Bath
BEWARE THE WOUNDED BEAR
Plotting
By Bath Supporter Jack
May 25 2026
“A wounded bear is exceptionally dangerous. Pain and trauma heighten their aggression, diminish their natural desire to flee, and make them highly unpredictable. An injured bear trapped or cornered will often fight ruthlessly for survival rather than retreat.”
The last few weeks results have certainly been strange!
European games have dominated on four weekends out of the last eight weekends and there
have been some extraordinary scores in the Premiership.
Following our European adventure we then played as badly as we have all season the next
weekend away at Exeter with a strangely flat performance against a team who were fired up
and who then themselves delivered an equally uninspired performance in their next match
away at season underperformers – Harlequins.
A two-week gap has followed before the final block of Rounds 17 and 18 now appear on the
horizon.
By a quirk of the fixture list the last two fixtures for each club in the top six will have a great
bearing on the final places for the play offs.
Saints play Gloucester at home and then Harlequins away. Looks like they will be first and
will get a home tie against whoever is in fourth place
Bath play Bristol away and then Leicester at home. The final game probably being the
decider for which of the two clubs has a home tie against the other in the semi-finals.
Leicester play Exeter at home and then of course Bath away
Exeter play Leicester away and followed by Saracens at home. A very tough couple of
games with the Saracens match probably deciding who comes fourth.
Saracens play Harlequins at home followed by an away match at Exeter. No easy task
against Harlequins who seem to have rediscovered themselves.
Finally, with a very unlikely chance of making the play-offs, Bristol play Bath at home and
then finish with a match away at Sale.
So, of the 12 fixtures set out about eight are between teams in the top six with a chance of
making the play-offs.
Bristol were Bath’s opponents last year in the semi-final play offs, when they lost….and
readers of this Board will recall Pat Lam saying that his wife would not be attending because
tickets were too expensive and she would have to sit in the rain and this would spoil her hair
style. Ellis Genge also said some very choice remarks about his view of all things Bath!
JVG was of course silent in public.
Bristol were one of the participants in the highest aggregate scoring match in Premiership
history just over a week ago when they were destroyed by Northampton Saints at Franklin
Gardens 94 – 33 (14 tries to 5 tries).
It is inconceivable that that same Bristol team will appear at 7.45 next Friday evening at
Ashton Gate. It may be roughly the same personnel, but their approach, attitude and
competitiveness will be on a completely different scale. As Bath Rob points out on the
“Prem Run In” thread Bath have had a poor record away at Bristol over the past five years.
Consequently, I believe we need to go very strong now for the last two games, Bristol away
and then Leicester at home. The whole point of the carefully planned rotation of players ove
the whole season was to get to this point with a squad in as good a shape as possible. Now is
the time to draw on those reserves of energy. Good results will mean we get another go at
Leicester, and then hopefully another final against Saints at Twickenham.
I popped over to the Bears Message Board and was surprised by four things.
(i) They still spell Bath, B**h, which I have always found very amusing (Shurely
shome mishtake – Ed)
(ii) The number of posts is very, very low.
(iii) The price of season tickets is very, very low.
(iv) There was a rather inappropriate post, in my view, about a survey to sense the
mood as to whether Pat Lam would be there as coach in September. The author of
the survey was careful to point out that he had deliberately not asked the question,
“Do you want him to be?”, because in his view the result would have been 80%
for him to go. Shades of ”The Hooper Era”!
Bristol are missing Rubiolo, Mata, Oghre and Ibitoye. It seems that AJ MacGinty is fit again
but he has not played since the first game of the season, so they are not sure if he will make an
appearance.
Bristol also are facing another issue in that they are behind the league requirement for an
average, over the whole season, of 15 English Qualified Players per match. This season, if
they end up below this level there is a fine of up to £250,000. Whilst they can ignore this and
pay the fine, I am sure Mr Lansdown would be irritated to pay over this money with very
little riding on the result.
So, what team do we select? In my view the strongest 23 and we must effectively play four
cup finals in the next four weeks. I found this selection very, very hard realising I had left
really good players out but could not find any room for them!! The main doubt is whether to
play Ted Hill at second row and bring Josh Bayliss in at Number 6. Also disappointed not to
have Arthur Green in the squad as he is a precocious and precious talent. Imagine if we had
Will Stuart, Will Muir, Tom Dunn and Quin Roux available as well!!
15. Tom De Glanville
14. Joe Cockanasiga
13. Ollie Lawrence
12. Max Ojomoh
11. Henry Arundell
10. Finn Russell
9. Ben Spencer
8. Alfie Barbeary
7. Guy Pepper
6. Ted Hill
5. Charlie Ewells
4. Ross Molony
3. Francois Van Wyk
2. Dan Frost
1. Beno Obano
16. Kepueli Tuipulotu
17. Thomas Du Toit
18. Vilikesa Sela
19 Miles Reid
20. Sam Underhill
21. Cameron Redpath
22. Tom Carr Smith
23. Santi Carreras
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Discussion started by Comeonmylovers.co.uk (IP Logged), 25/05/2026 17:07
25/05/2026 17:07
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Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2026:06:03:20:25:07 by CoochieCoo.
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Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2026:06:03:20:25:07 by CoochieCoo.
Thanks BSJ, whets the appetite well.
Of course, after the flat performance against Exteer, Bath redeemed themselves with a (very much expected) trouncing of Newcastle Red Bulls.
Form though can be ignored in this derby (even with Bristol's recent injury disruptions). Bath have not won a Premiership tie at Ashton Gate for at least 7 years and Bristol will be fired up for this match like no other.
The strongest available lineup is therefore essential, as is the right attitude and focus and, of course, discipline.
COYB!
PG
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2026:05:26:08:33:35 by P G Tips.
Of course, after the flat performance against Exteer, Bath redeemed themselves with a (very much expected) trouncing of Newcastle Red Bulls.
Form though can be ignored in this derby (even with Bristol's recent injury disruptions). Bath have not won a Premiership tie at Ashton Gate for at least 7 years and Bristol will be fired up for this match like no other.
The strongest available lineup is therefore essential, as is the right attitude and focus and, of course, discipline.
COYB!
PG
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2026:05:26:08:33:35 by P G Tips.
Well here's hoping the officials actually spot Bristol offences at Ashton Gate for once, be it blatant forward passes, offsides, side entries or any foul play. They do seem to have McCaw's invisibility spell when at home, particularly against Bath.
Good question Gaz.
Mind you I think it would be tough to breach the 15 EQP limit and then be penalised for breaching the salary cap!
Mind you it is Bristol!
Mind you I think it would be tough to breach the 15 EQP limit and then be penalised for breaching the salary cap!
Mind you it is Bristol!
Great previews BSJ and I am in total agreement that we'll see a very different Bristol on Friday.
Nice looking team suggested – I think Max, Ollie and Henry will have a real point to prove to Borthwick so that's a lineup I'd definitely like to see. I don't think well see FVW at tight head though.
Do we know what Sam Underhill's injury status is?
Nice looking team suggested – I think Max, Ollie and Henry will have a real point to prove to Borthwick so that's a lineup I'd definitely like to see. I don't think well see FVW at tight head though.
Do we know what Sam Underhill's injury status is?
It’s one of those matches where it’s probably far easier to gain a bonus point than to actually win!
I know it's a derby and our record at Ashton Gate is dreadful but we really should be winning this one. Without Rubiolo that Bristol pack takes a huge step backwards and they shouldn't have the depth / bench to keep up for the full 80.
Think Underhill is ok and it's elective surgery in the summer like Griffin but can't remember where I saw that now
Think Underhill is ok and it's elective surgery in the summer like Griffin but can't remember where I saw that now
Nice write up BSJ - appreciate you getting us all in the mood.
Big fan of the team you've selected though I doubt we'd start with two looseheads.
Nonetheless, I mostly agree with the team however I think I would start Hill @ 2nd row and pick Bayliss @ 6 to better cope with Bristol's fast and loose style of play. I would also look to go 6-2 so that we can emphasise (hopefully) our advantage in the pack given the Bristol injuries.
Team:
1. Obano 2. Tuipulotu 3. Sela 4. Hill 5. Ewels 6. Bayliss 7. Pepper 8. Barbeary 9. Spencer 10. Russell
11. Arundell 12. Ojomoh 13. Lawrence 14. Cokanasiga 15. De Glanville
16. Frost 17. FVW 18. TdT 19. Moloney 20. Reid 21. TCS 22. Carreras 23. Underhill
Big fan of the team you've selected though I doubt we'd start with two looseheads.
Nonetheless, I mostly agree with the team however I think I would start Hill @ 2nd row and pick Bayliss @ 6 to better cope with Bristol's fast and loose style of play. I would also look to go 6-2 so that we can emphasise (hopefully) our advantage in the pack given the Bristol injuries.
Team:
1. Obano 2. Tuipulotu 3. Sela 4. Hill 5. Ewels 6. Bayliss 7. Pepper 8. Barbeary 9. Spencer 10. Russell
11. Arundell 12. Ojomoh 13. Lawrence 14. Cokanasiga 15. De Glanville
16. Frost 17. FVW 18. TdT 19. Moloney 20. Reid 21. TCS 22. Carreras 23. Underhill
Thanks BSJ, as you say our recent history at Ashton Gate is not good and whilst looking forward to a great game my heart says a 4/5 pointer, unfortunately my head says 1/2 league points I’m really hoping for heart over head ! 
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Karl Dickson in charge..........................................................
I think teams know where they stand with Dickson.
There are others who would worry me more if they had the whistle on Friday.
PG
There are others who would worry me more if they had the whistle on Friday.
PG
Quote:Bath Blues
It's a joke Dicko again!
Personally don't have an issue with Dickson in charge and the fact he consistently gets high profile games suggests he actually is a good ref. It's certainly better than having Tempest again.
Cheers BSJ. Like the look of your team and enjoyed the preview.
If, as TRS suggests, Briz pack is a different beast with no Rubiolo, would it be prudent to give Ewan Richards a start? No secret we are light on options in the second row at present.
A Ewels injury scare makes next weekend more daunting in that department against an all-international lock combo. More so than any other position I'd argue. Plus, local boy in a local derby...got to give him a shot at some point!
That said, full faith in JvG as always....unlike Briz fans with Lam it seems.
If, as TRS suggests, Briz pack is a different beast with no Rubiolo, would it be prudent to give Ewan Richards a start? No secret we are light on options in the second row at present.
A Ewels injury scare makes next weekend more daunting in that department against an all-international lock combo. More so than any other position I'd argue. Plus, local boy in a local derby...got to give him a shot at some point!
That said, full faith in JvG as always....unlike Briz fans with Lam it seems.
Quote:OutsideBathQuote:Bath Blues
It's a joke Dicko again!
Personally don't have an issue with Dickson in charge and the fact he consistently gets high profile games suggests he actually is a good ref.
Exactly. If we don't win then it will be on us nothing to do with ref. He's very good
Quote:gaz59Quote:OutsideBathQuote:Bath Blues
It's a joke Dicko again!
Personally don't have an issue with Dickson in charge and the fact he consistently gets high profile games suggests he actually is a good ref.
Exactly. If we don't win then it will be on us nothing to do with ref. He's very good
He's idiosyncratic but equally so for both sides. What he DOESN’T do is make up his mind that just one side is cheating in the scrum and then ref that way for the rest of the game.
... IMHO, of course.
Now in Honolulu
Mini Maximus and Marjo20
As a scrumhalf, fullback and wing I find all things front row as bit puzzling!!
I go through past team sheets to try and get everybody in the right place but I was thinking more about the getting 8 other players into 4 positions!!
I will work harder next time
As a scrumhalf, fullback and wing I find all things front row as bit puzzling!!
I go through past team sheets to try and get everybody in the right place but I was thinking more about the getting 8 other players into 4 positions!!
I will work harder next time
Re: Dickson, agree with above I know people want to hate him but you don’t get the top games in Europe if you are rubbish.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Quote:Bath Supporter Jack
Mini Maximus and Marjo20
As a scrumhalf, fullback and wing I find all things front row as bit puzzling!!
I go through past team sheets to try and get everybody in the right place but I was thinking more about the getting 8 other players into 4 positions!!
I will work harder next time
I thought you might have cottoned on to something original for a minute BSJ! I do similar things all the time when copying and pasting names around between the starting XV and bench, but what matters is you have the right four props in your 23 :-)
Got my tickets for this, always a good experience albeit a poor hunting ground in recent memory.
We have to go get the 5 points you’d think, and with everyone having a week off you’d hope we are fit and rested and ready to go all guns blazing for 4 crucial games!
Getting that home semi final is so so key - maybe Exeter can do us a favour?
We have to go get the 5 points you’d think, and with everyone having a week off you’d hope we are fit and rested and ready to go all guns blazing for 4 crucial games!
Getting that home semi final is so so key - maybe Exeter can do us a favour?
Interesting fixture in that it may have limited impact on the final table.
A loss with a single BP and a leic BP win puts them 3 ahead us and it all comes down to last game anyhow.
If even on match points does it come down to points difference? Think we are currently 33 ahead which is a decent buffer should it be needed.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2026:05:27:08:27:02 by Charlieboa1.
A loss with a single BP and a leic BP win puts them 3 ahead us and it all comes down to last game anyhow.
If even on match points does it come down to points difference? Think we are currently 33 ahead which is a decent buffer should it be needed.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2026:05:27:08:27:02 by Charlieboa1.
Think it's a big bonus we get a 13 day gap and then a 8 day gap between fixtures.
Leic only get a 6 day turnaround for the game at the rec- quite a big ask at this stage of the season.
Out competitive advantage is our squad depth and with a minimum of 3 games in 3 weeks and hopefully 4 in 4 it is going to inevitably be needed as we pick up knocks and possible further suspensions.
I would go something like :
Tdg
Arundell
Lawrence
Mojo
Hennessey
Russell
Spencer
Beno
Frost
Sela
Ewels
Richards
Hill
Pepper
Barbeary
Bench: kepu, fvw, tdt, malony, bayliss, reid, tcs, donoghue
Nothing too clever in that selection
I want tdt to play 65+ vs leic so want him playing less than 40 ideally.
Think Richards deserves a chance to stake a claim to replace roux for Tigers game.
Backrow is flip of a coin like normal.
Want to get some game time into hennessey and donoghue as they could be needed over the next month and light on minutes recently.
I think tdg deserves a start over carreras.
Lawrence lucky to start but hoping he has a point to prove, esp against bris given england non selection.
Leic only get a 6 day turnaround for the game at the rec- quite a big ask at this stage of the season.
Out competitive advantage is our squad depth and with a minimum of 3 games in 3 weeks and hopefully 4 in 4 it is going to inevitably be needed as we pick up knocks and possible further suspensions.
I would go something like :
Tdg
Arundell
Lawrence
Mojo
Hennessey
Russell
Spencer
Beno
Frost
Sela
Ewels
Richards
Hill
Pepper
Barbeary
Bench: kepu, fvw, tdt, malony, bayliss, reid, tcs, donoghue
Nothing too clever in that selection
I want tdt to play 65+ vs leic so want him playing less than 40 ideally.
Think Richards deserves a chance to stake a claim to replace roux for Tigers game.
Backrow is flip of a coin like normal.
Want to get some game time into hennessey and donoghue as they could be needed over the next month and light on minutes recently.
I think tdg deserves a start over carreras.
Lawrence lucky to start but hoping he has a point to prove, esp against bris given england non selection.
Quote:Bath Supporter Jack
As a scrumhalf, fullback and wing I find all things front row as bit puzzling!!
Are you Austin Healy incognito?
"Are you Austin Healy incognito?"
That - I would respectfully suggest - is a stretch!!!
That - I would respectfully suggest - is a stretch!!!
Ha Ha
Let's get back on the subject matter!
It is the longest of long shots, and yet not impossible should they enhance their stunning record in the derby against Bath, with a bonus point, Saracens lose at home to Harlequins, and Leicester deny Chiefs anything at Welford Road. In that unlikely scenario, Bristol would sit fourth in the table at the end of Round 17, and the doom and gloom would be lifted for another couple of weeks.
But relying on other results to go your way is never desirable and lacks the stamp of authority of a side that can truly challenge for the title, which is exactly where Bristol are right now.
Let's get back on the subject matter!
It is the longest of long shots, and yet not impossible should they enhance their stunning record in the derby against Bath, with a bonus point, Saracens lose at home to Harlequins, and Leicester deny Chiefs anything at Welford Road. In that unlikely scenario, Bristol would sit fourth in the table at the end of Round 17, and the doom and gloom would be lifted for another couple of weeks.
But relying on other results to go your way is never desirable and lacks the stamp of authority of a side that can truly challenge for the title, which is exactly where Bristol are right now.
Team up.Strong.
Bath Rugby: 1 Beno Obano, 2 Kepueli Tuipulotu, 3 Thomas du Toit, 4 Ted Hill, 5**** Charlie Ewels, 6 Ethan Staddon, 7 Guy Pepper, 8 Sam Underhill, 9 Ben Spencer, 10 Ciaran Donoghue, 11 Henry Arundell, 12 Max Ojomoh, 13 Ollie Lawrence, 14 Joe Cokanasiga, 15 Santi Carreras
Replacements: 16 Dan Frost, 17 Francois van Wyk, 18 Vilikesa Sela, 19 Ewan Richards, 20 Josh Bayliss, 21 Tom Carr-Smith, 22 Cameron Redpath, 23 Alfie Barbeary
PG
Bath Rugby: 1 Beno Obano, 2 Kepueli Tuipulotu, 3 Thomas du Toit, 4 Ted Hill, 5**** Charlie Ewels, 6 Ethan Staddon, 7 Guy Pepper, 8 Sam Underhill, 9 Ben Spencer, 10 Ciaran Donoghue, 11 Henry Arundell, 12 Max Ojomoh, 13 Ollie Lawrence, 14 Joe Cokanasiga, 15 Santi Carreras
Replacements: 16 Dan Frost, 17 Francois van Wyk, 18 Vilikesa Sela, 19 Ewan Richards, 20 Josh Bayliss, 21 Tom Carr-Smith, 22 Cameron Redpath, 23 Alfie Barbeary
PG
And Bristol Bears:
15. Noah Heward (42 apps), 14. Louis Rees-Zammit (14 apps), 13. Matias Moroni (14 apps), 12. Benhard Janse van Rensburg (72 apps), 11. Kalaveti Ravouvou (54 apps), 10. AJ MacGinty (56 apps), 9. Harry Randall (163 apps); 1. Ellis Genge (77 apps), 2. Harry Thacker (157 apps), 3. George Kloska (84 apps), 4. James Dun (68 apps), 5. Joe Batley (93 apps), 6. Joe Owen (63 apps), 7. Fitz Harding (c) (120 apps), 8. Santiago Grondona (31 apps).
System players: 16. Tomas Gwilliam (15 apps), 17. Jake Woolmore (185 apps), 18. Max Lahiff (126 apps), 19. Jimmy Halliwell (25 apps), 20. George Taylor (17 apps), 21. Kieran Marmion (73 apps), 22. Tom Jordan (19 apps), 23. Jack Bates (63 apps).
Unavailable: Gabriel Oghre, Pedro Rubiolo, Steele Barker, Paddy Pearce, Kenzie Jenkins, Steven Luatua, Viliame Mata, Benjamin Grondona, Kofi Cripps, James Williams, Gabriel Ibitoye, Victor Worsnip, Josh Carrington, Evan Morris, Ollie Harris.
PG
15. Noah Heward (42 apps), 14. Louis Rees-Zammit (14 apps), 13. Matias Moroni (14 apps), 12. Benhard Janse van Rensburg (72 apps), 11. Kalaveti Ravouvou (54 apps), 10. AJ MacGinty (56 apps), 9. Harry Randall (163 apps); 1. Ellis Genge (77 apps), 2. Harry Thacker (157 apps), 3. George Kloska (84 apps), 4. James Dun (68 apps), 5. Joe Batley (93 apps), 6. Joe Owen (63 apps), 7. Fitz Harding (c) (120 apps), 8. Santiago Grondona (31 apps).
System players: 16. Tomas Gwilliam (15 apps), 17. Jake Woolmore (185 apps), 18. Max Lahiff (126 apps), 19. Jimmy Halliwell (25 apps), 20. George Taylor (17 apps), 21. Kieran Marmion (73 apps), 22. Tom Jordan (19 apps), 23. Jack Bates (63 apps).
Unavailable: Gabriel Oghre, Pedro Rubiolo, Steele Barker, Paddy Pearce, Kenzie Jenkins, Steven Luatua, Viliame Mata, Benjamin Grondona, Kofi Cripps, James Williams, Gabriel Ibitoye, Victor Worsnip, Josh Carrington, Evan Morris, Ollie Harris.
PG
Quote:Bath Blues
No Russell, I have a bad feeling about this ....
I always have a bad feeling when we play Bristol!
Underhill at 8 feels like a weird one. Doesn't matter too much in open play but the job at the back of the scrum is pretty specialist.
Odd to have played Finn against Newcastle then to give him a break here so hope it's nothing more.
We should have enough to outlast Bristol and do the job though - their bench doesn't strike much fear at all
Odd to have played Finn against Newcastle then to give him a break here so hope it's nothing more.
We should have enough to outlast Bristol and do the job though - their bench doesn't strike much fear at all
Interesting selection but in JVG we trust, COYB!
Assume that its because the Tigers game is the clincher for the home semi as long as Bath get a bonus or 2?
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Assume that its because the Tigers game is the clincher for the home semi as long as Bath get a bonus or 2?
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Quote:theredseat
Underhill at 8 feels like a weird one. Doesn't matter too much in open play but the job at the back of the scrum is pretty specialist.
Sam has played 8 for us before, in a derby too- away at Glaws- and did well.
PG
A couple of weeks ago JVG stated that plans were for Ciaran to play this season. It really had to be the Bristol game so either Finn or Santi/Tom would have to stand down. I'm not surprised or worried by his selection.
Quote:P G TipsQuote:theredseat
Underhill at 8 feels like a weird one. Doesn't matter too much in open play but the job at the back of the scrum is pretty specialist.
Sam has played 8 for us before, in a derby too- away at Glaws- and did well.
PG
According to allrugby it was at home and Underhill went off injured after 10 mins.
A particularly strange looking back 5 setup that day:
Mike WILLIAMS 4
Charlie EWELS 5
Tom ELLIS 6
Ewan RICHARDS 7
Sam UNDERHILL 8
I was at that match and have no recollection of it all. Probably for the best given it was our 12th loss in a row at the time. Most of that time blurs into one big mass of unpleasantness
Pleased with the team - we've gone very strong bar the absence of Russell.
I like that TdT is starting. I'd like to think that we can get to a good lead and get some healthy minutes for the likes of Richards and TCS off the bench
I like that TdT is starting. I'd like to think that we can get to a good lead and get some healthy minutes for the likes of Richards and TCS off the bench
Quote:P G TipsQuote:theredseat
Underhill at 8 feels like a weird one. Doesn't matter too much in open play but the job at the back of the scrum is pretty specialist.
Sam has played 8 for us before, in a derby too- away at Glaws- and did well.
PG
Its strong but not that strong PG is Kepu first choice, Hill at 5, Sam at 8 and Staddon at 7 are compromises in the pack. Ciarran at 10 gives Finn rest pre Leicester, I don't mind that. I'm a bit concerned how that pack will go. Have to say though its super mobile!
I'll be interested to see if the Kepu/Ewels link up works at the line out.
I would say that there isn’t / shouldn’t be a 1st choice hooker at the moment, they all offer very different things and all are equally good in the round.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Quote:BathMatt53
I would say that there isn’t / shouldn’t be a 1st choice hooker at the moment, they all offer very different things and all are equally good in the round.
What about throwing in?
Interesting line up - I expect the Finn decision is purely a rest one. Two full weeks off for him before the sharp end of the season is good, and as we saw against Saints, Donoghue is more than capable!
3 7s in the back row, contest every breakdown and slow down their quick ball to stop that lightning offload game they can play.
Them bringing AJ in could go well, could be he gets gassed quick and we can take advantage!
3 7s in the back row, contest every breakdown and slow down their quick ball to stop that lightning offload game they can play.
Them bringing AJ in could go well, could be he gets gassed quick and we can take advantage!
I have a theory for TDT starting in that Genge is a Bears talisman - if he dominates or is allowed to rampage around the field it gives Bears a real buzz.
I may be wrong but the idea that TDT will keep Genge honest and really test him in the set piece will limit his energy and possibly nullify much of his threat. Like I said I may be wrong but that is how I see it.
Yet again JvG choosing to play a player who is destined for the opposition next season as if it were extra motivation to demonstrate just how good you are.
Rubio missing is huge for Bears - seriously rate that player along with Luatua.
Hopefully will be a great match - interesting AJ McGinty straight back into starting line up, that will certainly test his Achilles.
Max and Ollie will certainly not need to be fired up to face BJVR could not have come at a better time for them to hopefully stick 2 fingers up at Steve Borthwick.
Come on BATH....
I may be wrong but the idea that TDT will keep Genge honest and really test him in the set piece will limit his energy and possibly nullify much of his threat. Like I said I may be wrong but that is how I see it.
Yet again JvG choosing to play a player who is destined for the opposition next season as if it were extra motivation to demonstrate just how good you are.
Rubio missing is huge for Bears - seriously rate that player along with Luatua.
Hopefully will be a great match - interesting AJ McGinty straight back into starting line up, that will certainly test his Achilles.
Max and Ollie will certainly not need to be fired up to face BJVR could not have come at a better time for them to hopefully stick 2 fingers up at Steve Borthwick.
Come on BATH....
Quote:Ali1969
I have a theory for TDT starting in that Genge is a Bears talisman - if he dominates or is allowed to rampage around the field it gives Bears a real buzz.
I may be wrong but the idea that TDT will keep Genge honest and really test him in the set piece will limit his energy and possibly nullify much of his threat. Like I said I may be wrong but that is how I see it.
Seems a fair assessment to me
Missed it on first glance but Bristol are running out three props on their bench. Assume they'll be asking several players to give them some big minutes tomorrow
Quote:shipwreckedQuote:P G TipsQuote:theredseat
Underhill at 8 feels like a weird one. Doesn't matter too much in open play but the job at the back of the scrum is pretty specialist.
Sam has played 8 for us before, in a derby too- away at Glaws- and did well.
PG
Its strong but not that strong PG is Kepu first choice, Hill at 5, Sam at 8 and Staddon at 7 are compromises in the pack. Ciarran at 10 gives Finn rest pre Leicester, I don't mind that. I'm a bit concerned how that pack will go. Have to say though its super mobile!
I'll be interested to see if the Kepu/Ewels link up works at the line out.
Agreed sw - not the strongest, but still stronger than some away selections this term (e.g. Northampton Saints).
I suspect JvG's reasoning is that, whatever happened at Ashton Gate this weekend, Bath would still need to beat Leicester next weekend (unlikely Tigers would lose at home), so he wants to protect some key players -Russell in particular (who must be close to max games anyway).
PG
Quote:Ali1969
I have a theory for TDT starting in that Genge is a Bears talisman - if he dominates or is allowed to rampage around the field it gives Bears a real buzz.
I may be wrong but the idea that TDT will keep Genge honest and really test him in the set piece will limit his energy and possibly nullify much of his threat. Like I said I may be wrong but that is how I see it.
.
Couldn't agree more that this is a reaction to Genge. I love Genge in an England shirt but would really love TdT to give him an absolutely torrid time at scrum time.
Ref the hooker situation - I really hope Kepu can make a statement tomorrow that the 2 jersey is now his!!! Need his dynamic carries now more than ever as the back row lacks a true ball carrier.
trs
My memory may be playing tricks but my recollection is of a more recent match -i.e. in the JvG era, at Kingsholm where we won. Perhaps Underhill only packed down at 8 for part of the game, but I recall raising the same query as you-what about control of the ball at the base? IIRC he did fine (possibly because the front 5 were not under pressure).
Anyway, I doubt it is a desperation pick- Alfie & Bayliss are both on the bench. More likely JvG thinks that Sam can have a similar carry effect to Alfie.
If this selection can win at AG we will be well set up for the final three games.
PG
My memory may be playing tricks but my recollection is of a more recent match -i.e. in the JvG era, at Kingsholm where we won. Perhaps Underhill only packed down at 8 for part of the game, but I recall raising the same query as you-what about control of the ball at the base? IIRC he did fine (possibly because the front 5 were not under pressure).
Anyway, I doubt it is a desperation pick- Alfie & Bayliss are both on the bench. More likely JvG thinks that Sam can have a similar carry effect to Alfie.
If this selection can win at AG we will be well set up for the final three games.
PG
I feel conflicted over the inclusion of Staddon. Would love him to be player of the match but it will play on my mind the thought we are missing out on a quality player. Similar feelings about Alfie.
Quote:Francis Allen
I feel conflicted over the inclusion of Staddon. Would love him to be player of the match but it will play on my mind the thought we are missing out on a quality player.
Well he will certainly play out of his skin to impress his new employer but yep, I know what you mean about the flip side to that
I guess the team selection is with the Briz game plan in mind. We've sometimes struggled, especially away there when trying to simply impose a more measured, controlled game
Very interesting....
I sort of assumed that Finn would play every game and would tell JVG he wanted to play. This selection, or indeed non selection, makes sense.
The pack are different to my view, but look good. That is our strength in depth.
Like Dorset Boy, away at Bristol always makes me nervous and Bristol are going to come out blazing. Whilst they can't rescue their season beating B**h (as they write our name) would give them a fillip.
I sort of assumed that Finn would play every game and would tell JVG he wanted to play. This selection, or indeed non selection, makes sense.
The pack are different to my view, but look good. That is our strength in depth.
Like Dorset Boy, away at Bristol always makes me nervous and Bristol are going to come out blazing. Whilst they can't rescue their season beating B**h (as they write our name) would give them a fillip.
I know Underhill has played 8 before but it does seem an unusual decision, especially with 2 more seasoned 8s providing back row cover in Bayliss and Alfie. Santi at 15 is a good call, given his experience and Ciaran's relative greenness; likewise TdT to quietly shut up Genge.
Tom de Glanville - Adopted player 2024-5
Tom de Glanville - Adopted player 2024-5
I'd love to see Bayliss on the pitch from the start ...but no concerns at 10 after watching Ciaran in the last game up at Saints. He looked superb that day.
Looking forward to Rensberg versus Ojomoh/Lawrence given the recent England developments
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2026:05:28:14:54:15 by Pulteneyfan.
Looking forward to Rensberg versus Ojomoh/Lawrence given the recent England developments
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2026:05:28:14:54:15 by Pulteneyfan.
Finn’s on 25 games.
So can play R18 and in SF defeat to Tigers (🤣🤣) and then all 3 of Scotland’s games!
Seriously if he does breach the 30 that will feed in to his training plan for next season. It does appear that once again the Work Load management regulations (Player welfare) have got no teeth!!
I spoke with my contact at the RPA regarding a Northampton and Italian international player very recently.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2026:05:28:15:04:59 by tigersimon.
So can play R18 and in SF defeat to Tigers (🤣🤣) and then all 3 of Scotland’s games!
Seriously if he does breach the 30 that will feed in to his training plan for next season. It does appear that once again the Work Load management regulations (Player welfare) have got no teeth!!
I spoke with my contact at the RPA regarding a Northampton and Italian international player very recently.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2026:05:28:15:04:59 by tigersimon.
Rumours on Facebook that Finn has an Achilles issue - I say rumours as one person has said it and then lots of other repeating as gospel.
Seems unlikely as the more aware and in the know supporters on here haven’t said anything to that effect.
Seems unlikely as the more aware and in the know supporters on here haven’t said anything to that effect.
Quote:shipwreckedQuote:BathMatt53
I would say that there isn’t / shouldn’t be a 1st choice hooker at the moment, they all offer very different things and all are equally good in the round.
What about throwing in?
Realistically it doesn't matter who is throwing in, we seem to have the capacity to lose lineouts regardless.
Team does appear strong enough to win, but it's a derby and our record at their football ground is poor so anything could happen.
Quote:BathRob
Rumours on Facebook that Finn has an Achilles issue - I say rumours as one person has said it and then lots of other repeating as gospel.
Seems unlikely as the more aware and in the know supporters on here haven’t said anything to that effect.
Don't want to add any speculative fuel to the rumour but, to me anyway, he didn't look entirely comfortable v NRB and his goal kicking wasn't great
Quote:shipwreckedQuote:BathMatt53
I would say that there isn’t / shouldn’t be a 1st choice hooker at the moment, they all offer very different things and all are equally good in the round.
What about throwing in?
Frost appears* the most accurate with the darts and is very fast, but smaller stature in the scrum / around the field.
Kepu is very fast and strong and a menace in the loose. Also seems OK in the scrums. Appears* to have some wayward darts on occasion.
Dunny appears* middling on the darts, huge defence and the most combative, but does pick up cards from being over enthusiatic. Excellent in the scrums, as a former Porp. Club Legend (obvs).
[*entirely in my head, I haven't looked it up]
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Quote:BathMatt53Quote:shipwreckedQuote:BathMatt53
I would say that there isn’t / shouldn’t be a 1st choice hooker at the moment, they all offer very different things and all are equally good in the round.
What about throwing in?
Frost appears* the most accurate with the darts and is very fast, but smaller stature in the scrum / around the field.
Kepu is very fast and strong and a menace in the loose. Also seems OK in the scrums. Appears* to have some wayward darts on occasion.
Dunny appears* middling on the darts, huge defence and the most combative, but does pick up cards from being over enthusiatic. Excellent in the scrums, as a former Porp. Club Legend (obvs).
[*entirely in my head, I haven't looked it up]
Which is why I mentioned Ewels, Kepu seems to throw better when Ewels is calling the lineouts. There was an article the Times that said "Bath’s lineout had “wobbled” earlier in the game, but when Kepu Tuipulotu came on he “hit six from six throws in the closing exchanges despite difficult conditions.”
His accuracy improves when the organisation is clear, experienced and calm. My personal observation is that he throws well to Hill at the lineout so the omens are good.
Although Bristol supporters are distressed by the players missing those chosen seem to have had a great many appearances. What does that indicate?
Quote:Bath Hammer
Although Bristol supporters are distressed by the players missing those chosen seem to have had a great many appearances. What does that indicate?
Bris squad looks good on paper I think- well capable of causing us some problems.
Important to start well given their confidence must have been knocked by that saints defeat.
Our selection is v interesting as always.
Tdt could have a heavy workload over remainder of season but guess that's why we managed him so carefully. Him keeping genge quiet makes sense.
Persisting with hill at lock in the absence of Roux. Wonder if thar will happen again next week.
I have liked underhill at 8 the couple of times its happened. Hope miles is ok.
Staddon feels like a case of picking someone fresh and highly motivated to make a point- I like it.
Pleased richards and donoghue are in the 23- felt it was important to get some game time into them.
Fingers crossed finn is just precautionery/ managing his minutes. Donoghue and santi pretty useful back ups.
Tdt could have a heavy workload over remainder of season but guess that's why we managed him so carefully. Him keeping genge quiet makes sense.
Persisting with hill at lock in the absence of Roux. Wonder if thar will happen again next week.
I have liked underhill at 8 the couple of times its happened. Hope miles is ok.
Staddon feels like a case of picking someone fresh and highly motivated to make a point- I like it.
Pleased richards and donoghue are in the 23- felt it was important to get some game time into them.
Fingers crossed finn is just precautionery/ managing his minutes. Donoghue and santi pretty useful back ups.
Is 3 props on bench for bris a eqp thing? Or a running out of locks/ backrowers thing?
Assuming halliwell still is a prop!
Assuming halliwell still is a prop!
Seems a bit odd, if it was an EQP thing surely another back rower would have been the call?
Agree we need a fast start, if the crowd get quiet in the first 15 minutes then it could start becoming a difficult night for them!
Agree we need a fast start, if the crowd get quiet in the first 15 minutes then it could start becoming a difficult night for them!
The important thing is that Lawrence shows up well. He has frankly not deserved his place in recent times. Good players rarely decline significantly so we should be looking for a major return to form especially contesting with Van Rensburg having been newly promoted to England which I don’t like at all.
Quote:BathRob
Seems a bit odd, if it was an EQP thing surely another back rower would have been the call?
Agree we need a fast start, if the crowd get quiet in the first 15 minutes then it could start becoming a difficult night for them!
Seems odd all round to me. Don't think I have ever seen it before.
Quote:Charlieboa1Quote:BathRob
Seems a bit odd, if it was an EQP thing surely another back rower would have been the call?
Agree we need a fast start, if the crowd get quiet in the first 15 minutes then it could start becoming a difficult night for them!
Seems odd all round to me. Don't think I have ever seen it before.
Some way to go to beat La Rochelle for weirdest bench of the year. 6-2 with four props and two teenage half backs: [all.rugby]
I have to say I am struggling to see why such negativity from Bris fans - so they took a hiding against Saints - that is the modern game if you are off by 5-10% these type of results happen.
Their starting XV looks strong to me, they are at home, a place we have never done well at - yes I get the bench might look weak but that still does not represent the negativity which I hope feeds onto the pitch.
I look at their unavailable list and yes they are missing some huge players such as Luatua, Matta, one of the Grondona brothers and probably for me the biggest miss Rubio, but all teams suffer that type of issues - we are missing Jaco (all Season), Bernard VDL, Louis H, Will Muir & Quinn Roux and obviously Will Stuart so they are not alone in missing key players.
We know we are in for a hell of a match and we need to dominate physically and keep our foot on their throat for the entire 80 minutes and take the officials out of the equation.
Let us cheer the boys home and put this bogey ground to bed.....Come on BATH
Their starting XV looks strong to me, they are at home, a place we have never done well at - yes I get the bench might look weak but that still does not represent the negativity which I hope feeds onto the pitch.
I look at their unavailable list and yes they are missing some huge players such as Luatua, Matta, one of the Grondona brothers and probably for me the biggest miss Rubio, but all teams suffer that type of issues - we are missing Jaco (all Season), Bernard VDL, Louis H, Will Muir & Quinn Roux and obviously Will Stuart so they are not alone in missing key players.
We know we are in for a hell of a match and we need to dominate physically and keep our foot on their throat for the entire 80 minutes and take the officials out of the equation.
Let us cheer the boys home and put this bogey ground to bed.....Come on BATH
It wasn’t just a 5% off loss though - it was a proper proper battering. You could have given a mercy ruling result at half time, so I get why the fans are unhappy. Bristol started off very brightly this season but have badly faded down the stretch, they look tired and out of ideas.
That being said, I can only remember one result at Ashton Gate in recent memory where we won so all bets are off!
If we get on top early you can already predict the crowd getting on top of them so it’s key we keep it tight and don’t do our usual concede inside the first five minutes trick.
That being said, I can only remember one result at Ashton Gate in recent memory where we won so all bets are off!
If we get on top early you can already predict the crowd getting on top of them so it’s key we keep it tight and don’t do our usual concede inside the first five minutes trick.
I am with you Ali 1969.......this is a contest that we could easily lose.
Our last away game we were well beaten by Exeter and it is ominous that there has been no comments out of the Bristol camp (well none that I am aware off). They are bottling everything up to come out at 7.45 tonight...
I am very nervous!!
Our last away game we were well beaten by Exeter and it is ominous that there has been no comments out of the Bristol camp (well none that I am aware off). They are bottling everything up to come out at 7.45 tonight...
I am very nervous!!
I'm with you Ali, these games are always close and I think that the teams are well matched. Then add it being in Bristol and it will be a bum twitcher for fans of both teams. The bookies have Bath by 10 but it could really go either way IMO.
(I also don't think that the likes of 96 year old Luatua is really that much of an issue and agree that injuries are a part of normal business for all Prem teams).
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
(I also don't think that the likes of 96 year old Luatua is really that much of an issue and agree that injuries are a part of normal business for all Prem teams).
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Quote:Bath Supporter Jack
I am with you Ali 1969.......this is a contest that we could easily lose.
Our last away game we were well beaten by Exeter and it is ominous that there has been no comments out of the Bristol camp (well none that I am aware off). They are bottling everything up to come out at 7.45 tonight...
I am very nervous!!
Oh don't worry about that. It was apparantly Joe Batley's turn to do the 'this means more' quotes this time around
[www.rugbypass.com]
Gawd it’s getting even worse over there on the Briz board, a contributor saying that Bath will put 100 on them now…!
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Strange
some on 'ere think we might lose....and some on there think they will lose.
Obviously a very close match in store!
some on 'ere think we might lose....and some on there think they will lose.
Obviously a very close match in store!
It would almost be less surprising- given the league’s swings and roundabouts and the way they can run hot- if they put 100 on us!
Looking forward to watching Donoghue behind a first XV pack and with Spencer. But I dislike this fixture immensely- I’d take a 1 point win of any variety.
Question- I’m abroad and wondering if purchasing a VPN, setting to UK, and watching via HBO app will work, does anyone know, please? Or is my best bet one of those spam infected streaming sites? Thank you.
Looking forward to watching Donoghue behind a first XV pack and with Spencer. But I dislike this fixture immensely- I’d take a 1 point win of any variety.
Question- I’m abroad and wondering if purchasing a VPN, setting to UK, and watching via HBO app will work, does anyone know, please? Or is my best bet one of those spam infected streaming sites? Thank you.
You may already have a VPN if you use an antivirus such as Norton (ie no need to buy another)?
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
I’ve not tried it on the HBO app, but VPN has worked for other apps to watch the rugby in the past. You might have to hop around and try different countries or IPs. Any chance that it’s free to air in the country you are in?
Quote:BathMatt53
Gawd it’s getting even worse over there on the Briz board, a contributor saying that Bath will put 100 on them now…!
Converted try every 6 minutes, it would be some going. To what end though its still only 5 points?
Sweet Jesus - in the ground and they just put a ‘roar-o meter’ on screens
It might be the single most cringe inducing thing I’ve ever seen in a rugby ground
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
It might be the single most cringe inducing thing I’ve ever seen in a rugby ground
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Lineouts have been fine but feels like they're being run at Captains Run pace
Guy Pepper nearly splashed himself dead… Good D in this first 30.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Feels like a) our D has stepped up massively and is smothering their usual quick passing game b) despite butchering some chances it feels like we are dominating and Bristol are living off scraps.
That said, if any team can turn scrap into gold it’s Bristol so job is nowhere near done
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
That said, if any team can turn scrap into gold it’s Bristol so job is nowhere near done
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Reckon we’re going a nice job of keeping Bristol at arms length so far. Line out still bringing me out in a rash and we could be a bit more clinical but all fairly solid at half way
Ted Hill running over Genge was impressive and dare I say it, enjoyable!
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Looked to me like he thought he could catch it
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
No way was that a yellow. He was clearly trying to hook the ball backwards. Reffing to the minutiae is ridiculous.
Quote:Utterly ridiculous@Hydor18
No way was that a yellow. He was clearly trying to hook the ball backwards. Reffing to the minutiae is ridiculous.
He's never catching it. Literally what the law is for
Has the ref even warned Bristol yet?
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Keeping Bristol in this game with poor discipline and a lack of accuracy
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Not a lot going for Bath tonight in terms of bounce of the ball.
I’m also not sure that CD at 10 and Carreras at 15 has really worked, maybe other way around would have been better?
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2026:05:29:21:12:21 by BathMatt53.
I’m also not sure that CD at 10 and Carreras at 15 has really worked, maybe other way around would have been better?
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2026:05:29:21:12:21 by BathMatt53.
Quote:BathMatt53
Not a lot going for Bath tonight in terms of bounce of the ball.
Maybe not but we should be miles ahead by now regardless
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Quote:Yes, Max and Ollie having to work off scraps a lotBathMatt53
Not a lot going for Bath tonight in terms of bounce of the ball.
I’m also not sure that CD at 10 and Carreras at 15 has really worked, maybe other way around would have been better?
It’s going to be one of those nights isn’t it…
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
We seem determined to make this game hard for ourselves
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
This is where a bit of savvyness to not give the card away has to kick in. Still so long in the game
Jordan has changed the game for them, continuously able to get on the outside of Lawrence, and then a couple of short chips on the kick return
Is this really the best we can do against a side that shipped 90 points last time out? We don't look ready for this run in. Poor performance so far, I hope we can sneak the win 🤞
Quote:A.M 180
Do we have anything other than pick and go?
I’d like is to stop trying these ridiculous overhead wonder passes
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Quote:A.M 180
Good call from Dickson
100%
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
And we cock Op yet another chance
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
We have totally lost this mentally
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Well we won’t be beating Tigers on this form whether we win this game or (as it seems) not.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Quote:Yup, very hard to see anything other than a fizzle out of a season at this stageBathMatt53
Well we won’t be beating Tigers on this form whether we win this game or (as it seems) not.
Shambolic display
No leadership on the pitch at all
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
No leadership on the pitch at all
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Dickson again!
Bath need to wake up Bath
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2026:05:29:21:39:13 by CoochieCoo.
Bath need to wake up Bath
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2026:05:29:21:39:13 by CoochieCoo.
Quote:Really don't think it's time to be blaming Dickson, who's had a good gameBath Blues
Dickson again!
Bath need to wake up.
We're appalling and we're facing a humbling end to the season
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2026:05:29:21:45:14 by CoochieCoo.
The usual ropey discipline and a lack of points when we're on top. Fatal flaws.
Not beating this Bristol side is a shocker but only backs up the other lacklustre performances.
Not beating this Bristol side is a shocker but only backs up the other lacklustre performances.
I'm afraid I can not see how we make it beyond the semi-finals, home or away, when we're playing like this
Hate to say it but it hasn’t been ‘right’ since Bordeaux (OK anyone would look decent vs Newcastle). A few players well below their best again.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
We need to wake up.
Too many players not performing, Lawrence and Ojomoh looked like they have never played together before.
It's poor and some strong leaders need to step up.
Too many players not performing, Lawrence and Ojomoh looked like they have never played together before.
It's poor and some strong leaders need to step up.
We are slowly getting found out and that doesn’t bode well for the run in. There was too much angry passing at 10 and midfield when a gentle option would have seen us through. Ultimately Bristol had the want and we didn’t have the answers.
What happens to us at Ashton Gate?
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2026:05:29:21:52:15 by CoochieCoo.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2026:05:29:21:52:15 by CoochieCoo.
We have little surprise in attack other than Finn producing a rabbit from the hat. We look disjointed...like we've not played together regularly
Quote:BathMatt53
Hate to say it but it hasn’t been ‘right’ since Bordeaux (OK anyone would look decent vs Newcastle). A few players well below their best again.
Exeter away was just as bad ?
Clear head contact with Ted Hill and nothing from Dickson or TMO.
Happens all the time we are getting nothing from the officials.
Dickson blew his whistle and start to signal held up only to give the try. Its shocking and fed up with fans defending him. He is awful.
Happens all the time we are getting nothing from the officials.
Dickson blew his whistle and start to signal held up only to give the try. Its shocking and fed up with fans defending him. He is awful.
Quote:Bath Blues
Clear head contact with Ted Hill and nothing from Dickson or TMO.
Happens all the time we are getting nothing from the officials.
Dickson blew his whistle and start to signal held up only to give the try. It's shocking and fed up with fans defending him. He is awful.
He wasnt perfect - but also he wasnt the reason we lost.
Quote:]Bath Blues
Clear head contact with Ted Hill and nothing from Dickson or TMO.
Happens all the time we are getting nothing from the officials.
Dickson blew his whistle and start to signal held up only to give the try. Its shocking and fed up with fans defending him. He is awful.
To be fair, think his bad calls balanced out for both teams.
Nah, sorry but that loss wasn’t down to Dixon. I bet if you asked most Briz fans they would say he gave decisions against them. That was down to Bath failing to close out the game that was there for the taking.
Quote:PulteneyfanQuote:BathMatt53
Hate to say it but it hasn’t been ‘right’ since Bordeaux (OK anyone would look decent vs Newcastle). A few players well below their best again.
Exeter away was just as bad ?
Yes, the week after Bordeaux.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
We failed to turn our first half dominance into points. That cost us in the end and is why we lost.
Dickson his usual curates egg - he ignored Henry being taken out well after his chip through for the non-Barberry try, which should have been a penalty. But he was correct on the Underhill clearout. He no doubt gave us some favourable calls too, so balanced out for both teams.
We were nilled in the second half.
We're not getting to the final this year, unless a huge upturn in efficiency next two weeks.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2026:05:29:21:54:13 by Dorset Boy.
Dickson his usual curates egg - he ignored Henry being taken out well after his chip through for the non-Barberry try, which should have been a penalty. But he was correct on the Underhill clearout. He no doubt gave us some favourable calls too, so balanced out for both teams.
We were nilled in the second half.
We're not getting to the final this year, unless a huge upturn in efficiency next two weeks.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2026:05:29:21:54:13 by Dorset Boy.
Re: Dickson, he had a good game IMO. Nobody can ever be perfect but all of his decisions looked spot on to me.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
I thought all our backs, with the exception of Cockansigna, were poor. It seems that Borthwick made the right decision selecting Van Rensburg.
Quote:The bomb squad is dead.Dorset Boy
We were nilled in the second half.
The belief seen in the Saints game feels like decades ago
40 minutes of second half rugby and no points. Against this Bristol outfit. Awful
I thought Underhill was very lucky, head contact was debatable however he seemed to come in from the side.
Shouldn’t have lost that. Defence was actually pretty good for most of the match I thought, but not enough in attack. Disappointed with Henry’s performance - think he needs to do more. Sam and Ted didnt deserve to be on losing side. Max and Ollie trying too hard or left with too much to do?
Quote:Bath Hammer
I thought all our backs, with the exception of Cockansigna, were poor. It seems that Borthwick made the right decision selecting Van Rensburg.
Unfortunately Donaghue certainly didn’t get them clicking, Max O had some awful ball to work with. In the absence of Finn it hasn’t to be Carreras at 10 (who is wasted at 15).
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
We’ve gone so flat at such a bad time. Donoghue had a bit of a howler unfortunately and the rest of the attack is nowhere near good enough at the moment to pick up the slack. Line out shonky, discipline not good enough. Too many things adding up
Credit to Hill tonight. Thought he was relentless throughout
Credit to Hill tonight. Thought he was relentless throughout
Quote:Stopsy
I thought Underhill was very lucky, head contact was debatable however he seemed to come in from the side.
Very lucky because he didn’t give away a pen for coming in from the side? The clear out only looked worse because Thacker is so small and went backwards rapidly.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
It’s not we didn’t capitalise on first half dominance, we lost that game in the second half and specifically the final quarter. The never too high never too low mantra is fine but sometimes you’ve just got to show some fire and hunger.
Unless I am mistaken you are not allowed to enter a breakdown from the side, therefore a penalty to Bristol at least rather than scrum to Bath.
Harding was in the way, he had to come in at the side. It happens a hundred times a game, never seen it blown up.
Quote:Feels like a long time since we've been anything but low.Wynners
It’s not we didn’t capitalise on first half dominance, we lost that game in the second half and specifically the final quarter. The never too high never too low mantra is fine but sometimes you’ve just got to show some fire and hunger.
Would love to know how morale really is in the squad. This feels like a run of poor performances we've not experienced since the annus horribilis
Quote:Stopsy
Unless I am mistaken you are not allowed to enter a breakdown from the side, therefore a penalty to Bristol at least rather than scrum to Bath.
Yes. But why the ‘very lucky’? Dickson literally discussed it with his team and thought it was fine. Even if it wasn’t it was just a pen, Bath didn’t score from the scrum anyway.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Quote:Treble
I didn't hear from JVG post match, did he have anything to say?
‘I apologise’ would be enough after that
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Quote:Stopsy
I thought Underhill was very lucky, head contact was debatable however he seemed to come in from the side.
I agree re in from the side , but the was a briz player on the floor preventing access from the back foot. Could have been a penalty for Bath.
I didn’t have the sound on so sorry that I missed the ref conversation. If the Bristol player was in the way then yes, penalised him but it doesn’t give Underhill Carre Blanche to come in from the side. That Bath didn’t score from it is neither here nor there.
Obviously as a Tigers supporter I didn’t want Bath to win this one which probably blinded me to the Bristol player being in the way.
Obviously as a Tigers supporter I didn’t want Bath to win this one which probably blinded me to the Bristol player being in the way.
Quote:Stopsy
I didn’t have the sound on so sorry that I missed the ref conversation. If the Bristol player was in the way then yes, penalised him but it doesn’t give Underhill Carre Blanche to come in from the side. That Bath didn’t score from it is neither here nor there.
Obviously as a Tigers supporter I didn’t want Bath to win this one which probably blinded me to the Bristol player being in the way.
After next week, just pop on here for all the cup final tickets that will suddenly come up for sale Stopsy.
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
That was quite poor in many places. Thought Hill and Underhill looked good and Big Joe was industrious but everything else seemed disjointed. And a Penalty attempt from in our own half is a bit of a hail Mary!
Thought Dickson was excellent tonight - few 50/50 calls but got all the important stuff right.
On this evidence, and a quick look at the table, Northampton are the only team who deserve the title this year. 5 losses is too many to be champion even if the playoffs make it possible.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2026:05:29:22:37:55 by Benisjammin.
Thought Dickson was excellent tonight - few 50/50 calls but got all the important stuff right.
On this evidence, and a quick look at the table, Northampton are the only team who deserve the title this year. 5 losses is too many to be champion even if the playoffs make it possible.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2026:05:29:22:37:55 by Benisjammin.
Dickson was fine tonight. We didn't score a single point in the second half. Not ideal.
That was a tough watch.
It's always hard to stay balanced in the immediate aftermath, especially when we were leading at half time, but at the start of the season JVG probably identified that as a game that he'd want to take two points from. The disappointment, of course, is that we could and should have taken five.
Somehow JVG needs to find a way to lift the team because they don't seem emotionally right to me. I agree with the posters who say Bristol wanted it more, but I thought TDT, Ted and Sam were exceptional (Ted POTM for me if Bath had won).
It's always hard to stay balanced in the immediate aftermath, especially when we were leading at half time, but at the start of the season JVG probably identified that as a game that he'd want to take two points from. The disappointment, of course, is that we could and should have taken five.
Somehow JVG needs to find a way to lift the team because they don't seem emotionally right to me. I agree with the posters who say Bristol wanted it more, but I thought TDT, Ted and Sam were exceptional (Ted POTM for me if Bath had won).
Quote:Benisjammin
And a Penalty attempt from in our own half is a bit of a hail Mary!
.
Yeah hated that call. Good on Santi in a way to back himself but never felt likely to be made. Admittedly a kick to touch doesn’t move you forward much from there plus the lottery of our line out but a scrum in the middle of the park is a great spot to make ground from
Quote:theredseatQuote:Benisjammin
And a Penalty attempt from in our own half is a bit of a hail Mary!
.
Yeah hated that call. Good on Santi in a way to back himself but never felt likely to be made. Admittedly a kick to touch doesn’t move you forward much from there plus the lottery of our line out but a scrum in the middle of the park is a great spot to make ground from
100% agree. Given that we had already continued to play, a scrum or even a quick tap would have got us into their half and the chance of more points.
Quote:BathMatt53Quote:Stopsy
Unless I am mistaken you are not allowed to enter a breakdown from the side, therefore a penalty to Bristol at least rather than scrum to Bath.
Yes. But why the ‘very lucky’? Dickson literally discussed it with his team and thought it was fine. Even if it wasn’t it was just a pen, Bath didn’t score from the scrum anyway.
If Underhill coming in from the side -in attack -is penalised, why should not Harding doing the same, in defence only 3M from his line be the same?
Not that Dickson's decisions cost Bath the game -they didn't. Several scoring opportunities went begging through basic skill errors.
PG
2 things that annoyed me most tonight
- Pepper’s gormless swallow dive when he could have got 5-10 metres closer to the posts (2 point losing margin anyone?)
- the farcical quadruple-jeopardy of Arundell brushing the ball with his fingertip - no guarantee LRZ catches that, no guarantee he scores, and if he does score it’s probably in the corner and the conversion is missed
Apart from that I thought we really went at in the first half and disrupted their flow well; but Bristol just wouldn’t let go, so fair play to them.
- Pepper’s gormless swallow dive when he could have got 5-10 metres closer to the posts (2 point losing margin anyone?)
- the farcical quadruple-jeopardy of Arundell brushing the ball with his fingertip - no guarantee LRZ catches that, no guarantee he scores, and if he does score it’s probably in the corner and the conversion is missed
Apart from that I thought we really went at in the first half and disrupted their flow well; but Bristol just wouldn’t let go, so fair play to them.
It feels like we’re fizzing out as others are cranking up.
Have we rotated a little too much? I get we’ve been managing player workloads but we just looked disjointed tonight.
I was also struck by the BBC interview with Ted earlier this week where he said he hasn’t been in form. I wouldn’t have said that - I would have said he’s been held back and having to come off the bench too much. Same for Redpath who looks like he’s playing beneath his usual level but hasn’t had the chance to consistently play himself in to form. Meanwhile Lawrence is regularly starting but not firing.
There’s a lot of positives to this season - Arundell has surpassed pretty much all expectations, Kepu & Sela have emerged, Joe Coka has played infinitely better, Bayliss & Reid have been phenomenal. But we look like we’re now stuck in cruise control.
Have we rotated a little too much? I get we’ve been managing player workloads but we just looked disjointed tonight.
I was also struck by the BBC interview with Ted earlier this week where he said he hasn’t been in form. I wouldn’t have said that - I would have said he’s been held back and having to come off the bench too much. Same for Redpath who looks like he’s playing beneath his usual level but hasn’t had the chance to consistently play himself in to form. Meanwhile Lawrence is regularly starting but not firing.
There’s a lot of positives to this season - Arundell has surpassed pretty much all expectations, Kepu & Sela have emerged, Joe Coka has played infinitely better, Bayliss & Reid have been phenomenal. But we look like we’re now stuck in cruise control.
Was the lineout that bad? Didn’t clock it when previous weeks it had felt obvious.
Quote:Optimist
- the farcical quadruple-jeopardy of Arundell brushing the ball with his fingertip - no guarantee LRZ catches that, no guarantee he scores, and if he does score it’s probably in the corner and the conversion is missed
Apart from that I thought we really went at in the first half and disrupted their flow well; but Bristol just wouldn’t let go, so fair play to them.
Rugby is rife with these 'interpretations' and, honestly, we be better off just letting the ref decide. He was facing backwards, had to land, had to shake off Arundell (who also would have to turn around) etc. etc. Not to mention if the ball had caught the inside of a finger and gone backwards...
Still, it felt like in the second half we gave Bristol an easier time. In the first half it felt like every ruck was contested. When they started flooding towards us in the second half, we chose to move players away from the ruck and contest fewer. Don't know if it was tactical or we just started panicking.
The rotation didn't really work in this case. Means we've now essentially got a full throttle double-header against Leicester. Gotta hope we find some fluency.
What a pathetic post. Given our record at AG many Bath fans won't have been surprised at losing tonight and not sure what you achieved by stating the bl33ding obvious. As to the issue over BJVR; not too many people are questioning his ability, it's the issue over players being adopted by other countries that has divided opinion, but thanks for your insightful post.
We are suddenly looking a mediocre team. We’ve had serious losses to both Exeter & Bristol with no excuses. We did turn up against Bordeaux & did an effective, though patchy, job against NRB. We have to hope that either Exeter do an unlikely job on Leicester or they are tired & well below par against us. Otherwise our win last year will just be a one off which it might be anyway if we get to the final - a very brief period of ascendancy.
I think you have to see how they respond next week and in the game(s) that follow. We've certainly dipped in form over the last few weeks but a win v Tigers puts a different complexion on things. I'll wait and see how they respond now they've put themselves in a situation where they'll need to win 3 consecutive games against very good teams to retain the title but still won't regard this season as being mediocre if we fall short. Years of watching us aspiring to mediocrity without achieving it allows me to be a bit more phlegmatic although I do think that when we're not clicking we aren't able to do the basics well enough to control games.
Quote:I must admit having seen him play live two weeks ago he’s certainly learned from the schooling Tom Litchfield gave himinatthebreakdown
You lost and BJVR justified his England call-up.
Not really surprised Bristol won but disappointed by the way we lost. A carbon copy of Exeter game where they wanted it more than we did and instead of dominating the last quarter we looked tired and rattled. Agree about Peppers flop, it should be so easy to tell all players to get as close to the sticks as possible when scoring tries and no showboating.
We are not anywhere near the team we were last season and this seems to come down to playing a much more structured, play by numbers type of game which seems to have had a negative effect on our back line which looked pretty hopeless today
At least we have Tigers at home, but we must play much better than today.
We are not anywhere near the team we were last season and this seems to come down to playing a much more structured, play by numbers type of game which seems to have had a negative effect on our back line which looked pretty hopeless today
At least we have Tigers at home, but we must play much better than today.
Quote:TomReagan
I think you have to see how they respond next week and in the game(s) that follow. We've certainly dipped in form over the last few weeks but a win v Tigers puts a different complexion on things. I'll wait and see how they respond now they've put themselves in a situation where they'll need to win 3 consecutive games against very good teams to retain the title but still won't regard this season as being mediocre if we fall short. Years of watching us aspiring to mediocrity without achieving it allows me to be a bit more phlegmatic although I do think that when we're not clicking we aren't able to do the basics well enough to control games.
I didn’t suggest it will have been a mediocre season but that the 23 who played last night were collectively mediocre. There was hardly a player that came out of that with credit. We somehow managed to have a lot of possession in the first half but ar no stage did we play well in my view & it only required a step up in pace by Bristol in the second half to dominate. Will they have previously gone a whole half without conceding a point in the entire season? Would Sarries & Exeter at their peak have ever played as badly? I’m not blaming the players as I’m sure they were trying their best but they could not do anything about it which is incredibly worrying as we were also fortunate with some refereeing decisions. Russell if fit might make a differemce & I would start with Reid, Frost & Hennessy for Underhill, Tuipoluto & Lawrence but that may not be enough. If it’s all down to being drained after an incredibly demanding season despite all the rotation & a fortnight off we are struffed!
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2026:05:30:03:30:30 by Bath Hammer.
Just watched the game. We were, not to put too fine a point on it, really poor. 9, 10, 12 did not gel at all and neither of our wingers shone because the ball they were getting was so dreadful. Chapeau to Briz for responding the way they did to last week. If we're going to defend the title, it'll be the hard way.
My MotM - Ted Hill. He's starting to do the stuff that gets noticed now instead just doing the stuff that doesn't.
A word for the ref - Karl Dickson is rapidly becoming a very fine ref indeed. His sympathy for the application of the laws and for the flow of the game is second to none. I thought he was excellent.
... IMHO, of course.
Now in Honolulu
My MotM - Ted Hill. He's starting to do the stuff that gets noticed now instead just doing the stuff that doesn't.
A word for the ref - Karl Dickson is rapidly becoming a very fine ref indeed. His sympathy for the application of the laws and for the flow of the game is second to none. I thought he was excellent.
... IMHO, of course.
Now in Honolulu
It was asking a lot of a young 10 to control a very emotional away derby on the back of 1 game in a year. But did Spencer revert to his nannying job which he used to do with Bailey?
I think the 'management ' of donoghue hasn't been great.
I was baffled at the time, and remain so, by the exeter and Newcastle selections when you look at them as a pair. How does donoghue not feature in either 23 when he really needs game time and was always likely to be used during the run in.
Tend to agree with Matt that santi at 10 and donoghue at 15 (or 22 with tdg at 15) may have made more sense. He is a class player , let's give him the best chance of success. Thought he was going to bag a wonder try at the end.
Agree with other posters tho that emotionally it all looks wrong. We seem to have v low confidence and it's disappointing a few losses have knocked us so badly after 3 seasons of being v v good. Find that odd.
That decision to go for goal oozed lack of confidence that we could play any error free rugby- really worrying and the rot seems to have set in. Need a massive performance vs leic now- at least minds will be focused!
I was baffled at the time, and remain so, by the exeter and Newcastle selections when you look at them as a pair. How does donoghue not feature in either 23 when he really needs game time and was always likely to be used during the run in.
Tend to agree with Matt that santi at 10 and donoghue at 15 (or 22 with tdg at 15) may have made more sense. He is a class player , let's give him the best chance of success. Thought he was going to bag a wonder try at the end.
Agree with other posters tho that emotionally it all looks wrong. We seem to have v low confidence and it's disappointing a few losses have knocked us so badly after 3 seasons of being v v good. Find that odd.
That decision to go for goal oozed lack of confidence that we could play any error free rugby- really worrying and the rot seems to have set in. Need a massive performance vs leic now- at least minds will be focused!
Quote:Optimist
It was asking a lot of a young 10 to control a very emotional away derby on the back of 1 game in a year. But did Spencer revert to his nannying job which he used to do with Bailey?
Yes if only we had an International 10 available for a game like this. Ted Hill was excellent but so was TDT both in the set piece and loose. Watching Genge on full charge being stopped dead was unreal.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
After a few negative posts from me to get it out the system I will try for some positives.
I thought kepu's throwing (1 or 2 wobbles aside) looked decent and good use of the likes of pepper, hill and bayliss.
Hill was excellent as mentioned by several others. He was physically dominant with and without the ball.
Think big joe has kicked on well this season, looks a well rounded player now I think.
Didn't notice any obvious injuries so jvg has plenty of options for the next 2 games.
On paper we are still extremely strong. it's not long ago our fringe players nearly drew with saints away , and our full bore team gave the European champions a game. If we can just nail some basics ( handling and passing was awful last night) and find some emotional energy/ confidence it's all still in out hands.
I thought kepu's throwing (1 or 2 wobbles aside) looked decent and good use of the likes of pepper, hill and bayliss.
Hill was excellent as mentioned by several others. He was physically dominant with and without the ball.
Think big joe has kicked on well this season, looks a well rounded player now I think.
Didn't notice any obvious injuries so jvg has plenty of options for the next 2 games.
On paper we are still extremely strong. it's not long ago our fringe players nearly drew with saints away , and our full bore team gave the European champions a game. If we can just nail some basics ( handling and passing was awful last night) and find some emotional energy/ confidence it's all still in out hands.
The pure matchup of next week fills me with me with dread to be honest.
We'll wait to see after today, but A BIG team, who've had regular scrum dominance over us, with a couple of former Bath players with points to prove, where just a win could be enough to take the semi-finals back to Leicester.
If we can't rise under those circumstances then we obviously don't deserve to defend the title
We'll wait to see after today, but A BIG team, who've had regular scrum dominance over us, with a couple of former Bath players with points to prove, where just a win could be enough to take the semi-finals back to Leicester.
If we can't rise under those circumstances then we obviously don't deserve to defend the title
The deliberate knock on interpretation by officials really needs to be reviewed. I've said numerous times that players have been penalised unfairly for accidental knock ons gifting the opposition a penalty try and a card. It's happening to all teams.
I'm certainly not blaming last night's loss on that, and clearly the officials have decided on an interpretation.
I'm certainly not blaming last night's loss on that, and clearly the officials have decided on an interpretation.
Quote:A.M 180
If we can't rise under those circumstances then we obviously don't deserve to defend the title
Exactly this. That would be 3 losses in 4 Prem games.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Quote:BathMatt53Quote:A.M 180
If we can't rise under those circumstances then we obviously don't deserve to defend the title
Exactly this. That would be 3 losses in 4 Prem games.
We've just lost 3 of our last 4 haven't we?
Hoping Hill isn't cited for shoulder challenge late in the game.
Time for Ollie Lawrence to be replaced by Cam Redpath, enough is enough.
Time for Ollie Lawrence to be replaced by Cam Redpath, enough is enough.
Quote:Rawce
Was the lineout that bad? Didn’t clock it when previous weeks it had felt obvious.
Think the stats will be ok as we only outright lost a couple but good number of those wins weren’t clean or were caught with the jumper either halfway up or halfway down.
I think I’ve probably said before it’s the lack of platform we get because too many won lineouts have to be tidied up and then whatever attack was planned is probably not going to have the timing you need
Quote:Dorset BoyQuote:BathMatt53Quote:A.M 180
If we can't rise under those circumstances then we obviously don't deserve to defend the title
Exactly this. That would be 3 losses in 4 Prem games.
We've just lost 3 of our last 4 haven't we?
Eek! (True)
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Quote:Dorset Boy
The deliberate knock on interpretation by officials really needs to be reviewed. I've said numerous times that players have been penalised unfairly for accidental knock ons gifting the opposition a penalty try and a card. It's happening to all teams.
I'm certainly not blaming last night's loss on that, and clearly the officials have decided on an interpretation.
Agreed. Not officials fault as reffing to laws but players jump with one arm like that for box kicks and restarts all the time and end up knocking it on and it’s never deemed intentional
The whole ‘position to catch it’ seems silly to me. Would much rather a rule that targets intentional or cynical actions
Not that this really excuses Arundell. He was taking a big risk going for the ball like he did in that situation with how it’s reffed
I'm not really sure I'm seeing it the same way as some. It looked pretty clear to me that LRZ catches and goes in quite easily if Arundell's fingertips don't deflect it. Feels like a reasonable bar met for a deliberate knock on
The galling thing being the ball was travelling so slowly, Henry would have been better served lining LRZ up and forcing him in to touch
The galling thing being the ball was travelling so slowly, Henry would have been better served lining LRZ up and forcing him in to touch
I’m with you AM. He couldn’t reach the ball, so take the man when he lands. He knows this.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
No real issues with the arundell decision, it was silly of him.
Thought dickson missed / got wrong about what any referee would ie reffing top class rugby is impossibly hard. I wad pleased he didn't buckle to the crowd like the tmo on the sam clear out- if you give pens/ yellow for a lovely clear out to the ribs then the game is in trouble.
Was there a slap down by bris in the build up to the frost non- try? Looked like we had a good overlap and I thought there was a deliberate knock on but wasn't reviewed in all the madness of the later scramble and try review. May well be wrong, just interested if anyone else saw it and whether it was just us dropping the ball which on last nights evidence is v likely!
Thought dickson missed / got wrong about what any referee would ie reffing top class rugby is impossibly hard. I wad pleased he didn't buckle to the crowd like the tmo on the sam clear out- if you give pens/ yellow for a lovely clear out to the ribs then the game is in trouble.
Was there a slap down by bris in the build up to the frost non- try? Looked like we had a good overlap and I thought there was a deliberate knock on but wasn't reviewed in all the madness of the later scramble and try review. May well be wrong, just interested if anyone else saw it and whether it was just us dropping the ball which on last nights evidence is v likely!
Just like last season with Northampton, we went all out to win the CC and that has probably cost us the title defence.
Personally don’t think we ever recovered from losing LB and not being able to adequately replace him.
Still been another enjoyable season and how can we forget that CC quarter final win.
Personally don’t think we ever recovered from losing LB and not being able to adequately replace him.
Still been another enjoyable season and how can we forget that CC quarter final win.
Just seen the post match interview with pat lam.
Sincere condolences to him and his family on the loss of his grandson.
How the bloke came to work, held it together and got his team to produce that performance i dont know- fair play and massive respect to him.
As always , there are far more important things in life than rugby. Wish I had watched it live rather than going off in a sulk and would have had some immediate perspective.
Sincere condolences to him and his family on the loss of his grandson.
How the bloke came to work, held it together and got his team to produce that performance i dont know- fair play and massive respect to him.
As always , there are far more important things in life than rugby. Wish I had watched it live rather than going off in a sulk and would have had some immediate perspective.
Quote:Old Bath Tub
Thanks BSJ, as you say our recent history at Ashton Gate is not good and whilst looking forward to a great game my heart says a 4/5 pointer, unfortunately my head says 1/2 league points I’m really hoping for heart over head !
Sadly the head won and quite frankly after watching that performance we will be lucky to get anything next week but here’s hoping
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Quote:Agree. Stupid showboating. He should be trying to get as close to the posts as possible. Shame because I really like the lad and didn't realise this was in his makeup.Optimist
- Pepper’s gormless swallow dive when he could have got 5-10 metres closer to the posts (2 point losing margin anyone?)
I know it was Newcastle but when we really went for it our passing was slick & fast. Yesterday it was slow & ponderous and not just from Donoghue, as if we didn’t wasn’t to make any mistakes. It was even worse than Leinster against BB. We cannot win like that but it seemed to indicate a form of nervousness. I’m afraid that will be the case against Leicester as so much depends on winning. A lot depends on FR coming back & changing that philosophy.
Quote:BathMatt53Quote:Dorset BoyQuote:BathMatt53Quote:A.M 180
If we can't rise under those circumstances then we obviously don't deserve to defend the title
Exactly this. That would be 3 losses in 4 Prem games.
We've just lost 3 of our last 4 haven't we?
Eek! (True)
We've lost four of our last five in all tournaments and haven't won away since March!
Quote:hemingtonQuote:Agree. Stupid showboating. He should be trying to get as close to the posts as possible. Shame because I really like the lad and didn't realise this was in his makeup.Optimist
- Pepper’s gormless swallow dive when he could have got 5-10 metres closer to the posts (2 point losing margin anyone?)
I know he’s an ever present under Borthwick but I wouldn’t have him as a starter against Leicester.
For me our standout back rowers are Bayliss, Reid & Underhill, although he is at times somewhat reckless. That is whilst Hill is otherwise utilised. The latter was demonstrating the form he showed when we signed him & could be invaluable going forward.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2026:05:30:08:35:31 by Bath Hammer.
Quote:Thank you, class Cb1Charlieboa1
Just seen the post match interview with pat lam.
Sincere condolences to him and his family on the loss of his grandson.
How the bloke came to work, held it together and got his team to produce that performance i dont know- fair play and massive respect to him.
As always , there are far more important things in life than rugby. Wish I had watched it live rather than going off in a sulk and would have had some immediate perspective.
[www.oddschecker.com]
We still seem to be favourites for The Prem with the bookies, can't see it myself..
We still seem to be favourites for The Prem with the bookies, can't see it myself..
Only listened to the game, so can't necessarily comment as clearly as others on here, but it does sound like we're not quite performing as a JvG team at the moment - sloppiness and individual moments of madness creeping in (Arundell, Pepper - too much time hanging out with Pollock?) and who was the on-field skipper at the end who let Santi have a go at that last penalty? One of the joys of watching Bath of late has been the combination of the proper maverick skills of Finn and increasingly Max complementing a really focused, controlled team. More TDT and Ted, please, and less rash thinking!
Tom de Glanville - Adopted player 2024-5
Tom de Glanville - Adopted player 2024-5
We are not winning collisions
The bomb squad is busted
We are too overconfident
Players are waiting for someone else to win the game for us.
We need ball carriers for 80 mins and a second row enforcer.
The kids are not ready either.
Roux and Dunn are a massive loss.
Agree with Opti why is Pepper pretending to be Pollock?
Agree with Opti Spencer was baby sitting.
We may be good at home but we are rubbish away.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
The bomb squad is busted
We are too overconfident
Players are waiting for someone else to win the game for us.
We need ball carriers for 80 mins and a second row enforcer.
The kids are not ready either.
Roux and Dunn are a massive loss.
Agree with Opti why is Pepper pretending to be Pollock?
Agree with Opti Spencer was baby sitting.
We may be good at home but we are rubbish away.
Tigers scrum is far superior to Bristols and Obano needs plenty of practise before next week
Quote:A2O
Tigers scrum is far superior to Bristols and Obano needs plenty of practise before next week
Here he is..
SW was it really a ‘bomb squad’ yesterday? Seems to me that it was more of a standard subs bench.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Quote:BathMatt53
SW was it really a ‘bomb squad’ yesterday? Seems to me that it was more of a standard subs bench.
Yes, you are right but the bomb squad impact has melted away and with TdT going perhaps needs a rethink. Though Kepu worked with Ewels first half.
No front row dominance second half in the second was disappointing.
I just hope Ciarran settles, he tried too many long 'game changing' passes and I think we have to remember his age and the number of games he has had at 10 is limited, he is really a 15.
Completely agree that Donaghue should have had game time before this game, and a bench spot if not. It was a game crying out for Santi at 10 in the pressure cooker of Ashton Gate.
The passing in the backs was pretty poor. A poor selection by JVG unfortunately.
If Finn’s not fit next week the Santi at 10, and TdG at full back.
Donahue bench.
I hope Hennessy is fit, I think JVG is trying to play Lawrence into form but hasn’t worked
Massive forward effort next week
Widcombe Garçon
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2026:05:30:11:22:20 by Widcombe boy.
The passing in the backs was pretty poor. A poor selection by JVG unfortunately.
If Finn’s not fit next week the Santi at 10, and TdG at full back.
Donahue bench.
I hope Hennessy is fit, I think JVG is trying to play Lawrence into form but hasn’t worked
Massive forward effort next week
Widcombe Garçon
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2026:05:30:11:22:20 by Widcombe boy.
Maybe Cam Redpath at 12 & Max at 13 is best option no matter who plays 10. Tough season for OL coming back so soon from Achilles injury. Being found out for pace?
In JVG we have to trust !!
In JVG we have to trust !!
Quote:Charlieboa1Quote:A2O
Tigers scrum is far superior to Bristols and Obano needs plenty of practise before next week
Here he is..
Much as A20 is a total muppet the point actually has some validity. Tigers now have the most effective pack in the PL so we will have to find another way to beat them next week.
Last season we won the title largely due to scrum dominance which we no longer have. Next season our pack will be weaker even if Stewart gets back to full fitness which has to be challenging given the severity of his injury.
Quote:Dorset Boy
We failed to turn our first half dominance into points. That cost us in the end and is why we lost.
Dickson his usual curates egg - he ignored Henry being taken out well after his chip through for the non-Barberry try, which should have been a penalty. But he was correct on the Underhill clearout. He no doubt gave us some favourable calls too, so balanced out for both teams.
We were nilled in the second half.
We're not getting to the final this year, unless a huge upturn in efficiency next two weeks.
Quite clear, beat Leicester x two to get to Twickenham.
To retain the title it’s likely Leicester (H), Leicester (hopefully H), Northampton @ HQ).
Spelt out its daunting. Unless we can flick a head switch, and ignore that the three obstacles are the teams playing the best rugby in the league.
Last season we stormed into the final. This year IF we get there we will be limping in.
Right now it’s a Northampton v Leicester final.
It’s up to the players and JVG to prove me wrong.
J
Quote:Charlieboa1
Was there a slap down by bris in the build up to the frost non- try? Looked like we had a good overlap and I thought there was a deliberate knock on but wasn't reviewed in all the madness of the later scramble and try review. !
Yes. I remarked on it at the time- felt it was a deliberate knock on, but as you say all attention then went to the "try' so it was not reviewed and there were no TV replays.
PG
We always look so much better as a team when Miles Reid plays. Just works so hard.
Quote:Dorset Boy
The deliberate knock on interpretation by officials really needs to be reviewed. I've said numerous times that players have been penalised unfairly for accidental knock ons gifting the opposition a penalty try and a card. It's happening to all teams.
I'm certainly not blaming last night's loss on that, and clearly the officials have decided on an interpretation.
This is exactly the point I was making. To yellow card someone for the ball brushing the fingertips is mental. I take such issue with this law and the ridiculous tackle law where a 6’5” player is expected to essentially touch his toes to tackle someone 6” shorter than him in the space of about 1.5 seconds defies logic.
Quote:inatthebreakdown
You lost and BJVR justified his England call-up.
1) Obviously.
2) Not many dispute Benhard Janse Van Rensberg is good enough to play for England, we just believe Max Ojomoh is too and deserves recognition.
I agree with both laws. You shouldnt be able to just slap a ball away because you aren’t in a position to catch it. You also shouldn’t be able to decapitate someone because you are tall.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Quote:@Hydor18Quote:inatthebreakdown
You lost and BJVR justified his England call-up.
1) Obviously.
2) Not many dispute Benhard Janse Van Rensberg is good enough to play for England, we just believe Max Ojomoh is too and deserves recognition.
I don't think either Max or Ollie's performances last night suggested SB has made the wrong call. Ollie hasn't been the same since he came back and Max has only had a few cameos this season. I don't think we on this board can agree who is our best centre combination.
Quote:@Hydor18
if Arundell “slapped” the ball, you need to see an optician.
You were talking about the Law generally. In the Arundel case, he knew what he was doing, everyone knows the law as it is and the decision was spot on. So presumably you want to allow a fingertip touch but not a hand (ie to slap)? Whatever the Law there will be moaners morning about it.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Quote:BathMatt53Quote:@Hydor18
if Arundell “slapped” the ball, you need to see an optician.
You were talking about the Law generally. In the Arundel case, he knew what he was doing, everyone knows the law as it is and the decision was spot on. So presumably you want to allow a fingertip touch but not a hand (ie to slap)? Whatever the Law there will be moaners morning about it.
At no stage was Arundell trying to knock the ball forward, he would have been initially aiming to catch it, and failing that trying to knock it back.
How is any of that a deliberate knock on?
The current interpretation is utterly ludicrous, probably 80% of the offences are accidental, not deliberate.
It's like suggesting someone who knocks on a fizzing pass that's just too far in front of them has done it deliberately.
My concern is that the TMOs are now responding to the crowd to look at things again then trying to influence a sanction to justify their intervention.
Not just yesterday either.
If the TMO is going to be so influential they should be a regular Prem ref on the field.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Not just yesterday either.
If the TMO is going to be so influential they should be a regular Prem ref on the field.
Quote:Dorset BoyQuote:BathMatt53Quote:@Hydor18
if Arundell “slapped” the ball, you need to see an optician.
You were talking about the Law generally. In the Arundel case, he knew what he was doing, everyone knows the law as it is and the decision was spot on. So presumably you want to allow a fingertip touch but not a hand (ie to slap)? Whatever the Law there will be moaners morning about it.
At no stage was Arundell trying to knock the ball forward, he would have been initially aiming to catch it, and failing that trying to knock it back.
How is any of that a deliberate knock on?
The current interpretation is utterly ludicrous, probably 80% of the offences are accidental, not deliberate.
It's like suggesting someone who knocks on a fizzing pass that's just too far in front of them has done it deliberately.
👆🏻This.
He was carrying out the same action he would for a kick chase. If it had been a kick, rather than a pass, would the same sanction stand? I don't know. Would we penalise a kick chaser who leaps in the air with one hand, knowing that it could bounce forward off their hand?
I don't know. The problem is there is always a difficulty judging intent. So to try and minimise the human element, protocols/heuristics/etc. were developed that favour the attacking side. I personally prefer to give the ref more leeway to decide but then I suspect Dickson would probably have arrived at the same conclusion, protocol or not.
I don't know. The problem is there is always a difficulty judging intent. So to try and minimise the human element, protocols/heuristics/etc. were developed that favour the attacking side. I personally prefer to give the ref more leeway to decide but then I suspect Dickson would probably have arrived at the same conclusion, protocol or not.
Quote:ChippenhamRoman
Right now it’s a Northampton v Leicester final.
I wouldn't rule out Saracens - since their narrow loss at FG, they've gone 5 from 5 with 4 of them being bonus point wins.
Quote:I’m not ruling out Bath when the chips are really down! There has been a Champions Cup hangover, but now is the time to shake that off.FiveSticksQuote:ChippenhamRoman
Right now it’s a Northampton v Leicester final.
I wouldn't rule out Saracens - since their narrow loss at FG, they've gone 5 from 5 with 4 of them being bonus point wins.
I understand the frustration because the wording is 'deliberate knock on'. However the reason it is always punished is if it wasn't there would be every incentive to stick a hand in a passing lane and the game would become a mess.
Quote:BarnetBoy
I understand the frustration because the wording is 'deliberate knock on'. However the reason it is always punished is if it wasn't there would be every incentive to stick a hand in a passing lane and the game would become a mess.
Disagree - that would be a deliberate knock on as it always has been.
Even through luvBlue black & White eyes , that was a clear attempt to stop the ball reaching Rees Zammit. No way was Arendell catching that ball.
Correct decision imo
Widcombe Garçon
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2026:05:30:19:34:48 by Widcombe boy.
Correct decision imo
Widcombe Garçon
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2026:05:30:19:34:48 by Widcombe boy.
Quote:Widcombe boy
Even through luvBlue black & White eyes , that was a clear attempt to stop the ball reaching Rees Zammit. No way was Arendell catching that ball.
Correct decision imo
True, but how many kick chases does the player leap in the air with one hand to stop the ball reaching the opposition. Knock-on from that action are rarely given as deliberate, yet no way they were catching that ball? (Part of me thinks they should - might depower the slap-back vs catching tactic).
It's totally irrelevant what happens with kicks.
The laws gives room for passes to be contestable, but only to a very limited extent. It is one of the more consistently refereed laws in the game
It was silly by Henry, given it was all happening in what felt like x0.25 speed
The laws gives room for passes to be contestable, but only to a very limited extent. It is one of the more consistently refereed laws in the game
It was silly by Henry, given it was all happening in what felt like x0.25 speed
Quote:A.M 180
It was silly by Henry, given it was all happening in what felt like x0.25 speed
I'm not so sure, he only needed to tip the ball forward a fraction to juggle and catch and nobody catches him. Finn makes a mistake and we just dismiss it as part of his playing style. I think he gambled and lost, I hope he still gambles next time. Everyone sees the smallest detail out there.
Quote:A.M 180
It's totally irrelevant what happens with kicks.
The laws gives room for passes to be contestable, but only to a very limited extent. It is one of the more consistently refereed laws in the game
It is refereed fairly consistently but it is not exclusive to the interception of passes. The laws themselves make no reference to passes. The sanction is a penalty - obviously depending on circumstances that can then be upgraded to a card and a penalty try.
I'm with Shipwrecked. He gambled and lost. The fact that he gambled suggests he wasn't trying to knock it on but we all know how the law is interpreted. The pass was slow but if he'd had caught it might have been a different game.
I’m not arguing that ‘deliberate’ knock-ons are some sort of offence, but there’s not much else that is so absurdly over-jeopardised - it’s as near as dammit a 14-point award. It’s just ridiculous. Even collapsed mauls are a bit farcical, because it’s rarely a case of proactively collapsing it, and more like falling over under the weight of going backwards.
Maybe penalty tries should be worth 3 points or something.
Maybe penalty tries should be worth 3 points or something.
Maybe the opposition captain should get the choice of 3 points and a yc or 7 points and no yc...
Quote:shipwrecked
My concern is that the TMOs are now responding to the crowd to look at things again then trying to influence a sanction to justify their intervention.
Not just yesterday either.
If the TMO is going to be so influential they should be a regular Prem ref on the field.
100%. Have been saying for years that key factor of home advantage isn't knowing that slight camber in a corner of a field or the length of the grass, it's crowd influence on officials.
UBB was on another scale but you see it all the time. Would underhill clear out have been reviewed at the rec- thankfully dickson stood firm
I am not complaining as we benefit at home and that why home advantage in the semi's is crucial in a few weeks.. I have long argued the big, vociferous Welford Rd crowd who are almost on top of the pitch are worth a few scores due to influence on officials and good for them.
This isn't a criticism of officials , I think it's inevitable that if thousands of people are drawing your attention to something you are more likely to notice it/ review it.
The Underhill one was a prime example, I said to my mate ont he first review that it was clearly shoulder first but the crowd got louder and louder.
The LRZ no try was the same, in real time you could see he dropped it but the crowd cheered every replay!
It’s definitely a case of home crowd makes the ref think twice, and we’ve definitely used it to our advantage several times at home. That Saints game in December where they had two or three chalked off, the fans in the ground spotted it in real time!
The LRZ no try was the same, in real time you could see he dropped it but the crowd cheered every replay!
It’s definitely a case of home crowd makes the ref think twice, and we’ve definitely used it to our advantage several times at home. That Saints game in December where they had two or three chalked off, the fans in the ground spotted it in real time!
The continuous replays of player errors in real time and slow motion can't help but get the home crowd fired up. It becomes a pantomime with oohs and aahs getting louder with each replay. We are just as bad at the Rec. It sucks the life out of the live game too. It's one of the reasons I'm giving up my ST after nearly 30yr at the Rec.
If you don't like the yellow card for Arundell (to be clear I thought it was fair) the one against Woodburn just now.
Quote:hasta
If you don't like the yellow card for Arundell (to be clear I thought it was fair) the one against Woodburn just now.
Woodburn one was right decision. Clearly knocked it down to prevent the pass working.
Ref was spot on just before with the no deliberate as setting for the tackle, though most refs would have given that.
Quote:Treble
The continuous replays of player errors in real time and slow motion can't help but get the home crowd fired up. It becomes a pantomime with oohs and aahs getting louder with each replay. We are just as bad at the Rec. It sucks the life out of the live game too. It's one of the reasons I'm giving up my ST after nearly 30yr at the Rec.
POSIWID - The conclusion is that they think controversy around decisions and constant review of infringements is good for the game and builds involvement. Even the commentary team seem to dedicate even more and more time to pointing our infringements. I'm not a fan but it's only heading in one direction...
Quote:Dorset BoyQuote:hasta
If you don't like the yellow card for Arundell (to be clear I thought it was fair) the one against Woodburn just now.
Woodburn one was right decision. Clearly knocked it down to prevent the pass working.
Ref was spot on just before with the no deliberate as setting for the tackle, though most refs would have given that.
Agreed. Hooper was just looking for the tackle and it hit his hand. Woodburn was staring at the ball when he slapped it. Both correct decisions IMO.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Quote:Benisjammin
Thought Dickson was excellent tonight - few 50/50 calls but got all the important stuff right.
On this evidence, and a quick look at the table, Northampton are the only team who deserve the title this year. 5 losses is too many to be champion even if the playoffs make it possible.
This.
Something seems to have gone missing with Bath at the moment, including at times the ‘joie de vivre’. Going into the playoffs with momentum is a need next week, alongside the W, because being the best team over 18 games does not guarantee a league title anymore.
Agreed, but presuming Saints rest everyone next weekend and send the kids to Quins, they lose, and then it’s only 14 wins for them and 13 for us/Tigers so it’s not an astronomical difference
I'm pretty certain that Saints' kids would beat Quins firsts!
... IMHO, of course.
Now in Honolulu
... IMHO, of course.
Now in Honolulu
Quote:joethefanatic
I'm pretty certain that Saints' kids would beat Quins firsts!
Saints only just won vs Gloucester and Quins have looked ok the last couple of weeks - anything could happen.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Saints haven’t looked overly convincing since they beat Saracens (neither have we too be fair)
Right Season as such is over - now is basically Knock Out Cup rugby. We have to beat Tigers to have on Saturday and most likely the following Saturday - Bonus points etc don't matter to us. A bit of Deja Vu - we had the same situation with Sarries only a few months ago. The thought of going to Welford Road is a totally different prospect to a home semi final.
As a team we have not been at our best this season - personally I feel we have been torn between the Prem and Champions Cup. Going so far in the Champions Cup has seriously tested our players resolve and it has shown.
We as fans now must make the difference starting this Saturday - We have to bring the noise and intent we have shown we can do like against Sarries and Saints.
We know how Tigers are going to play - Chiefs nullified that by being as physical as Tigers and that is how we need to be - I just feel this season we have been a bit passive sometimes now is not the time. Let us cheer our boys home.
As a team we have not been at our best this season - personally I feel we have been torn between the Prem and Champions Cup. Going so far in the Champions Cup has seriously tested our players resolve and it has shown.
We as fans now must make the difference starting this Saturday - We have to bring the noise and intent we have shown we can do like against Sarries and Saints.
We know how Tigers are going to play - Chiefs nullified that by being as physical as Tigers and that is how we need to be - I just feel this season we have been a bit passive sometimes now is not the time. Let us cheer our boys home.
As many mentioned posts have mentioned above, we are now in knockout phase of our season! As much as I love our squad depth, I for one think that we may have been guilty of over rotation. It's certainly worked for us at times i.e. the win at Sale and the 2 points we took at Saints. But at times I just can't help but feel that we don't look that cohesive as a backline which can be a direct result of the chopping and changing in the midfield (which I know sometimes can't be helped by injuries) and also the chopping and changing at fullback between TDG and Santi. All the personnel changes alongside adjusting to a new attack coach in Gleeson can't have helped the starters gel together. (On a separate note - rumours that Gleeson is leaving and we will have a new attack coach next year is very exciting. Someone mentioned above that our pack isn't going to be as strong next year so why not embrace more of an attacking game and make use of Finn Russell's mercurial skills)
No excuses now - JvG needs to be brave and pick players on form. My team below for Tigers match last day of the season:
1. Van Wyk
2. Tuipulotu
3. Du Toit
4. Hill
5. Ewels
6. Pepper
7. Underhill
8. Bayliss
9. Spencer
10. Russell
11. Hennessey (if fit - covers centre also)
12. Redpath
13. Ojomoh
14. Cokanasiga
15. Carreras
16. Frost
17. Obano
18. Sela
19. Moloney
20. Reid
21. TCS
22. Arundell (covers full back and wing)
23. Barbeary
No excuses now - JvG needs to be brave and pick players on form. My team below for Tigers match last day of the season:
1. Van Wyk
2. Tuipulotu
3. Du Toit
4. Hill
5. Ewels
6. Pepper
7. Underhill
8. Bayliss
9. Spencer
10. Russell
11. Hennessey (if fit - covers centre also)
12. Redpath
13. Ojomoh
14. Cokanasiga
15. Carreras
16. Frost
17. Obano
18. Sela
19. Moloney
20. Reid
21. TCS
22. Arundell (covers full back and wing)
23. Barbeary
Quote:A.M 180
It was silly by Henry, given it was all happening in what felt like x0.25 speed
Completely agree. It was total misjudgement from Arundel
The moment the ball was in the air it was obviously going to be exceptionally unlikely he would be able to catch the ball. Far better option would have been to wait and allow LRZ get the ball and bundle him into touch
It was incredibly silly of Arundell and a real turning point in the match. I can kind of understand a player getting a YC in desperation (rushing up to take man and ball to stop an overlap) if the defence is stretched. But we were numbered up well, with LRZ about 15m out and it was a slow looping pass from Randall. Also, it was penalty advantage to Bristol, so even if Arundell does intercept, he can't go the length anyway, so he should absolutely have just kept his shape and marked LRZ.
Really disappointing decision from Arundell and, as I say, IMO, the turning point in the match as it gave them momentum, got the crowd going etc. If we scored first in the second half, it probably would have been a very different result.
Really disappointing decision from Arundell and, as I say, IMO, the turning point in the match as it gave them momentum, got the crowd going etc. If we scored first in the second half, it probably would have been a very different result.
Quote:gaz59Quote:A.M 180
It was silly by Henry, given it was all happening in what felt like x0.25 speed
Completely agree. It was total misjudgement from Arundel
The moment the ball was in the air it was obviously going to be exceptionally unlikely he would be able to catch the ball. Far better option would have been to wait and allow LRZ get the ball and bundle him into touch
That's the safe option of course, Arundell like all wingers are primed to win the high ball, tap backs etc. He gambled and lost but he has to go for it if there is any chance in my view. That's what we bought him for to do the exceptional.
Problem is- as above- the exceptional outcome in this situation was to somehow catch it... and for KD to blow his whistle as it was another Bristol penalty. Just let LRZ catch it and knock him over.
The only thing 'exceptional' about the decision from Arundell was that it was exceptionally stupid.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
The only thing 'exceptional' about the decision from Arundell was that it was exceptionally stupid.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Quote:shipwrecked
He gambled and lost but he has to go for it if there is any chance in my view.
Poor odds on that gamble. As said, if he had intercepted it was coming back so it was:
1) missing LRZ who scores a try in the corner;
2) knocking on and not having the conversion plus 10 in the bin; or (most likely)
3) waiting and pushing LRZ into touch.
That one was all risk, very little reward.
(I often think the same with the maul, just let them score it rather than bringing a fast moving maul down and losing the points AND the player. )
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Quote:BathMatt53Quote:shipwrecked
He gambled and lost but he has to go for it if there is any chance in my view.
Poor odds on that gamble. As said, if he had intercepted it was coming back so it was:
1) missing LRZ who scores a try in the corner;
2) knocking on and not having the conversion plus 10 in the bin; or (most likely)
3) waiting and pushing LRZ into touch.
That one was all risk, very little reward.
(I often think the same with the maul, just let them score it rather than bringing a fast moving maul down and losing the points AND the player. )
Given the penalty they were coming back for was pretty central you could argue the highest IQ play of all was to let LRZ score in the score with the most difficult possible conversion. (Not criticising him for not making that calculation obviously but I'm fairly fixed on my pet theory that allowing a try is optimal in some situations when you're under the pump)
Quote:theredseat
Given the penalty they were coming back for was pretty central you could argue the highest IQ play of all was to let LRZ score in the score with the most difficult possible conversion. (Not criticising him for not making that calculation obviously but I'm fairly fixed on my pet theory that allowing a try is optimal in some situations when you're under the pump)
I think you are correct – how many times have we seen a player carded for an offence and then the other team just gets a seven pointer from the penalty anyway?
The problem is, it's not really in the instincts of most professional players to let someone score a try.
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