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Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2022:09:29:08:27:14 by P G Tips.

Many concerns for Bath Rugby at the moment and very difficult to raise the enthusiasm to travel for this game considering the previous truly embarrassing results against Gloucester last season.

Nevertheless we certainly need to put out part of the squad yet unseen to show what they can do , hopefully they will impress and be more involved in the future.



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"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS

Quote:

Old Bath Tub
Many concerns for Bath Rugby at the moment and very difficult to raise the enthusiasm to travel for this game considering the previous truly embarrassing results against Gloucester last season.
Nevertheless we certainly need to put out part of the squad yet unseen to show what they can do , hopefully they will impress and be more involved in the future.

I think that Gloucester put out a strong team for the little cup game because they didn't have a game that week. Well the Worcester issue means that they won't have a game this weekend either so I am expecting another strong team from them.

[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]

Team's Up:

Bath Rugby team to play Gloucester

15 Sam Harris, 14 Ruaridh McConnochie, 13 Louie Hennessey, 12 Will Butt, 11 Gabe Goss, 10 George Worboys, 9 Max Green; 1 Arthur Cordwell, 2 Tom Doughty, 3 Johannes Jonker, 4 Michael Etete, 5 JJ Tonks, 6 Tom Ellis ©, 7 Ethan Staddon, 8 Nahum Merigan

Impact players

16 John Stewart, 17 Archie Stanley, 18 Kieran Verden, 19 Mackenzie Graham, 20 Thompson Cowan, 21 Tom Carr-Smith, 22 Max Wright, 23 Darren Atkins

P G Tips


Jaco Coetzee: my adopted Player, 2023-24.

Gloucester Team:

15. Kyle Moyle
14. Tom Seabrook*
13. Jack Reeves*
12. Giorgi Kveseladze
11. Jonny May*
10. George Barton*
9. Stephen Varney*

1. Ciaran Knight*
2. Henry Walker*
3. Bryan O’Connor
4. Arthur Clark*
5. Cameron Jordan*
6. Jake Polledri*
7. Lewis Ludlow ©*
8. Jack Clement*

16. Seb Blake*
17. Fred Ma’a*
18. James Pollard*
19. Freddie Thomas*
20. Jack Bartlett*
21. Matty Jones*
22. Isaac Marsh*
23. Jake Morris*

[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]

On paper it looks as though both teams have put out a good mix of very experienced and very young players.

[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]

I presume you cant watch this remotely?

Quote:

BathMatt53
On paper it looks as though both teams have put out a good mix of very experienced and very young players.

Agreed. Not the uber strong Gloucester outfit feared by some. They will have the edge in the back row (what's new?) and they have pace and trickery in May & Kveseladze but otherwise the teams look quite well matched.

All about attitude lads!

PG

I thought the Gloucester team was quite strong. Isn't their back 3, 9 and backrow all regular names in the first team?

Quote:

by
I thought the Gloucester team was quite strong. Isn't their back 3, 9 and backrow all regular names in the first team?

Vs Sarries in their last match it was:

Starting lineup
15Lloyd Evans
14Louis Rees-Zammit
11Ollie Thorley

9Ben Meehan

6Ruan Ackermann
7Harry Taylor
8Albert Tuisue

So no, all different from their strongest current team - albeit yes a few of them are people coming back from injury that have played a load of first team games such as May, Ludlow etc in the same way as we have McConnochie, Ellis etc

[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]

I didn't say it was their strongest current team, I said they're regulars within the first team, and have been over the last 2 or 3 seasons.

Clement had 18 premiership games last season, 4 starts.
Moyle had 15 premiership games last season, 9 starts.
Seabrook had 12 premiership games last season, 5 starts.

Varney had 5 all from the bench, but also played for Italy in the six nations and AI.

Ludlow, May and Polledri are in their strongest team.

I suspect it'll be a cricket score (repeat of last season), but hope I'm wrong...

Quote:

by
I didn't say it was their strongest current team, I said they're regulars within the first team, and have been over the last 2 or 3 seasons.

Ok agreed, squad players, youngsters and those coming back from injury.

[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]

"A youthful Bath Rugby side will take to the field on Wednesday against Gloucester in the Premiership Rugby Cup" ....

... you can pretty much write the intro to the match report now.

"An inexperienced and youthful Bath side struggled to contain a powerful Gloucester side .... but 3 tries in the final 10 minutes showed the fighting spirit* that exists...."

* showed an ability to get some points outside of the business end of the match, long after the opposition's key players had put their feet up.

A. This is a pointless cup and I don't care, but...
B. Only as long as we're not shipping 70 points

Shipping 70 points will be against their 1st team next week !!

Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
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Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh

"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS

Quote:

hasta
A. This is a pointless cup and I don't care, but...
B. Only as long as we're not shipping 70 points

+1

Useful runout for the players, but waste of time for the fans.

I thought that squad looked a lot stronger than when we were annihilated last season but actually quite a lot of the same guys in both squads.

Hoping for a dramatically different result!

Good to see Jake Polledri playing again.

... IMHO, of course.

Now in Honolulu

Quote:

OutsideBath

Quote:

hasta
A. This is a pointless cup and I don't care, but...
B. Only as long as we're not shipping 70 points

+1

Useful runout for the players, but waste of time for the fans.

Not if you want to see the next crop of Bath rugby players. Great to see Tom Ellis back

Widcombe Garçon

I'll be there. Like others, the result matters a lot less to me than a Prem game but watching us ship another cricket score to Glos would be horrible. Here's hoping for a competitive match with some of the young players putting their name forwards for more chances in the near future.

Particularly keen to see Goss, Hennessey, Etete and Staddon.

I'll be there and interested to see how the young 'uns go and what the future may hold. Also interested to see whether the Bath malaise is a first squad phenomena or runs club deep.
You never know, it might even be a good game. Here's hoping.

Quote:

Widcombe Boy

Quote:

OutsideBath

Quote:

hasta
A. This is a pointless cup and I don't care, but...
B. Only as long as we're not shipping 70 points

+1

Useful runout for the players, but waste of time for the fans.

Not if you want to see the next crop of Bath rugby players. Great to see Tom Ellis back

Agree it’s always good to see players coming back, but personally I’m only interested in the present and never look to the future.

Good point Deckchair. It will be our first sight, in a competitive game, of Harris, Hennessy, Etete & Tonks.

With McConnochie & Ellis returning to action their form and fitness will be of interest too.

Gloucester do look stronger, but I am hoping for a closer performance and result than last time.

PG

Quote:

hasta
A. This is a pointless cup and I don't care, but...
B. Only as long as we're not shipping 70 points

Really surprised at that viewpoint hasta. I watched the Tigers v Wasps match last night and a) I don't think the players thought it was a pointless match and b) there was some great rugby to watch with some real rising stars on show - the Leicester no 7 in particular

And that is without the opportunity for established players like RMc to get game time on way back from injury

The competition may be 2nd rate but this is a huge opportunity for some of the squad, they will not be taking this lightly, neither will the Glos youngsters. I would go if I could.

Totally agree gaz. We talk about how on earth do squad players stay engaged when they hardly ever play any rugby ... we have about 70 players listed on the first team squad page. Even with our video-games level of attrition, some of them are starting to stretch the definition of 'rugby player'.

It's also a massive test to see if we're coming close to fulfilling that aspiration we all have, for there to be a Bath 'system' that runs through all of the teams enabling players to slot seamless into the first team when the time comes ..... sadly, I suspect we're going to find out this evening that there is!

The cup may be a bit pointless, but I don't think any of the games are.

As others have said this is a rare chance to play an actual game of rugby for many of them- if they aren't excited and motivated then there's a major problem.

Likewise , although sadly I can't attend, I am v excited as a fan about hearing how these guys go.

Whole host of debuts, academy guys, injury returness involved- far more interesting sub plots than a first team league game in many ways.

Feels like there is a backrow slot wide open for someone like Richards (assume injured or held back for weekend), Tonks, etete or staddon in absence of Sam and cloete.

Big game from butt could convince the coaches the midfield balance needs another look.

Hoping that San Harris is the real deal and is challenging for first team 23 by end of next season.

The 'Live Link' that has been operating for the Prem games seems to be ready for tonight's game: [www.bathrugby.com]

Quote:

Mike the Taxi
The 'Live Link' that has been operating for the Prem games seems to be ready for tonight's game: [www.bathrugby.com]

Aaah nice

Quote:

Optimist
Totally agree gaz. We talk about how on earth do squad players stay engaged when they hardly ever play any rugby ... we have about 70 players listed on the first team squad page. Even with our video-games level of attrition, some of them are starting to stretch the definition of 'rugby player'.
It's also a massive test to see if we're coming close to fulfilling that aspiration we all have, for there to be a Bath 'system' that runs through all of the teams enabling players to slot seamless into the first team when the time comes ..... sadly, I suspect we're going to find out this evening that there is!

The cup may be a bit pointless, but I don't think any of the games are.

I agree with all until the penultimate point, Opti. If the likes of Stadden, Worboys, Carr-Smith and co were [OK let's dream] were to win the final. A) that would big stuff for their as well as club's morale and b) it would start them down the road of a winning mentality. It ain't pointless in my view

Oh, and even our very own rugby club Yeti should get a runout tonight even if it is from the bench

To confirm, we're going to get text updates on the match centre on the website but there is no live link for a stream/feed? Correct?

[www.bathrugby.com] - 1 try each plus a penalty to Bath

On the radio.

Radio Bristle - 104.6

Yep.

10-7 to Bath at Half Time.

For those that were wondering where he was, Darren Atkins has just come on for Bath. His first game for awhile after some family struggles [www.bathrugby.com]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022:09:28:21:10:15 by dcsh.

10-26 Gloucester on top J J Tonks yellow

Widcombe Garçon

15-26 Bath score from a maul

Max Wright on for Hennessy hia

Widcombe Garçon

J J Tonks back on Carr Smith on for Green

Widcombe Garçon

Mackenzie Graham on

Widcombe Garçon

Big tackle by Bath & turnover but then concede penalty. 15-29’

Bath 5 metre lineout from a penalty. Repeated pick & goes until Bath knock it on

Looks like Butt is now Captain?

More pressure from Bath5 metre lineout but not straight. 4 attacking line outs missed tonight

Another Bath turnover Penalty to the corner again lineout messed up

Yet another attacking lineout lost !!

All Bath some good intent but too many mistakes in the last 10’minutes



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022:09:28:21:53:48 by Widcombe Boy.

Walking back home now. Tbst was a decent showing from a young side. Plenty of spirit too, on both sides of the ball. The first 10 minutes of the second half was the difference- that and our inability to win a line out in the last quarter.

Etete looked strong, Butt ran hard. Harris had some lovely moments alongside a couple of dropped high balls. Warboys looked much more confident than this time last year and kicked long.

I'm not sure if Ellis took a knock. He led well and we missed him at the end.

All in all, more green shoots but still no sign of an actual win.

I didn't expect a win but I'm glad that it sounds like the team showed a bit more heart and commitment across the 80 than recent first teams.

That and not shipping a record number of points...

Was very impressed with the commitment from Bath given that after 15 mins you sort of knew that Glos had a bit more fluency in attack and were likely to win. We missed a few first up tackles but put in a number of great hits on the gain line (I don't like using the word 'hits' but these days they pretty much are). The line out functioned well until the last 20 mins when it imploded following several changes. Scrum and attacking and defensive mauling good. Attack wise we didn't offer too much beyond honest endeavour although Goss looked dangerous but there seemed to be a bit more pace to our game than often seen on a Saturday. One thing that mirrored the first team was our terrible discipline which pretty much kept us in our own 22 for the first 25 mins of the 2nd half, albeit some pens were of course down to Glos pressure. The back row did well-I reckon they matched Glos which is no mean feat. Not a bad crowd given the rather despondent mood at present, well marshalled by the youngest team of stewards I've ever seen!
(My impressions offered with the disclaimer that like my driving at night time I sometimes struggled with the glare from the floodlights and the lack of natural light!)

Good first half showing, fell asleep for the first 10 of the second half and couldn’t generate anything solid thereafter. Glaws had some good backs moves off set piece play (with hard running centres), I don’t think we had any in the second half. Their back row was much more effective than ours, but no surprise with two full internationals there.

Losing is a habit and it clouds the entire squad.

Quote:

Rawce
Losing is a habit and it clouds the entire squad.

So true. We are resigned to it, expecting defeat in every match. We search like mad for tiny green shoots & constantly make excuses. So depressing.

Just wanted to mention our #8 who carried hard and tackled well. He, Merigan, and Etete were the pick of the forwards for me. A crowd of 7,000 turned up to cheer the boys on which included many of the first team squad from Friday night...

Adopted players: 24/25 J Bayliss; [24] O Lawrence; [23] J Cokanasiga; [22] M Green; [21] A Watson; [20] T Faletau; [19] M V Vuuren; [18] T Faletau; [17] D Denton; [16] H. Agulla; [15] L Houston; [14] W Spencer; [13] F. Louw

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My mind's been going places without me lately - Bushfire The B52's

My first game at the Rec since well before Covid.

Maul defence was excellent all through the game. We struggled to contain their centres, but generally if a first up tackle was missed, someone else made the hit (bar the 2 tries just after HT). Scrum went ok and had the usual lottery officiating when the 2 scrums went down. Sadly the lineout fell apart completely (lost 5 or 6 on the bounce) when Doughty went off, and that gave us no chance at the end. We got pinged for going off feet / sealing off a few times, Gloucs did the same and got away with it.

Goss looked super sharp. Sam Harris will be a very good player. Butt ran really hard. Worboys also did well.

We missed Tom Ellis when he went off, but one of the replacement flankers won 3 turnovers at the end.

However, it really is a club in desperate need of a couple of wins.

Butt was well shackled by 2 or 3 Glos defenders. Whereas their centres seemed to be more 1 on 1. Also, Henessey looks almost as big as Butt but we didn’t use him anywhere near as much as we could have. He’s much bigger than his profile pic leads you to believe. Goss did look like he could scare a lot of people and their 14 did well with a few last ditched tackles that would have been tries for us but for fingertips.

The pack did well against a mostly international back row and at times we defended exceptionally well bar the start of the second half and the inevitable carding.

You could see the more senior players were very vocal, Ellis and McConk constantly directing things which must be encouraging for all.

Line out seemed to be more mistiming than anything, but also we hardly challenged Glos whereas they fought pretty much every one of ours so they were always going to have higher turnover stats. Plus Ludlow seemed to have the measure of our line out calls as the game wore on.

Worboys looked assured and seems to have a long old boot, so more game time please.

Rec looked about half full and very quiet. Cold nip in the air but great rugby weather. Bath young 'uns did OK without ever truly sparkling or pulling up trees. Glos made fewer mistakes, made better yards and joined the rest of the premiership sides by slicing through our half backs defense like the proverbial hot knife on butter.
What was somewhat depressing, however, was the complete lack of tactical nounce, creativity or innovation in the Bath teams play. Another Bath team that seems completely incapable of playing outside the deadening script and orders of a proscribed gameplan - even when the gameplan so obviously isn't working. It's as if they have received a manual of play from the coaches and stick with it no matter what.
At 15 -26 down and with ten to play Bath are mauling on the Gloucester 5m line. Pick up and bash, pick up and bash. Despite Glos having a forward lying injured mid-half, the rest put up a dogged defense as the maul crabs sideways and slow without giving ground all along the 5m line and then comes back again - full width of the pitch. And the clock is ticking. It is the metaphorical banging your head against a Gloucester wall. Where were the new forward attack angles, the running backs, the dummying feints, the alternatives to this pointlessness, the leader to stop this nonsense and get us over the line? Not at the Rec. The Bath forwards were eventually penalised for some inane trivia and Glos cleared their lines and the prospect of a win disappeared with the ball into the stands.
Why are Bath players seemingly incapable of individual thought, creativity or inspiration. Where are the chips ahead, the crafted off-loads, the devastating back-hand releases and all other manner of creativity we see in other teams. Why are their coaching regimes so much freer and inspirational that the box kick to nowhere, the bash crash bore and by the numbers methods of Bath. Coaches and leaders. Without some good ones we can't begin to rise, no matter how keen and good our youngsters.

On the box kicks, there's a real opportunity for a deliberate hook kick. The set up is so slow that the defenders start moving across the pitch towards where the normal kick is likely to end up, leaving loads of space where a deliberate hoo would go.......

On pick and go, it needs some big lumps running from deep and hitting the line at speed - very difficult to stop from 2m out (coupled with a dummy runner or two).......................................... except the big lump would probably knock it on.

Quote:

Deckchair
Why are Bath players seemingly incapable of individual thought, creativity or inspiration. Where are the chips ahead, the crafted off-loads, the devastating back-hand releases and all other manner of creativity we see in other teams.

I suspect that Bath players are (understandably) too low on confidence to play champagne rugby under those circumstances - particularly ones who are hoping to impress and not screw up individually. Basically we don't have anyone in the Premiership Cup team with a Danny Care / Marcus Smith mentality who will just 'have a go and be damned'. After all, Freddie was mostly crucified on here for trying the chips and back hand tricks.

[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]

Match highlights here

[www.somersetlive.co.uk]

Good reading for etete and goss