Harlequins
Quinssa Meet the Playing Squad - Report Part 2
By Artemis
August 19 2009
In this second instalment from the Quinssa Meet the Playing Squad Evening (18 August 2009), Mark continues to take questions regarding the Tom Williams incident.
ME – Now I’m not going to do them all (questions), to be honest I’ll take all the questions to do with Dean Richards, the Leinster game and Tom Williams and then I’ll sit down if that’s alright, otherwise we’re going to do the whole evening and these guys are going to feel like spare parts and what they really want to do is talk about the rugby and the rest of it. Then I can go and have a pint.
Q5 – In the Daily Telegraph today, it said there had been four other incidents of fake blood injuries with Deano and Steph in the last two years? Is that true? Why wasn’t it spotted and why wasn’t something done about it?
ME – Yes it is true, it came out in the hearing yesterday. Why wasn’t it spotted and something done about it? Gosh, because it wasn’t I suppose, is the only answer I can give you. If you don’t spot something, its impossible to do something about it and it wasn’t. I have to say the only time I had heard of blood capsules, was an old article written by Dick Best in the early part of the decade, I was working with Richard Hill and John, I’m not sure if John was in the conversation, but Richard Hill and I just laughed, we thought it was absurd! Never come across it. I will say one thing, having come from a playing/coaching background, I was saying this to John the other day, is that if you are not actually in the front line, as it were, you do watch the game in a completely different way. You don’t pay anywhere near as much attention, when you are examining the game minutely, minute by minute, game by game, week by week, it is an all consuming affair, it just looks a completely different game and there are things that go on that you would notice that wouldn’t even cause you to turn a hair.
Q6 – How did the four other incidences come out and it has said on the message boards and in the press that this is going to be followed up by the RFU. It would be nice to be able to close the door on this and get on with the season but I can’t help thinking about how the club is going to be impacted. We’re all worried about what is going to happen, we don’t want to have to win the Premiership to stay up. Do you know anything?
ME – I can’t help you with that. I don’t know. I know how it came out because I was at the hearing. I’m bound by certain restrictions on that. Other than that I can’t help you. Other than to say we are due to meet with the RFU later this week to talk about what has come out of the internal review but that was planned anyway.
Q7 – Do you think a precedent has been set, where a club is responsible for the actions of its individuals?
ME – Vicarious liability, they tell me its called, I never knew what that phrase meant before. I think it’s a really interesting point, it ties in with the corporate governance question, to what extent is a corporate body, we’re not a corporate body, a limited body or club, whatever you want to call them, to what extent are they responsible for all of the actions of all of the employees, is a really interesting area which I don’t think the game has got to grips with yet. Were Toulouse responsible for Trevor Brennan going in to the crowd and lamping someone a couple of years back, well I don’t know, is the answer to that. If James Haskell treads on another player while playing for Stade Francais, are Stade Francais liable? Historically the answer has tended to be no, because the player has been dealt with through the games disciplinary mechanisms. The only incident I can remember of a player trying to make another club liable was when Rougerie of Clemont Auvernge tried to take action, and may have successfully, I’m not sure, against Wasps, for the actions of Phil Greening in a game. It’s a really difficult area. How far does an employer, because it’s a real mish-mash between employment law and the governing body and the tournament you are in and the duty of care the club has to its employers it’s a really difficult area and I don’t think it is one that we have completely clarified. I’m not sure if that helps you at all.
Q7 – I was just wondering about Bath…
ME – No they are not, they are not held vicariously responsible for there players actions.
Q8 – Has Deano got the right of appeal against his sentence.
ME – I think he has
Q8 – 3 years out of total rugby across the world seems pretty harsh.
ME – It’s certainly near the top end
Q9 – I’m sure I’m not the only one who feels sick about the whole thing and I know it is difficult for you to stand up and say “it’ll never happen again” but is that your aim?
ME – It’s certainly my aim, I couldn’t give you a guarantee. All I would say about that, I think I said it in the letter, although I might not have said it as strongly as I will now. I think that there is a continuum between, lets take another sport, lets take soccer and don’t groan I’m just using it to illustrate a point. At one end you might have somebody who makes the most of a challenge to get a free-kick, that’s cheating, if you want to call it that, its deception. At the other end of the scale you might have bribing the official in order to fix a game, it’s happened, it happened in Italian soccer a number of club were relegated. Now in between those two extremes you have a whole range of offences, some are on the field of play, others are not. Others are a mixture of the two. I don’t think there is a team that has ever taken the field in London 5 division who doesn’t do one or two of the things down at the lower end. I just think that if you put human beings in a competitive situation they will try to make the most of what there is, within the rules of the game. As you move up the scale, your pushing it and you go over a line and then there are others at the other end who are way over the line. We’ve got to say we did wrong, we’ve got to hold our hands up and make your own judgement as to where it is on that line.
Q10 – But Mark, was our issue the event or the cover up?
ME – I don’t think you can separate.
Q10 – I think you can. You could say that if we had come clean in the beginning we would not have gone through the last four weeks.
ME - I can see your point. I think that is a comment not a question really.
Q10 – It could be a rhetorical question.
ME – I think so, yeah.
Q11 – What does the fine do to the financial status of the club, what with the new stand being built how do the backers feel about it?
ME – Well, they’re not happy! It’s a heavy fine! We’re going to have to work it out. The investors are very supportive, they have been supportive for the last 12/13 years. I thought the Chairman spoke very powerfully at the hearing last night. It’s made things more difficult at a time when we have a few liabilities out there with the stand and the training ground and strengthening the squad, it’s made it tough.
Q12 – Will it mean the Season tickets will go up next year?
ME – The season tickets have been frozen for three year so don’t start on that….three years alright, I’d just like to point out, pre-recession. I’m quite proud of that.
Q13 – Is there still a possibility of being kicked out of the Heineken cup or can we start making our travel plans.?
ME – Its pretty difficult to imagine. The sanction was an option that the panel decided was inappropriate, that’s where it stands, and that charge is now spent. So I think the answer is yes, but that is not a money back guarantee or anything.
Q14 – I’d like to cheer you up a bit Mark.
ME – Go on then! What you going to do?
Q14 – It stems from the support of the club and although it is shocking and sickening what has happened but I think we need to look back to ND1 and the support we got then, there was tremendous support for the club on Friday and I think everyone was really keen to show you that we support you on the field and what ever happens and I’m sure I speak for most people here we’re right behind you. We don’t approve of what has happened.
ME – I agree. Thank you very much its much appreciated.
John – Thank you very much Mark
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Personally I am more interested in all questions not relating to Bloodgate but to the future of the team and the forthcoming season.
Was anything discussed apart from the dreaded "Bloodgate" which i think should just be left as water under the bridge now - its occurred, it was a shame, we have had the final verdict let's be done and get on with it.
Including: Was it a transformer or a telly tubby that splintered the plank and more...
Look forward to reading the rest in due time.
Quote:The Prof
Find out more in tomorrow's next enthralling episode of "Quinssa Meet the Playing Squad"
Including: Was it a transformer or a telly tubby that splintered the plank and more...
I had to ask Will that question so he could set the record straight
Quote:The Prof
Find out more in tomorrow's next enthralling episode of "Quinssa Meet the Playing Squad"
Including: Was it a transformer or a telly tubby that splintered the plank and more...
Part 3 still in the making? Am keen bean to find out what else was said?
Thanks
