, Sarries/Tigers managed it etc etc, but it's a one-off this year. Is it an RFU/PRL cock up or was it always set to be like this?
Weird to feel disappointed at losing after being 33-15 down at HT.
We didn't lose because of the Finn cross kick, we lost because I'd the first half defending.
I think the bit that annoyed me the most was the call up of players midweek. So disruptive.
Stooke had clearly rolled to make the ball available, but the Stooke was between Tempest and the ball.
The lack of consistency during the game is really annoying - two clear incidents:
Schreuder's yellow for deliberate knock on vs no sanction for Ibbotye's one.
No penalty try and yellow for Luatua for being offside, entering the ruck ffrom the side and then being the tackler who prevented Dunn scoring vs our penalty try for the tackler being offside.
I sort of get the TdT try not being allowed, but the evidence was there that it had been.
Tempest wasn't terrible, but he was inconsistent and pretty much all his big calls went against Bath.
That said, had we had a defence in the first half we would have won, but with half those big calls going our way instead of none, we would also have won.
And when was the last time a 22m drop out went dead for a scrum back?
The lack of consistency during the game is really annoying - two clear incidents:
Schreuder's yellow for deliberate knock on vs no sanction for Ibbotye's one.
No penalty try and yellow for Luatua for being offside, entering the ruck ffrom the side and then being the tackler who prevented Dunn scoring vs our penalty try for the tackler being offside.
I sort of get the TdT try not being allowed, but the evidence was there that it had been.
Tempest wasn't terrible, but he was inconsistent and pretty much all his big calls went against Bath.
That said, had we had a defence in the first half we would have won, but with half those big calls going our way instead of none, we would also have won.
And when was the last time a 22m drop out went dead for a scrum back?
One other query- we got a held up over the line when it looked like we were about 2 yds short? Or did I mis-see that/ misremember it?
Quote:I remember thinking that but no one seemed to protest too much.charlieboa
One other query- we got a held up over the line when it looked like we were about 2 yds short? Or did I mis-see that/ misremember it?
I think 6 weeks of working on better 5 yd drills is in order.
Quote:charlieboa
One other query- we got a held up over the line when it looked like we were about 2 yds short? Or did I mis-see that/ misremember it?
That was the most frustrating one for me and completely baffling. He could clearly see if was well short but still held up. When in fact that should be not rolling and yellow card. Both of Coetzee calls were wrong he wasn’t held in the tackle and don’t think it was a yellow at all.
Positives for me is still scoring 44 points
Some lovely created tries seems to be a real understanding between Finn/Cam/TDG/Cokansiga
Reid as always is just everywhere
Defence just wasn’t good enough and I do feel it is just a blip, James Williams just ran straight through and I don’t think we’ve seen that all season.
I thought we looked a much better side with TCS his passing was much better. I really do not see how we win games with Schreuder at 9. Lineout a massive issue Dunn seems to be in a big rut throwing.
This isn’t season over or Top 4 over like some say it is. Full strength (which is what it will be every game after sale) we can beat any side in Europe.
Quote:hasta
We didn't lose because of the Finn cross kick, we lost because I'd the first half defending.
This.
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
To add to this we have a good run in comparatively
We’ve got
Sale (H)
Quins (A)
Exeter (A) (EUROPE)
Exeter (A)
Sarries (H)
Falcons (A)
Saints (H)
Sale will be tough but I expect a win
We should beat Quins
Both Exeter games I expect wins they are picking up lots of injuries.
Saracens at home is the big one will be very close
Falcons rotate and win
Saints I imagine will have a Sarries approach to the game and rotate as they are set for top spot.
Prem I expect - 4 wins minimum which gets us through then the 5th would get us a home semi
We’ve got
Sale (H)
Quins (A)
Exeter (A) (EUROPE)
Exeter (A)
Sarries (H)
Falcons (A)
Saints (H)
Sale will be tough but I expect a win
We should beat Quins
Both Exeter games I expect wins they are picking up lots of injuries.
Saracens at home is the big one will be very close
Falcons rotate and win
Saints I imagine will have a Sarries approach to the game and rotate as they are set for top spot.
Prem I expect - 4 wins minimum which gets us through then the 5th would get us a home semi
Quote:HK890
I thought we looked a much better side with TCS his passing was much better. I really do not see how we win games with Schreuder at 9. Lineout a massive issue Dunn seems to be in a big rut throwing.
.
Also this. Annett should start, and I would hope that TCS now leapfrogs Schreiber as second choice.
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
The defence has been decent so far this season so what on earth happened yesterday? How on earth can a team leak 8 tries to a team like Bristol?
Because they played fast off loading rugby and we looked like we were still in the changing room and flat footede
Quote:hasta
We didn't lose because of the Finn cross kick, we lost because I'd the first half defending.
Absolutely true but you did sacrifice a point in the last play of the game. Re my earlier call not saying it was wrong but I'm sure if a missing point is an issue come the end of the season lots of Bath supporters will be calling out various "we woz robbed by the ref" calls and few, if any, will mention that one. Btw I would (will?) be totally the same re Sarries!
I watched the game again and it was bonkers. I mean there must be passionate SR supporters in the SH watching that thinking "What was that??!" When people ask for "Bazball" in rugby you've just seen it.
That said I think there's a bit too much doom and gloom.
You were missing quite a lot of important players including midweek disruption and you're still well placed in the table and have a largely uninjured squad a good rest period and a decent run-in.
I'd be very surprised if you aren't top 4.
If we miss out on the playoffs it'll be the last second loss at home to Tigers on account of dropping the ball, not failing to come back in this frankly insane game.
We looked exhausted and couldn't slow down their ball. We also absolutely played into their hands. It was frustrating. It's not the end of the world.
We looked exhausted and couldn't slow down their ball. We also absolutely played into their hands. It was frustrating. It's not the end of the world.
Quote:OldMarovian
That said I think there's a bit too much doom and gloom.
You were missing quite a lot of important players including midweek disruption and you're still well placed in the table and have a largely uninjured squad a good rest period and a decent run-in.
I'd be very surprised if you aren't top 4.
We may or may not finish top 4 as a result of yesterday, however that’s not the real issue. Top 2 is essential otherwise we’ll just extend the season by a week.
That said it’s nice for the season to matter into the first week of April and not be done by January.
The Stooke pen really annoyed me. He'd made an effort to get out of the way despite being boxed in by Bristol, the ball was available and Tempest had a very good view of it. Other refs seem to be doing the sensible thing and playing on in that situation.
Trying to be objective this morning.
I suspect but don't know of course that many of the players having had their week disrupted by the delayed return from Toulouse were 'out of sorts' and some were definitely looking semi knackered mentally as well as physically. Now we have several of them having been 'called up' for 6 N.
Hate hate hate loosing to the current Bristol (Bears fgs) but they did hava a canny game plan and of course were not hung over. Just one match to put behind us all and move on. Long way to go this season. I refuse unlike some to pick out individual players - its a team game after all, with a whole department of professsional highly paid coaching/physical/psychological experts backing them up
p.s. I left to take the dog out for a walk just before half time.
I suspect but don't know of course that many of the players having had their week disrupted by the delayed return from Toulouse were 'out of sorts' and some were definitely looking semi knackered mentally as well as physically. Now we have several of them having been 'called up' for 6 N.
Hate hate hate loosing to the current Bristol (Bears fgs) but they did hava a canny game plan and of course were not hung over. Just one match to put behind us all and move on. Long way to go this season. I refuse unlike some to pick out individual players - its a team game after all, with a whole department of professsional highly paid coaching/physical/psychological experts backing them up
p.s. I left to take the dog out for a walk just before half time.
No need to be downbeat. 3rd in the league with 6 to go.
Last year's last 6 matches saw us take a TBP minimum from every game, winning the last 4 for a maximum 20 points.
There is every reason to hope we can do something similar-although the Saints home match will be a real test.
The key will be how much we learn from yesterday and how well we apply the lessons.
PG
Last year's last 6 matches saw us take a TBP minimum from every game, winning the last 4 for a maximum 20 points.
There is every reason to hope we can do something similar-although the Saints home match will be a real test.
The key will be how much we learn from yesterday and how well we apply the lessons.
PG
Quote:hastaQuote:I remember thinking that but no one seemed to protest too much.charlieboa
One other query- we got a held up over the line when it looked like we were about 2 yds short? Or did I mis-see that/ misremember it?
I think 6 weeks of working on better 5 yd drills is in order.
Agreed!
That should involve having richards there to do it rather than scrappy do (cloete) coming on to be solely used to try and plunder his way over from 5 yds against a well set defence on slow ball of people who are much taller and bigger.
So dim in so many ways yest.
Agree TCS gave us good tempo and service when he came on.
Quote:Easy.Barfboy
Can someone explain how - despite losing 3 teams last year - we are still in this position of not having players available for league games?
3 teams gone means 6 weekends freed up.
6N takes 7 weeks, with an extra 1 for the pre-tourney training camp that the RFU pays handsomly to secure player release.
8 is a bigger number than 6.
RAEBURN SHIELD
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:28:11:28:46 by Quel Carreleur.
At the end of the day we got a point from this fixture - which means that bar Leicester away we have secured a point from every game - as disappointing as it was yesterday other results bar Saints went are way if Gloucester can beat Sale today and deny them a point the table won't change - it is very claustrophobic and it will be a shoot out and very exciting post 6 Nations as to who ends up where. I think I am correct in saying we have Sale, Sarries and Saints at home and Quins, Chiefs and Newcastle away. Some tough trips but also some tough home games.
We have just got to hope that our International players come through the 6 Nations without injury and Ted Hill returns and shows the quality player we all know him to be. 6 Nations ultimately could decide the Premiership depending which way lady luck falls in terms of injuries.
At least we are in the mix and if you look at the comments from the players re-signing this week - they all have something in common - they are talking about the building of something special over the next 2 seasons - this season is a bonus I expect JvG and the team did not expect.
I would end by saying I am 100% in the it was worth a go camp in relation to Finn's kick - we need our players to back themselves and try things - I suppose we saw the difference between a Finn Russell and an Owen Farrell - I am sure Farrell would have just kicked the ball dead and settled for 2 BP's - percentage player and superb at it. Russell is a different beast and his brilliance sometimes brings these type of moments - enjoy the ride. For those who want to berate him - just re-watch the pass across the noses of the Bristol players for the Tom DG try - commentators were waxing lyrical about it. That is his class.
If you want someone to really blame - try the RFU who deny the clubs their players in an attempt to try and gain an advantage over the other nations. That is the real shame that both teams could not go out full on loaded - that is what a derby fixture is all about IMHO. Finally yesterday confirmed my opinion of just how good a player Bernard Janse Van Rensberg really is.
We have just got to hope that our International players come through the 6 Nations without injury and Ted Hill returns and shows the quality player we all know him to be. 6 Nations ultimately could decide the Premiership depending which way lady luck falls in terms of injuries.
At least we are in the mix and if you look at the comments from the players re-signing this week - they all have something in common - they are talking about the building of something special over the next 2 seasons - this season is a bonus I expect JvG and the team did not expect.
I would end by saying I am 100% in the it was worth a go camp in relation to Finn's kick - we need our players to back themselves and try things - I suppose we saw the difference between a Finn Russell and an Owen Farrell - I am sure Farrell would have just kicked the ball dead and settled for 2 BP's - percentage player and superb at it. Russell is a different beast and his brilliance sometimes brings these type of moments - enjoy the ride. For those who want to berate him - just re-watch the pass across the noses of the Bristol players for the Tom DG try - commentators were waxing lyrical about it. That is his class.
If you want someone to really blame - try the RFU who deny the clubs their players in an attempt to try and gain an advantage over the other nations. That is the real shame that both teams could not go out full on loaded - that is what a derby fixture is all about IMHO. Finally yesterday confirmed my opinion of just how good a player Bernard Janse Van Rensberg really is.
Quote:Quel CarreleurQuote:Easy.Barfboy
Can someone explain how - despite losing 3 teams last year - we are still in this position of not having players available for league games?
3 teams gone means 6 weekends freed up.
6N takes 7 weeks, with an extra 1 for the pre-tourney training camp that the RFU pays handsomly to secure player release.
8 is a bigger number than 6.
Thanks and understood but do you not think - now the league has been unintentionally slimmed down - that there wasn't a way of working it so the league was prioritised and we avoided this situation?
Could we not have another enforced rest week or two for the internationals, which gives the clubs the chance to pick and choose when players are rested instead of losing 8 in one hit (and on a now one-off basis)?
Quote:Isn't that asking for 6 to be a bigger number than 8?Barfboy
Thanks and understood but do you not think - now the league has been unintentionally slimmed down - that there wasn't a way of working it so the league was prioritised and we avoided this situation?
Or did you prefer it before the league was slimmed down, and we lost the players for 7 matches rather than 1?
Quote:Clubs didn't want EPS players to all be given the same weeks off - so it was done by windows (so 1 rest week between AI and 6N and 1 rest week between 6N and end of season.Barfboy
Could we not have another enforced rest week or two for the internationals, which gives the clubs the chance to pick and choose when players are rested instead of losing 8 in one hit (and on a now one-off basis)?
We didn't lose them for a rest week this weekend, we lost them for a training camp.
Tough to hold a training camp if you're only allowed some of the players. I guess it COULD be worked out - and it would involve a lot less money from the RFU to the clubs as they wouldn't be getting the access they wanted and negotiated for.
Going forward, there will be a bit more flexibility, as there won't be another RWC for the next 3 years; and the PRC can be tinkered with; so maybe the season could start a week earlier, and play the PRC during the AI and 6N windows (including training weeks) rather than as a glorified pre-season.
RAEBURN SHIELD
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:28:12:43:55 by Quel Carreleur.
Quote:hastaQuote:I remember thinking that but no one seemed to protest too much.charlieboa
One other query- we got a held up over the line when it looked like we were about 2 yds short? Or did I mis-see that/ misremember it?
I think 6 weeks of working on better 5 yd drills is in order.
Plus knowing when to get it out to the backs to walk it in. So much space out wide.
J
Quote:ChippenhamRomanQuote:hastaQuote:I remember thinking that but no one seemed to protest too much.charlieboa
One other query- we got a held up over the line when it looked like we were about 2 yds short? Or did I mis-see that/ misremember it?
I think 6 weeks of working on better 5 yd drills is in order.
Plus knowing when to get it out to the backs to walk it in. So much space out wide.
J
Agree CR, it doesn't even have to go that wide just 15m where there are gaps to attack.
Quote:hastaQuote:I remember thinking that but no one seemed to protest too much.charlieboa
One other query- we got a held up over the line when it looked like we were about 2 yds short? Or did I mis-see that/ misremember it?
I think 6 weeks of working on better 5 yd drills is in order.
It’s been a problem since the start of the season so doubt it will be fixed in 6 weeks, especially with most of the first team on 6N duty.
Quote:Quel CarreleurQuote:Easy.Barfboy
Can someone explain how - despite losing 3 teams last year - we are still in this position of not having players available for league games?
3 teams gone means 6 weekends freed up.
6N takes 7 weeks, with an extra 1 for the pre-tourney training camp that the RFU pays handsomly to secure player release.
8 is a bigger number than 6.
You do know we can just extend the season by a couple of weeks?
It’s a RWC season, the Prem and the RFU can make stuff up on the hoof.
J
Quote:ChippenhamRomanQuote:hastaQuote:I remember thinking that but no one seemed to protest too much.charlieboa
One other query- we got a held up over the line when it looked like we were about 2 yds short? Or did I mis-see that/ misremember it?
I think 6 weeks of working on better 5 yd drills is in order.
Plus knowing when to get it out to the backs to walk it in. So much space out wide.
J
I really thought Finn was our cure to the horrendous disease of mindless pick and drive. Is his mind elsewhere?
[quote Optimist]
I think 6 weeks of working on better 5 yd drills is in order.[/quote]
Plus knowing when to get it out to the backs to walk it in. So much space out wide.
J[/quote]
I really thought Finn was our cure to the horrendous disease of mindless pick and drive. Is his mind elsewhere?[/quote]
+ 1
I think 6 weeks of working on better 5 yd drills is in order.[/quote]
Plus knowing when to get it out to the backs to walk it in. So much space out wide.
J[/quote]
I really thought Finn was our cure to the horrendous disease of mindless pick and drive. Is his mind elsewhere?[/quote]
+ 1
Quote:A] It depends on the game planOptimist
I really thought Finn was our cure to the horrendous disease of mindless pick and drive. Is his mind elsewhere?
B] In my experiences, forwards develop selective deafness within 5m of the try line, and the SH would have to actively wrestle the ball of them - which rarely ends well for the SH.
I absolutely agree that we need to work on this - driving mindlessly for the line hasn't been an effective strategy since they changed to laws explicitly to neuter it, and switch from 5m scrum, to goal-line drop out.
IMO, this mini-preseason should be used to tinker with the game plan, so that we approach the run-in with a few surprises for opponents, and correct things that aren't working as we'd hoped 6 months ago.
Line-out and 5m from the try line being the stand-outs for me personally.
And yes, I know that's tough when we'll be absent so many starters, but I'd expect our internationals to be able to pick tactical things up pretty quickly.
RAEBURN SHIELD
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:29:09:49:32 by Quel Carreleur.
Pick and go means you often bypass 9 and 10. It will be a part of a training routine will it not?
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Quote:Ali1969
I am 100% in the it was worth a go camp in relation to Finn's kick - we need our players to back themselves and try things - I suppose we saw the difference between a Finn Russell and an Owen Farrell - I am sure Farrell would have just kicked the ball dead and settled for 2 BP's - percentage player and superb at it. Russell is a different beast and his brilliance sometimes brings these type of moments - enjoy the ride. For those who want to berate him - just re-watch the pass across the noses of the Bristol players for the Tom DG try - commentators were waxing lyrical about it. That is his class.
Totally on board with this
It wasn't far from being a superb play that would have given us a great attack that quite possibly could have secured all 5 points
Love him for it and forgive him for the kick being a metre short
Quote:Quel CarreleurQuote:Isn't that asking for 6 to be a bigger number than 8?Barfboy
Thanks and understood but do you not think - now the league has been unintentionally slimmed down - that there wasn't a way of working it so the league was prioritised and we avoided this situation?
Or did you prefer it before the league was slimmed down, and we lost the players for 7 matches rather than 1?
Quote:Clubs didn't want EPS players to all be given the same weeks off - so it was done by windows (so 1 rest week between AI and 6N and 1 rest week between 6N and end of season.Barfboy
Could we not have another enforced rest week or two for the internationals, which gives the clubs the chance to pick and choose when players are rested instead of losing 8 in one hit (and on a now one-off basis)?
We didn't lose them for a rest week this weekend, we lost them for a training camp.
Tough to hold a training camp if you're only allowed some of the players. I guess it COULD be worked out - and it would involve a lot less money from the RFU to the clubs as they wouldn't be getting the access they wanted and negotiated for.
Going forward, there will be a bit more flexibility, as there won't be another RWC for the next 3 years; and the PRC can be tinkered with; so maybe the season could start a week earlier, and play the PRC during the AI and 6N windows (including training weeks) rather than as a glorified pre-season.
I don't think the condescension was necessary. Nowhere did I say this week was a rest week, I'm simply making suggestions so clubs don't lose England internationals en masse anymore.
I was going to say revising PRC format (as you mentioned) might be way to go, but thought I'd get shot down because it's predominantly a competition for young/squad players these days. Someone else has suggested extending the season by a week or two, which doesn't seem outrageous.
Clubs didn't want EPS players to all be given the same week off...but the outcome was still the same this weekend? It wasn't a rest week, but all clubs were without their England players.
Point is - and always was - that if we are now down to losing players for only one game a season, could something be done so that the problem is eradicated.
Quote:Barfboy
Point is - and always was - that if we are now down to losing players for only one game a season, could something be done so that the problem is eradicated.
I guess that this season was particularly troublesome given the RWC at the start meaning that the little cup was pushed there. I would guess that next season the Prem games will be at the normal times so the little cup can go back to being in the 6N again?
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
It has improved over previous seasons massively already.
The reality is that there will always be a "cost" to supplying EQP Internationals until/unless we bring in the Irish system that effectively rests the majority of their CCd players through the club season and I think that's the opposite of what most club supporters want?
Right now the players who were at the RWC had a few weeks off at the start of the season then straight in. Now they will be with England playing International level intensity games, then get a week's rest during one of the 6 remaining club games of the season.
Honestly it's crazy how much rugby we put them through.
Not sure what the solution is? But if this is the dawning if a new age it will be increasingly Saints, Quins and Baths problem.
The reality is that there will always be a "cost" to supplying EQP Internationals until/unless we bring in the Irish system that effectively rests the majority of their CCd players through the club season and I think that's the opposite of what most club supporters want?
Right now the players who were at the RWC had a few weeks off at the start of the season then straight in. Now they will be with England playing International level intensity games, then get a week's rest during one of the 6 remaining club games of the season.
Honestly it's crazy how much rugby we put them through.
Not sure what the solution is? But if this is the dawning if a new age it will be increasingly Saints, Quins and Baths problem.
I didn't really know where to post it but thought the Bath supporters might enjoy the following from Neil Squires on Rugbypass re Finn Russell:
"It is one of the great joys of rugby – any sport actually – to watch Russell run through his illusionist’s repertoire.
The chameleon vision, the blurring sleight of hand and the array of kicking options combines for a spellbinding act. Most importantly of all, he has the conviction to keep on backing himself even when the saw-the-lady-in-half trick ends up in a trip to A and E"
"It is one of the great joys of rugby – any sport actually – to watch Russell run through his illusionist’s repertoire.
The chameleon vision, the blurring sleight of hand and the array of kicking options combines for a spellbinding act. Most importantly of all, he has the conviction to keep on backing himself even when the saw-the-lady-in-half trick ends up in a trip to A and E"
Quote:OldMarovian
I didn't really know where to post it but thought the Bath supporters might enjoy the following from Neil Squires on Rugbypass re Finn Russell:
"It is one of the great joys of rugby – any sport actually – to watch Russell run through his illusionist’s repertoire.
The chameleon vision, the blurring sleight of hand and the array of kicking options combines for a spellbinding act. Most importantly of all, he has the conviction to keep on backing himself even when the saw-the-lady-in-half trick ends up in a trip to A and E"
That's exactly me, thanks OM
And Francis, if that is an original then please take a bow. Finnball Wizard. Love it
No Gaz, I didn't come up with it but I think it was someone on this Forum and it was his wife, if I remember correctly. I claim no credit for what is a brilliant nickname.
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