KERS to disappear from 2010?


By The Offsider
April 24 2009

Surprisingly thats what arised in an interview with Flavio Briatore. Apparently all teams (FOTA) have agreed that. Surprising, as it goes against Mosley's willings, as well as BMW's and even Mercedes, and the standard KERS solution seemed much better.

An extract of the translated interview, by AFCA:

Q: Is it true that KERS will disappear at the end of the year because all the teams already agreed on this ?


Briatore: ''Yes: the FOTA is willing to ban it in 2010. We immediately understood that KERS would turn out to be a money-eating device and the FIA should have taken note of this. It was necessary to discuss this prior to the season, as should have been the case with the diffusers. Not having done that forced us to spend amounts of money that are just as ridiculous as useless.''

Analysis: In our honest opinion, we hope it is not true, and instead a standard KERS solution is chosen instead, especially with a technology that can be so useful in the long term of road cars. More to follow soon...

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KERS to disappear from 2010?
Discussion started by BMW Sauber F1 (IP Logged), 24/04/2009 12:48
BMW Sauber F1
BMW Sauber F1
24/04/2009 12:48
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MESSAGES->author
Raid Phoenix
24/04/2009 12:56
Full interview translation (by AFCA):

Q: Why does the championship only start this weekend according to you ?
Briatore: ''I'm talking for Renault: we've got this new diffusor, we can exploit KERS. It's an uphill struggle but Alonso is capable of great come backs. In the second part of the 2008 season he scored more points than anyone else. I want to believe in it.''

Q: Is it only the devilry from Brawn GP that's to blame ?
Briatore: ''Basically. But now we have to think about getting back on top.''

Q: Meanwhile Mosley has sent the teams a letter proposing to have a € 33 million budget cap.
Briatore: ''Just think that we've already spent € 15 million on KERS and another € 10 million to modify the diffuser. And with the other € 5 million I would have to pay the wages, the design, the drivers, the marketing ? Madness.''

Q: Is it true that KERS will disappear at the end of the year because all the teams already agreed on this ?
Briatore: ''Yes: the FOTA is willing to ban it in 2010. We immediately understood that KERS would turn out to be a money-eating device and the FIA should have taken note of this. It was necessary to discuss this prior to the season, as should have been the case with the diffusers. Not having done that forced us to spend amounts of money that are just as ridiculous as useless.''

Q: But could you theoratically put a cap on the expenditures ?
Briatore: ''A Formula 1 with a budget cap of in between € 50 to € 60 million - the marketing and the wages of the drivers excluded - is possible from 2012 onwards, when preparing everything well that is. Today the differences in budget vary in between € 130 and € 450 million.''

Q: Why are the drivers excluded ?
Briatore: ''Apart from the fact that they cost less than they used to a few years ago, sometimes the drivers carry along some sponsors to the team.''

Q: Exactly: and what if Alonso were to leave Renault ?
Briatore: ''Wait a minute ! He was also the leave the team at the end of 2008 but he's still here. And he'll fight for the title.''

Q: Didn't you want to leave the world of Formula 1 yourself ?
Briatore: ''I'll be calling it a day when I'm able to leave a Formula 1 that can be regarded as a profit centre and not one of costs.''

Q: Did you ever think of reducing your own salary ?
Briatore: ''I already did that. I cut 20% of what I used to earn. Symonds, Bell and the other bosses will earn 10 % less, the mechanics 5 %. As far as the number of personnel is concerned: we've gone from 820 to 570. I think that in 2012 we'll be having around 200 people. The other teams are working on reaching this same number. But if they don't get there then I certainly won't be the one able to intervene.''

Q: Yes, but meanwhile this Formula 1 is losing face.
Briatore: ''The regulations that are not very clear are the culprit. They have to become transparent again. Either black or white. Still today, I don't know what the FIA means by a hole in the diffuser: I imagine the embarressment of those that follow us. And we also need to get back to the same level, all of us: today there are some that drive with KERS and others don't, some have a double-decker diffuser and others don't: this shouldn't no longer be possible.''

Racing against the machine!

Walsingham
Walsingham
24/04/2009 13:37
KERS is great concept but with output power limit it is a joke imho. FIA, Bernie and MAx more and more resemble old proverb we had about socialism: they spent time on heroic fight with obstacles they first create. They want cheaper F1 so they frozen engine development but that kills the spectacle so they went for night races, but thats raised costs and is unecological, so they introduced KERS to improve overtaking and improve eco image, but that raised costs, so they'll ban KERS, but they want spectacle so they introduced new aero rules, but that raised costs, so they'll introduce budget caps and so on and so on.

MESSAGES->author
pcyryl
24/04/2009 13:46
I have to say that I would welcome that. What is the point spending money on something that is standard and only seem to cause troubles. Wheel, shifts and pedals that what's racing is all about. And this whole applying concept is a joke. F1 KERS is so much different to the one on road.

Bogs
Bogs
24/04/2009 14:11
Ferrari said that the application of Kers in road car is much less appropriate because of the difference of speed that occurs between F1 cars and road cars. F1 car brake so much harder and create some much more energy during braking from much higher speeds.

MESSAGES->author
Raid Phoenix
24/04/2009 16:11
Quote:
Bogs
Ferrari said that the application of Kers in road car is much less appropriate because of the difference of speed that occurs between F1 cars and road cars. F1 car brake so much harder and create some much more energy during braking from much higher speeds.

Yet Lexus doesn't think the same. Even Jaguar is said to be thinking of buying William's KERS tech.

I have to remind that Ferrari has got it wrog many times.
Just remember Enzo once said "Aerodynamics is for those who don't know how to do a good engine"
Or from the mechanic's tale book gemm linked, where in the first pages he tells that Ferrari, where he worked, was well behind with electronics, yet happy to keep using an outdated injection system, while BMW and Porsche where cutting the edge in electronics, which later proved to be the real deal and revolution in cars.

As well, no surprises Ferrari now says KERS isn't useful when they are having serious reliability problems. they didn't say it before.

Believe me, in the future (15years?) most, if not all new cars will have some sort of KERS on board.
With hydrogen and pure electrci cars still struggling KERS and Heat-ERS are almost the only way to match coming pollution constrictions.

Racing against the machine!

MESSAGES->author
pcyryl
24/04/2009 16:25
Yeah and where is Williams' KERS on the field? Remind me?

In 15 years time all this global-warming-caused-by-human bullshit will be proven a lie and we will drop hybrids/kers/hers systems fortunately. I assure you.

Gimme fuel, gimme fire, gimme that what I desire! smiling smiley

Gemm
Gemm
24/04/2009 18:40
I think Walsingham has a point. Limiting the power out put is joke. As much as limiting the time for which it can be used. It was supposed to work as overtaking boost, not as an eco solution. It's obious that cost of having it does not much the benefit.

If KERS would be power/time limitless, them teams would have an incentive to go all our for reseach to make full use of that.

If FIA wants to promote ECO solution, they should limit the amount of fuel that can be used in race, and give teams complete freedom how much hybrid energy that want to produce to compensate for that. Then you would see solutions that would lead to road cars relevance.

In five years F1 engineering brain trust would move the technology to levels that we cannot even imagine now

In road cars hybrid technology is meant to lower the fuel use and pollution not to boost performance.

And how it's made now in F1 has completely no correlation to that.

MESSAGES->author
barteks
24/04/2009 19:40
Quote:
Walsingham
KERS is great concept but with output power limit it is a joke imho. FIA, Bernie and MAx more and more resemble old proverb we had about socialism: they spent time on heroic fight with obstacles they first create. They want cheaper F1 so they frozen engine development but that kills the spectacle so they went for night races, but thats raised costs and is unecological, so they introduced KERS to improve overtaking and improve eco image, but that raised costs, so they'll ban KERS, but they want spectacle so they introduced new aero rules, but that raised costs, so they'll introduce budget caps and so on and so on.
Hehe, good postthumbs down

2008 Prediction Champion

qlka
Qlka
25/04/2009 13:37
Are you happy you could run KERS in your car during Quali?
RK: yes, happily we have it, otherwise in Bahrain loss to frontrunnes would be bigger.

paul45
paul45
25/04/2009 14:46
i don't think kers will improve the show, apart from creating artificial overtaking
baning it isn't a problem for me

MESSAGES->author
Raid Phoenix
27/04/2009 20:02
It may not be banned, afterall:BMW, Mercedes against KERS ban

Racing against the machine!

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