Bath
No Sugar Coating the Pill in La Ville Rose - Toulouse v Bath
By shipwrecked
January 16 2024
Whether you are travelling to Toulouse with a ticket or watching the game on a screen everyone is going to get a real rugby treat his weekend. The Rose City, so named because it’s of its coral coloured bricks and terracotta tiled roofs is possibly the most underrated and beautiful city in France situated on the banks of the Garonne.
What of the match then? Having seen the fortunes for Bath rugby change over the past year I’d love to be suggesting that going to Stade Toulouse with a revitalised team we would have a chance of scoring an epic victory.
Let’s see in detail what we are up against.
Johan van Graan has made it clear that he wants to make Bath both difficult to beat and at the same time establish the Recreation Ground as a fortress.
That is precisely what Ugo Mola the Head coach at Toulouse has done. Easy to spot pitch side he is both vocal and emotional as his voice booms instructions across the grass. Recent Top 14 form is impressive, they have not lost at home for the last 15 games whist that is outstanding in it’s own right that’s only a part of the story when you realise that were it not for a draw against Stade Francais that record would be 25 home wins in a row!
Who is currently the form? Whilst many French clubs had banana skins in the first two matches of this year’s Champions Cup Toulouse were ominously sure footed. First game was a 19-47 win away to Harlequins followed by a 52-7 win against Cardiff at the Stadium de Toulouse.
What can Charlie Ewels, Finn Russell and the lads expect when they land at Toulouse airport? The answer on the basis of recent games is a whole raft of rugby surprises.
Romain Ntmack the Toulouse fly half is currently recovering from an ACL rupture, Toulouse sought injury cover for him in the form Blair Kinghorn but don’t always use him, Ntmack is close to returning to fitness but with the 6N on the horizon he is unlikely to be risked.
In the normal course of events that might be identified as a weakness to be exploited however, at the recent game against Lyon (who beat Connacht on Saturday) they decided to move Thomas Ramos from fullback and drop him into the fly half position. The result was a devastating display of total rugby.
Hardly surprising when you note that the scrum-half is the enigmatic Antoine Dupont (the current ‘le petit general’) which makes for a delicious match up with our own Ben Spencer.
Whoever plays at fly half they will be matched up with Finn Russell who knows his way around Top 14 rugby pitches as a result of his time with Racing 92. Arguably we are evenly matched in those positions. Problem is that Toulouse have class players sprinkled throughout the squad.
We all know that nearly all games are one upfront so it might be worth picking out some of the match ups in the pack that might influence the game.
As mentioned previously we really should be expecting the unexpected. Toulouse don’t play total rugby but they certainly have players with cross positional skills.
Jack Willis who previously was used to listening to crouch, bind, set at scrum time is now very familiar with the French version, flexion, liée, jeu. Willis once considered a key player in England by many England currently he is just one small part of a formidable Toulousain back row.
Toulouse have a massive number eight in Jelonch don’t be surprised if you see the number eight pick up the ball in his 22 and casually punt it down field for a 50/22 or should I say 22/22 a little unconventional! Their back row is completed by their 6 François Cros (RWC France 2023) who is simply efficient and somewhat underrated.
Equally at home with handling skills is Emmanuel Latu-Meafou who at 2.03 m (6’ 8”) an absolute giant of a lock from NZ and is partnered by Arnold, another antipodean from Oz who stands at 2.08 m tall (6 ft 10 in) they weigh 140 Kg and 120Kg respectively.
Tom Dunn will be scrumming down against Julien Marchand a hard ball carrying hooker who will match him at every step, he will get no rest for his understudy Peato Mauvaka either!
Behind the scrum the aforementioned Dupont and Ramos should fill the 9 and 10 spots whilst wide out they have a winger in Matthis Lebel who follows the mantra that ‘the shortest distance between two places is a straight line‘ where this guy excels is that he can arrow down that straight line as fast as any winger in Europe!
On the opposite wing they have the Fijian Setareki Bituniyata who applies a more basic approach to scoring tries by simply physically removing the opposition winger on his way to the whitewash. He also has an almighty boot. Be on the lookout for quick throw in as well, they like to catch the opposition unawares.
Covering any other opposition approach to the Toulouse line is the Argentinian fullback Juan Mallia who is comfortably at home under the high ball and when in possession runs hard and fast at the opposition doing his impersonation of a bowling ball down the skittle alley.
For Bath to have any hope of success they will have to make the first up tackles count and be really physical, something in recent times that has dramatically improved under JP Ferreira who has been key to making Bath competitive and hard to beat. We will be picking the biggest and hardest ball carriers we have and our line out will have to be at it’s very best. We won’t be able to afford the luxury of inaccuracy through but I fully expect that Charlie Ewels and Elliot Stooke can win enough ball to get our exciting backs going.
Redpath and Lawrence are different centres to the usual Top 14 pairings and are pacy and elusive enough to get create opportunities and get points on the board.
Toulouse’s main attacks usually come in the second half. Let’s just hope they are not far enough ahead at that point to spring their final surprise which involves bringing on their reserve scrum half and moving DuPont to 10. If that occurs prepare for some rugby fireworks!
I suppose really the preview should be full of optimism and boldly predicting a Bath win. However, realistically this game might be a step too far. One thing is for sure and that is Toulouse can expect a real fight from Bath who will want to paint the pink city, red! Let's not forget it's a Cup game where anything can happen.
Bath Rugby: 1 Beno Obano, 2 Tom Dunn, 3 Thomas du Toit, 4 Elliott Stooke, 5 Charlie Ewels, 6 Miles Reid, 7 Sam Underhill, 8 Josh Baylis, 9 Ben Spencer (c), 10 Finn Russell, 11 Will Muir, 12 Cameron Redpath, 13 Ollie Lawrence, 14 Joe Cokanasiga, 15 Matt Gallagher
Replacements: 16 Niall Annett, 17 Juan Schoeman, 18 Wil Stuart, 19 GJ van Velze, 20 Quin Roux, 21 Chris Cloete, 22 Louis Schreuder, 23, Orlando Bailey.
The performance of Toulouse last week in Ulster where they won 24–48 means they have now amassed 15 points and qualify. Their game against Bath might well revolve around rotation though both sides will undoubtably be looking for home advantage.
Taking our recent 29-25 comeback win from the Rec against the Top 14 leaders is massive. Who will the coaches select and will rotation play a part? Have your say below.
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StumbleuponNo Sugar Coating the Pill in La Ville Rose - Toulouse v Bath. Team Up!
Discussion started by Comeonmylovers.co.uk (IP Logged), 16/01/2024 10:08
16/01/2024 10:08
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Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:24:10:08:46 by hasta.
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Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:24:10:08:46 by hasta.
I saw Sam Underhill in the Swift Half after the game and he was wearing a surgical boot so I don't know that he will be starting.
Bath need to be far more accurate both in the lineouts and their first tackles otherwise this lot are going to run riot.
We need to be very close on 50 minutes to stand any chance and any idea of another miracle comeback can be dismissed.
However it is games like this that people play sport for, paid or otherwise, and the competitive juices will be flowing for both teams.
On the other hand a point each would work for both teams
Bath need to be far more accurate both in the lineouts and their first tackles otherwise this lot are going to run riot.
We need to be very close on 50 minutes to stand any chance and any idea of another miracle comeback can be dismissed.
However it is games like this that people play sport for, paid or otherwise, and the competitive juices will be flowing for both teams.
On the other hand a point each would work for both teams
Sorry SW forgot to say excellent report.
We need Finn to have a dream match.
I am getting excited already.
We need Finn to have a dream match.
I am getting excited already.
I agree BSJ Toulouse tend to come out to play second half. A try BP would be good, I envy you massively enjoy the trip to Stadium de Toulouse.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Based on previous games between the two teams, I would anticipate a close match.
In the 8 euro matches we've played against Toulouse, all but one of them were tight matches with no more than a score difference. The exception: when we beat them 35 - 18 in Toulouse in 2015.
In the 8 euro matches we've played against Toulouse, all but one of them were tight matches with no more than a score difference. The exception: when we beat them 35 - 18 in Toulouse in 2015.
Good knowledge FiveSticks......I go forward with a spring in my step!!!!
I always enjoy seeing T Hill in his specs. Reminds me of Christopher Reeves as Superman 
I'm wishing for an open game in the hope that we can secure a try bonus point and a home fixture. I think a win or losing bonus point is unlikely.
Quote:Francis Allen
I'm wishing for an open game in the hope that we can secure a try bonus point and a home fixture. I think a win or losing bonus point is unlikely.
I agree with that, best we can hope for but there will be tries for sure!
Quote:shipwreckedQuote:Francis Allen
I'm wishing for an open game in the hope that we can secure a try bonus point and a home fixture. I think a win or losing bonus point is unlikely.
I agree with that, best we can hope for but there will be tries for sure!
Agree.
Bit pessimistic but I almost think our best chance is toulouse racing into a good lead and then becoming v loose after making lots of early changes.
Leic nearly let us in for a try BP after taking their best players off ans taking their foot off the pedal
Very conflicting things on Underhill JVG said last week he narrowly missed the Gloucester game. Now a week later apparently in a boot ?
Guess only the teamsheet will tell
Guess only the teamsheet will tell
I think this game is completely dependant and arguably decided before the game starts. Toulouse go weak or underestimate the team then I think they’ll be in for a shock.
I think the team will be missing Cam and Finn to rest them for bris.
1. Obano
2. Annett
3. Stuart
4. Ewels
5. Stooke
6. Bayliss
7. Underhill (If not then Richards 6)
8. Coetzee
9. Spencer
10. Bailey
11. Muir
12. Ojomoh
13. Lawrence
14. Cokansiga
15. TDG
16. Faiva
17. Schoeman
18. TDT
19. Roux
20. Cloete
21. TCS
22. Harris
23. Butt
I think the team will be missing Cam and Finn to rest them for bris.
1. Obano
2. Annett
3. Stuart
4. Ewels
5. Stooke
6. Bayliss
7. Underhill (If not then Richards 6)
8. Coetzee
9. Spencer
10. Bailey
11. Muir
12. Ojomoh
13. Lawrence
14. Cokansiga
15. TDG
16. Faiva
17. Schoeman
18. TDT
19. Roux
20. Cloete
21. TCS
22. Harris
23. Butt
Hold back dunn and reid aswell for bris hk890?
Fingers crossed coetzee is fit and stays fit for both games.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:16:19:45:43 by charlieboa.
Fingers crossed coetzee is fit and stays fit for both games.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:16:19:45:43 by charlieboa.
Quote:charlieboa
Hold back dunn and reid aswell for bris hk890?
Fingers crossed is fit and stays fit for both games.
For me yes you could argue Dunn might even be a slight feeling for him to up it from the coaches. Not been hitting his previous heights recently
Feel Reid’s mins have been very high started lots of games. And the one recently he missed he wasn’t meant to. Good chance for Bayliss to gets minutes so it makes sense to let Reid just tear into Bristol fresh off a rest.
Top knowledge/research sw! I haven't made much of an effort to find out but the 2 tables I've looked at don't have the points scored and conceded. Assuming it comes down to points difference for 2nd place, how do we stand compared with Quins please? (DW, QT or hasta are bound to know!).
Currently +20 on Quins, but obvi if they get a bp win and we don't get a lbp that's under threat.
Stadium de Toulouse
Quote:HK890Quote:charlieboa
Hold back dunn and reid aswell for bris hk890?
Fingers crossed is fit and stays fit for both games.
For me yes you could argue Dunn might even be a slight feeling for him to up it from the coaches. Not been hitting his previous heights recently
Feel Reid’s mins have been very high started lots of games. And the one recently he missed he wasn’t meant to. Good chance for Bayliss to gets minutes so it makes sense to let Reid just tear into Bristol fresh off a rest.
Makes sense- I would defo rest a handful of frontline players personally who will absolutely be available for bris on a 6 day turnaround. Dunn, reid, russell, cam seems a sensible list and use josh as much as possible given he good he has looked in his couple of run outs.
Just cross fingers that's still enough to get 1 match point somehow (assuming quins don't slip up with anything less than 5 pts and a 20+ point swing on us).
Quote:Cheers hasta. A win for them and defeat for us could easily see that gap wiped out so a bonus point may well be needed. I'm philosophical about it anyway. If we get 15 points from 4 games and don't get a home draw I'd still see this as a very good achievement. I can't go to Toulouse so a nice trip to France in early April would be very welcome anyway, so it's win/win for me.hasta
Currently +20 on Quins, but obvi if they get a bp win and we don't get a lbp that's under threat.
Good insight SW. Commentators & pundits were saying at the weekend the le petit General was leaving for the 7’s so may not be playing?
Widcombe Garçon
Widcombe Garçon
I think the 7s is in Vancouver, Canada on February 23-24 and in Los Angeles on March 2-3 which means he will miss the 6 nations. I don’t think he joins them yet but I may be wrong WB.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Nobody in our group is guaranteed a home tie but Toulouse’s points difference means they almost are (would need a combined winning margin of 84 between us and Quins to take it away from them) so they could be tempted to rest some players. On the other hand they’ve got a reasonable shot at being the top ranked team and won’t want to lose at home so it’s probably unlikely.
Personally I think Toulouse will be happy to secure a top 4 berth and guarantee a home last 16 and if they win that a home 1/4 - the way this league has gone this year you could finish top of the pile and be rewarded with either La Rochelle or Racing 92 coming to town - Toulouse and no team would want that.
So my thinking is if you can secure top 4 status and win your last 16 game at least you have a home 1/4 which I think Toulouse have pretty much secured.
Whilst we have Bristol away 6 days later - don't forget Toulouse are away to Racing 92 in the Pro 14 - both teams have key fixtures.
I would expect both sides to field changed sides - we have issues now at 8 & back row - Underhill potentially not ready - Jaco potentially still injured and Alfie expected to get a ban - fortunately Josh's return means he can fill the 8 berth.
As has been reported the squad will already know who is travelling/playing in Toulouse and who is not and if true they will also know the squad/team for the Bristol game which is almost a must win or get something from it.
So my thinking is if you can secure top 4 status and win your last 16 game at least you have a home 1/4 which I think Toulouse have pretty much secured.
Whilst we have Bristol away 6 days later - don't forget Toulouse are away to Racing 92 in the Pro 14 - both teams have key fixtures.
I would expect both sides to field changed sides - we have issues now at 8 & back row - Underhill potentially not ready - Jaco potentially still injured and Alfie expected to get a ban - fortunately Josh's return means he can fill the 8 berth.
As has been reported the squad will already know who is travelling/playing in Toulouse and who is not and if true they will also know the squad/team for the Bristol game which is almost a must win or get something from it.
Quote:HK890
Very conflicting things on Underhill JVG said last week he narrowly missed the Gloucester game. Now a week later apparently in a boot ?
Guess only the teamsheet will tell
I don’t think being in a boot is necessarily as worrisome as it looks. Players seem use them more often now even for managing minor issues so he could well be available this week. He’s also in the England squad so they presumably expect him to be fit for camp just after Toulouse as he’s not on their rehab list
This is the preview of the match on the Toulouse offy, courtesy of Google translate (with a bit of editing from me.)
The spectacle that awaits the Ernest Wallon public this weekend is none other than a clash at the top between 2 of the 3 teams who have the most points at this stage of the competition. Indeed, Toulouse and Bath collected 3 improved victories each, in the same way as Union Bordeaux Bègles. Already qualified for the 1/8 finals, these two teams will therefore compete to be ranked best in order to play at home during the knockout matches. The result of this last day will therefore be crucial!
PLAYERS TO WATCH
In 3rd position in the Premiership Rugby rankings, Bath seem to be off to a successful season, with several players playing at an excellent level, like Finn Russell. The whimsical Scottish flyhalf, who left Racing 92 for the English club this summer, is having a good start to the season with his new partners. He is coming off a successful match against his former team, during J3. His team stands out for its physical dimension, like back row Alfie Barbeary, who is the player who has made the most dominant runs in the Champions Cup. Center Ollie Lawrence dominates the ¾ ranking in this statistic. Bath's squad also contains the competition's co-top try scorer in Joe Cokanasiga (4).
Recent Matches.
Stade Toulousain was already in the group of its weekend opponent during the 2018-2019 season. A prolific edition for the Rouge et Noir, who had reached the semi-final stage, and which they had launched by narrowly winning (20-22) on the lawn of the Recreation Ground, thanks to a magnificent defensive gesture from Maxime Médard. The latter had clapped the hand of full-back Freddie Burns just before he flattened, offering victory to the Red and Black who thus began their beautiful journey. In the return match, Toulouse also defeated the English with a score of 20-17.
Some Stats
Points scored by T Ramos in Champions Cup 41 pts
Penalties obtained by Bath on Scrums 10
Successful tackles by P. MAUVAKA during round 3. 12/12
Tries scored by A. DUPONT in the competition 10
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
The spectacle that awaits the Ernest Wallon public this weekend is none other than a clash at the top between 2 of the 3 teams who have the most points at this stage of the competition. Indeed, Toulouse and Bath collected 3 improved victories each, in the same way as Union Bordeaux Bègles. Already qualified for the 1/8 finals, these two teams will therefore compete to be ranked best in order to play at home during the knockout matches. The result of this last day will therefore be crucial!
PLAYERS TO WATCH
In 3rd position in the Premiership Rugby rankings, Bath seem to be off to a successful season, with several players playing at an excellent level, like Finn Russell. The whimsical Scottish flyhalf, who left Racing 92 for the English club this summer, is having a good start to the season with his new partners. He is coming off a successful match against his former team, during J3. His team stands out for its physical dimension, like back row Alfie Barbeary, who is the player who has made the most dominant runs in the Champions Cup. Center Ollie Lawrence dominates the ¾ ranking in this statistic. Bath's squad also contains the competition's co-top try scorer in Joe Cokanasiga (4).
Recent Matches.
Stade Toulousain was already in the group of its weekend opponent during the 2018-2019 season. A prolific edition for the Rouge et Noir, who had reached the semi-final stage, and which they had launched by narrowly winning (20-22) on the lawn of the Recreation Ground, thanks to a magnificent defensive gesture from Maxime Médard. The latter had clapped the hand of full-back Freddie Burns just before he flattened, offering victory to the Red and Black who thus began their beautiful journey. In the return match, Toulouse also defeated the English with a score of 20-17.
Some Stats
Points scored by T Ramos in Champions Cup 41 pts
Penalties obtained by Bath on Scrums 10
Successful tackles by P. MAUVAKA during round 3. 12/12
Tries scored by A. DUPONT in the competition 10
Quote:theredseatQuote:HK890
Very conflicting things on Underhill JVG said last week he narrowly missed the Gloucester game. Now a week later apparently in a boot ?
Guess only the teamsheet will tell
I don’t think being in a boot is necessarily as worrisome as it looks. Players seem use them more often now even for managing minor issues so he could well be available this week. He’s also in the England squad so they presumably expect him to be fit for camp just after Toulouse as he’s not on their rehab list
Interesting one this- if he isn't fit/selected for toulouse will he be released to play vs bris?
Not ideal prep to play no games for a few months and if the noises are genge needs a game surely the same applies to Sam?
Big bonus to have the likes of ewels, reid, mojo, muir and coko in the mix for bris as could conceivably got call ups.
Assume all the Scots and griffin available for bris?
Assume beno, stuart, spencer, lawrence now play vs toulouse.
I like the Toulouse reference to our playing surface as a 'lawn'! Other fans generally use less complimentary terms.
Quote:Widcombe boy
Good insight SW. Commentators & pundits were saying at the weekend the le petit General was leaving for the 7’s so may not be playing?
That will be a shame if he’s not playing, would be a good matchup against Ben Spencer.
Quote:theredseatQuote:HK890
Very conflicting things on Underhill JVG said last week he narrowly missed the Gloucester game. Now a week later apparently in a boot ?
Guess only the teamsheet will tell
I don’t think being in a boot is necessarily as worrisome as it looks. Players seem use them more often now even for managing minor issues so he could well be available this week. He’s also in the England squad so they presumably expect him to be fit for camp just after Toulouse as he’s not on their rehab list
It definitely is something you would worry about. You only have a player in a surgical boot very early after big injuries. You would never see someone who’s apparently a week or two away from returning have one.
Yep you’d imagine he’s fine or will be at least if he’s been selected which is massive for the Toulouse game. And yes you would hope Bristol.
Team to face Toulouse has to be moreorless full strength. Line-up at Bristol will be very much changed. That's because there's only five days between the two games (obvious player welfare risk) and international squad players will not be available for Ashton Gate (England in camp and Scots & Welsh training midweek).
I suppose some of the squad in Toulouse would be available to face Bristol but only a handful. Difficult balancing act for JvG but he'll have seen it coming.
I suppose some of the squad in Toulouse would be available to face Bristol but only a handful. Difficult balancing act for JvG but he'll have seen it coming.
I’m hoping that we prioritise Bristol as we cannot afford to drop points if we hope to make the top 4 with a chance of the to 2 whereas we are already in the knockout stage of Europe. We’re going for 1 point which should still be possible with a bit of rotation.& if we don’t get it it’s not calamitous.
Player welfare less of an issue because they've got a month plus off after. I expect a first team except the England lot against Bris. Possibly including Underhill too.
Player welfare less of an issue because they've got a month plus off after. I expect a first team except the England lot against Bris. Possibly including Underhill too.
Quote:hasta
Player welfare less of an issue because they've got a month plus off after. I expect a first team except the England lot against Bris. Possibly including Underhill too.
That's what I expect.
I would hold out underhill this weekend even if fit and force the issue of getting him game time next week vs bris (or jvg could just have a grown up chat with borthers).
Saying that for the bris game even without him we could have gjvv, richards, coetzee, bayliss, cloete, reid so not exactly scraping the barrell!
Just extremely frustrating that bris have a 8 day turnaround vs our 6 days and they only have genge in squad who will probably be allowed to play!
As you hasts it the big last push for 2 games before over a month off.
Quote:charlieboaQuote:hasta
Player welfare less of an issue because they've got a month plus off after. I expect a first team except the England lot against Bris. Possibly including Underhill too.
That's what I expect.
I would hold out underhill this weekend even if fit and force the issue of getting him game time next week vs bris (or jvg could just have a grown up chat with borthers).
Saying that for the bris game even without him we could have gjvv, richards, coetzee, bayliss, cloete, reid so not exactly scraping the barrell!
Just extremely frustrating that bris have a 8 day turnaround vs our 6 days and they only have genge in squad who will probably be allowed to play!
As you hasts it the big last push for 2 games before over a month off.
But it's a five-day turnaround - Sunday to Friday, with travel in between - and if anyone can't train for the Bristol game, they won't play. The timetable looks too tight for the Toulouse contingent. Bayliss, Redpath and Russell are in the Scots' training squad, meeting up midweek. By the way, the players have two weeks off not four.
Tomorrow will be the acid test when teams announced - given the England players are unavailable for the Bristol match I would expect all to be involved if fit - I am fully expecting though Finn and Cam being rested - Josh probably needs the game time and it would give Jaco an extra weeks recovery for the Bristol game providing he is in that injury timeframe. Lucky given we have lost our LH and TH prop we have players such as Juan and Thomas especially as Bristol have been allowed to play Genge and Sinkler being available.
We must get something out of the Bristol game - obviously a win would be amazing but we cannot afford to drop off given the tightness of points and the psychological difference of going into a break on a high and a low.
Such a shame Ted Hill is not quite ready - what a player he is - I get the feeling outside of Bath really under rated and not really talked about much.
We must get something out of the Bristol game - obviously a win would be amazing but we cannot afford to drop off given the tightness of points and the psychological difference of going into a break on a high and a low.
Such a shame Ted Hill is not quite ready - what a player he is - I get the feeling outside of Bath really under rated and not really talked about much.
Quote:RalphAllenQuote:charlieboaQuote:hasta
Player welfare less of an issue because they've got a month plus off after. I expect a first team except the England lot against Bris. Possibly including Underhill too.
That's what I expect.
I would hold out underhill this weekend even if fit and force the issue of getting him game time next week vs bris (or jvg could just have a grown up chat with borthers).
Saying that for the bris game even without him we could have gjvv, richards, coetzee, bayliss, cloete, reid so not exactly scraping the barrell!
Just extremely frustrating that bris have a 8 day turnaround vs our 6 days and they only have genge in squad who will probably be allowed to play!
As you hasts it the big last push for 2 games before over a month off.
But it's a five-day turnaround - Sunday to Friday, with travel in between - and if anyone can't train for the Bristol game, they won't play. The timetable looks too tight for the Toulouse contingent. Bayliss, Redpath and Russell are in the Scots' training squad, meeting up midweek. By the way, the players have two weeks off not four.
Offy has the bris game as Saturday 27th.
Is that wrong?
Bristol site has the same. 15:05 SATURDAY, 27 JANUARY ASHTON GATE
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Sorry. My mistake but it still won't make those Scottish players available.
Quote:RalphAllen
Sorry. My mistake but it still won't make those Scottish players available.
No worries, I had fri in my head aswell but 6 days alot better than 5.
When you say 2 weeks off I assume you mean 2 weeks completely off training after bris to get away, rest etc?
No games between end of Jan and mid march friendlies though?
Assume with the Scottish and Welsh players it's not an irc rest weekend so can put our foot down and play them vs bris? Losing 10 players against a team losing potentially no one seems a bit crazy?
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:18:11:17:24 by charlieboa.
Yeh, the Scots and Welsh (Faletau) have always played for us during the non-fixture 6N weeks and I haven't seen any reason why it would be any different this year (unless Finn has an agreement in place).
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Quote:RalphAllen
Sorry. My mistake but it still won't make those Scottish players available.
I would be surprised if we don’t get the Scottish players back. Agree SRU may want Russell protected but if he wants to play which he will do then he’ll play.
If Cam gets rested this weekend then there would be no travel so should be fine to play Bristol.
The Scottish players are available - there's no release clause for them, they don't pay for it. Unless Finn has a specific contracted point. But Redpath and Bayliss will definitely be available if fit.
The first XV got a week off for Tigers. I expect them to play both games if not in the England squad.
The first XV got a week off for Tigers. I expect them to play both games if not in the England squad.
Bookies giving us no chance whatsoever [www.oddschecker.com] 
Adopted players: 24/25 J Bayliss; [24] O Lawrence; [23] J Cokanasiga; [22] M Green; [21] A Watson; [20] T Faletau; [19] M V Vuuren; [18] T Faletau; [17] D Denton; [16] H. Agulla; [15] L Houston; [14] W Spencer; [13] F. Louw
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My mind's been going places without me lately - Bushfire The B52's
Adopted players: 24/25 J Bayliss; [24] O Lawrence; [23] J Cokanasiga; [22] M Green; [21] A Watson; [20] T Faletau; [19] M V Vuuren; [18] T Faletau; [17] D Denton; [16] H. Agulla; [15] L Houston; [14] W Spencer; [13] F. Louw
Family . Community . Nation - [sdp.org.uk]
My mind's been going places without me lately - Bushfire The B52's
Quote:hasta
The Scottish players are available - there's no release clause for them, they don't pay for it. Unless Finn has a specific contracted point. But Redpath and Bayliss will definitely be available if fit.
The first XV got a week off for Tigers. I expect them to play both games if not in the England squad.
Agree. Assume same with Griffin? He may well be needed in the 23 vs bris.
As you say most frontline guys had a rest 3 weeks go, they will get a big rest after bris.
2 games in 6 days with v little , light training in-between doesn't seem impossible to me.
Sorrell at sarries was saying its much more about training load than match load. They now train 3 rather than 4 days a week.
Really gentle training week next week I assume.
Watching the game again. Ramos at 10 like he's played there his whole career. What must it be like to be that ridiculously talented?
Until you see the teams impossible to call but those odds feel a tad harsh.
Until you see the teams impossible to call but those odds feel a tad harsh.
Quote:OldMarovian
Watching the game again. Ramos at 10 like he's played there his whole career. What must it be like to be that ridiculously talented?
Until you see the teams impossible to call but those odds feel a tad harsh.
When you look at Toulouse's home record the odds aren't surprising.
Quote:OutsideBathQuote:OldMarovian
Watching the game again. Ramos at 10 like he's played there his whole career. What must it be like to be that ridiculously talented?
Until you see the teams impossible to call but those odds feel a tad harsh.
When you look at Toulouse's home record the odds aren't surprising.
At 11/1 I think the odds of Shergar being found alive are shorter
Quote:OutsideBathQuote:OldMarovian
Watching the game again. Ramos at 10 like he's played there his whole career. What must it be like to be that ridiculously talented?
Until you see the teams impossible to call but those odds feel a tad harsh.
When you look at Toulouse's home record the odds aren't surprising.
Highlighted that in the preview, absolutely spot on OB.
Quote:RalphAllenQuote:charlieboaQuote:hasta
Player welfare less of an issue because they've got a month plus off after. I expect a first team except the England lot against Bris. Possibly including Underhill too.
That's what I expect.
I would hold out underhill this weekend even if fit and force the issue of getting him game time next week vs bris (or jvg could just have a grown up chat with borthers).
Saying that for the bris game even without him we could have gjvv, richards, coetzee, bayliss, cloete, reid so not exactly scraping the barrell!
Just extremely frustrating that bris have a 8 day turnaround vs our 6 days and they only have genge in squad who will probably be allowed to play!
As you hasts it the big last push for 2 games before over a month off.
But it's a five-day turnaround - Sunday to Friday, with travel in between - and if anyone can't train for the Bristol game, they won't play. The timetable looks too tight for the Toulouse contingent. Bayliss, Redpath and Russell are in the Scots' training squad, meeting up midweek. By the way, the players have two weeks off not four.
Why would a midweek training session preclude the Scots from playing?
They aren’t under the auspices of the RFU. The Scots lads MUST play vs Bristol.
J
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:18:20:05:11 by ChippenhamRoman.
Quote:gaz59Quote:OutsideBathQuote:OldMarovian
Watching the game again. Ramos at 10 like he's played there his whole career. What must it be like to be that ridiculously talented?
Until you see the teams impossible to call but those odds feel a tad harsh.
When you look at Toulouse's home record the odds aren't surprising.
At 11/1 I think the odds of Shergar being found alive are shorter
That Shergar comment made me laugh out loud 😂
Adopted players: 24/25 J Bayliss; [24] O Lawrence; [23] J Cokanasiga; [22] M Green; [21] A Watson; [20] T Faletau; [19] M V Vuuren; [18] T Faletau; [17] D Denton; [16] H. Agulla; [15] L Houston; [14] W Spencer; [13] F. Louw
Family . Community . Nation - [sdp.org.uk]
My mind's been going places without me lately - Bushfire The B52's
Quote:Because they wouldn't be available to train and prepare with the Bath squad.ChippenhamRomanQuote:RalphAllenQuote:charlieboaQuote:hasta
Player welfare less of an issue because they've got a month plus off after. I expect a first team except the England lot against Bris. Possibly including Underhill too.
That's what I expect.
I would hold out underhill this weekend even if fit and force the issue of getting him game time next week vs bris (or jvg could just have a grown up chat with borthers).
Saying that for the bris game even without him we could have gjvv, richards, coetzee, bayliss, cloete, reid so not exactly scraping the barrell!
Just extremely frustrating that bris have a 8 day turnaround vs our 6 days and they only have genge in squad who will probably be allowed to play!
As you hasts it the big last push for 2 games before over a month off.
But it's a five-day turnaround - Sunday to Friday, with travel in between - and if anyone can't train for the Bristol game, they won't play. The timetable looks too tight for the Toulouse contingent. Bayliss, Redpath and Russell are in the Scots' training squad, meeting up midweek. By the way, the players have two weeks off not four.
Why would a midweek training session preclude the Scots from playing?
They aren’t under the auspices of the RFU. The Scots lads MUST play vs Bristol.
J
I don't think being away midweek prevents selection at this point. With the tight turn around from Toulouse, training and prep will be light anyway and the players will be able to slot back in.
We've seen it many times when a player is released back to club late from an international squad and plays at the weekend.
We've seen it many times when a player is released back to club late from an international squad and plays at the weekend.
Quote:Rokobilly
I don't think being away midweek prevents selection at this point. With the tight turn around from Toulouse, training and prep will be light anyway and the players will be able to slot back in.
We've seen it many times when a player is released back to club late from an international squad and plays at the weekend.
Yep agreed we’ve even seen it last year, Cam came back from Scotland during 6N and didn’t train till the Friday. Then played so it won’t be an issue. I would personally keep him at home for this game makes the whole process easier. This weekend go with 12. Ojomoh 13. Lawrence
Quote:HK890Quote:Rokobilly
I don't think being away midweek prevents selection at this point. With the tight turn around from Toulouse, training and prep will be light anyway and the players will be able to slot back in.
We've seen it many times when a player is released back to club late from an international squad and plays at the weekend.
Yep agreed we’ve even seen it last year, Cam came back from Scotland during 6N and didn’t train till the Friday. Then played so it won’t be an issue. I would personally keep him at home for this game makes the whole process easier. This weekend go with 12. Ojomoh 13. Lawrence
Next week 12 cam 13 mojo ?
Lawrence listed at 12, Ojomoh at 13 .... is Ollie getting to warm up for England by running out with 12 on his back?
Team:
Bath Rugby XV: 1 Beno Obano, 2 Niall Annett, 3 Thomas du Toit, 4 Quinn Roux, 5 Charlie Ewels, 6 Josh Bayliss, 7 Chris Cloete, 8 Miles Reid, 9 Ben Spencer (c), 10 Finn Russell, 11 Will Muir, 12 Ollie Lawrence, 13 Max Ojomoh, 14 Joe Cokanasiga, 15 Matt Gallagher
Replacements: 16 Hame Faiva, 17 Juan Schoeman, 18 Will Stuart, 19 Elliott Stooke, 20 Ewan Richards, 21 Louis Schreuder, 22 Orlando Bailey, 23 Cameron Redpath
PG
Bath Rugby XV: 1 Beno Obano, 2 Niall Annett, 3 Thomas du Toit, 4 Quinn Roux, 5 Charlie Ewels, 6 Josh Bayliss, 7 Chris Cloete, 8 Miles Reid, 9 Ben Spencer (c), 10 Finn Russell, 11 Will Muir, 12 Ollie Lawrence, 13 Max Ojomoh, 14 Joe Cokanasiga, 15 Matt Gallagher
Replacements: 16 Hame Faiva, 17 Juan Schoeman, 18 Will Stuart, 19 Elliott Stooke, 20 Ewan Richards, 21 Louis Schreuder, 22 Orlando Bailey, 23 Cameron Redpath
PG
Once again, the 'injury news' is staggeringly good. Just Hill and Underhill mentioned. Sam has an 'ankle injury' and is 'moving closer to a return to action'. Ted on course for mid-March.
Great to see Ewan Richards in match-day squad.
Great to see Ewan Richards in match-day squad.
I take it Jaco Coetzee is fit then just being held back - a more natural No 8 than Reid then again so is Bayliss.
Very mobile back row.
Very mobile back row.
Yep, agree, Opti. If only 2 officially 'injured' and therefore unavailable, at this stage of the season, given the density of the games, that is a staggering effort. And nice to see Dunn, GJVV, Coetzee (as not listed as injured), TdG given a week off.
Interesting back row. Lighter. Quicker. Might mean we're going to give it a real lash from everywhere and try and move the monster Toulouse pack around a bit. All we need is a BP and one way to do that is rack up 4 tries. I'd take a high scoring loss.
Toulouse look fully loaded to me so a real test in store.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Interesting back row. Lighter. Quicker. Might mean we're going to give it a real lash from everywhere and try and move the monster Toulouse pack around a bit. All we need is a BP and one way to do that is rack up 4 tries. I'd take a high scoring loss.
Toulouse look fully loaded to me so a real test in store.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Du Pont's last game for Toulouse prior to switching - going to be an emotional game for him. That is a bone tingling Toulouse team.
the pre match brief is pretty easy:
1. Enjoy the sun on your backs lads
2. The Toulouse Fans love running rugby, and we are great at it.
3. Give it a lash and score 4 tries asap, so we are guaranteed a home last 16 game.
4. Once 3 is achieved we will empty the bench and rest up for next Saturday.
5. Enjoy the flight home.
1. Enjoy the sun on your backs lads
2. The Toulouse Fans love running rugby, and we are great at it.
3. Give it a lash and score 4 tries asap, so we are guaranteed a home last 16 game.
4. Once 3 is achieved we will empty the bench and rest up for next Saturday.
5. Enjoy the flight home.
Quote:shipwrecked
Cheers Shipwrecked - it doesn't look any less daunting than on the Toulouse website
Agree Ali, that's pretty much full strength. Mallia moved to wing with Blair Kinghorn at 15, Dupont and Ramos 9 and 10, two belting hookers, I think this will be a big, big struggle down there!
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Just worry we have no ball carriers and fall into their trap of going wide to early and getting picked off.
Good to see Trev Brennan’s lad in the Toulouse squad. Just got in off the Heathrow flight and it was literally 95% BBW fans. Going to be a cracking weekend.
Hello, Quins fan here. I'm taking my Bath supporting wife to Toulouse this weekend to watch the match and I was just wondering if there is a place people are meeting before the game on Sunday?
Quote:Optimist
a try-fest definitely seems like the best route to a point.
Totally agree.
A free flowing game in the carnival atmosphere of duponts farewell could lead to us getting hammered but getting the 4 try BP.
That's a pretty mobile pack and with some impact off the bench in stuart, stooke, richards and cam if there is still something to push for in the last half an hour.
Hoping that dunn, underhill (fitness and england allowing), gj vv, coetzee etc are back in the mix for next week.
Yep, a losing BP is just a bit of a fantasy I’m afraid.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Quote:shipwrecked
Yep, a losing BP is just a bit of a fantasy I’m afraid.
Toulouse 23 is crazily strong isn't it.
They would need to be seriously off their game to give us a sniff esp when we are missing dunn, hill, underhill, barbeary , coetzee, gj vv.
Agree Charlie but I’m sure it will be a good watch, they have some excellent backs and I didn’t mention the centre Ahki.
They just rotate positions so easily Delibes the 13 Sunday is a wing normally, there is a full back at 10, fullback on the wing and a full back at 15.
In a recent game with 20 to go they moved DuPont to 10 and brought the bench 9 on.
All seamless and scored Tries like it was a normal back line!
At home they are mighty but the do lose away so not invincible!
English players just can’t do that!
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
They just rotate positions so easily Delibes the 13 Sunday is a wing normally, there is a full back at 10, fullback on the wing and a full back at 15.
In a recent game with 20 to go they moved DuPont to 10 and brought the bench 9 on.
All seamless and scored Tries like it was a normal back line!
At home they are mighty but the do lose away so not invincible!
English players just can’t do that!
Quote:For me it will be if we are in the game so we have to defend really well & cover the flanks. We can’t have Cokanasigna lamely patrolling a huge area on his own. It’s one thing to lose 25-40 & gain a bonus point. I won’t enjoy a drubbing however we’ll they play!shipwrecked
Agree Charlie but I’m sure it will be a good watch!
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:20:05:47:06 by Bath Hammer.
Would definitely settle for a 40 something vs 20 something scoreline if get a 4 try BP, esp if we are within 20 all game rather than just picking up a few late consolations like at leic to put an air of respectability on the scoreline.
Will be amazing experience for ewan richards- biggest, toughest challenge of his young career you would think.
Will be amazing experience for ewan richards- biggest, toughest challenge of his young career you would think.
Could be the game of the round.
I still think those odds are crazy not least as we know in a "2 horse race" an early red could have a higher impact, see Bristol yesterday.
Hoping it's competitive. IMO withing 10 but a shock result not impossible. Good luck.
I still think those odds are crazy not least as we know in a "2 horse race" an early red could have a higher impact, see Bristol yesterday.
Hoping it's competitive. IMO withing 10 but a shock result not impossible. Good luck.
Quote:RalphAllenQuote:Because they wouldn't be available to train and prepare with the Bath squad.ChippenhamRomanQuote:RalphAllenQuote:charlieboaQuote:hasta
Player welfare less of an issue because they've got a month plus off after. I expect a first team except the England lot against Bris. Possibly including Underhill too.
That's what I expect.
I would hold out underhill this weekend even if fit and force the issue of getting him game time next week vs bris (or jvg could just have a grown up chat with borthers).
Saying that for the bris game even without him we could have gjvv, richards, coetzee, bayliss, cloete, reid so not exactly scraping the barrell!
Just extremely frustrating that bris have a 8 day turnaround vs our 6 days and they only have genge in squad who will probably be allowed to play!
As you hasts it the big last push for 2 games before over a month off.
But it's a five-day turnaround - Sunday to Friday, with travel in between - and if anyone can't train for the Bristol game, they won't play. The timetable looks too tight for the Toulouse contingent. Bayliss, Redpath and Russell are in the Scots' training squad, meeting up midweek. By the way, the players have two weeks off not four.
Why would a midweek training session preclude the Scots from playing?
They aren’t under the auspices of the RFU. The Scots lads MUST play vs Bristol.
J
They are two of our best players. Doesn’t matter if they missed a midweek session. They are influential. They’ll play.
Especially with the England boys not available.
J
Quote:Bath HammerQuote:For me it will be if we are in the game so we have to defend really well & cover the flanks. We can’t have Cokanasigna lamely patrolling a huge area on his own. It’s one thing to lose 25-40 & gain a bonus point. I won’t enjoy a drubbing however we’ll they play!shipwrecked
Agree Charlie but I’m sure it will be a good watch!
A drubbing of say, 50-24 , with the crucial bp or a proud defensive performance in a 25-15 defeat surely there’s only one result BathHammer? Forget the performance as you suggest. You want a home tie surely
Think given the side we have put out and not detracting from the obvious strength of the Toulouse side we have to be competitive - I am not saying we will win although I will be crossing everything and we have beaten a really strong Toulouse in Toulouse in the not so distant past. We have got to be competitive though.
A minimum point required - Weather looks dry and sunny hopefully the boys can work some magic.
Come on Bath,
A minimum point required - Weather looks dry and sunny hopefully the boys can work some magic.
Come on Bath,
Quote:Will need to be something super-special to beat that Saint performance now.OldMarovian
Could be the game of the round
Agree with commentary- they should have looked at the previous tackle
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Toulouse like a red incoming tide get the first try.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Unlucky with the bounce of the ball there
But we can not let our ball carriers get isolated like that. Willis is over everything
But we can not let our ball carriers get isolated like that. Willis is over everything
Got to find a way to neutralise Willis
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Quote:A.M 180
Unlucky with the bounce of the ball there
But we can not let our ball carriers get isolated like that. Willis is over everything
Yep, resource the breakdown more and be more patient
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
So we can just take quick taps from miles in front of the mark then?
My thoughts exactly??
My thoughts exactly??
Clever line out, 1st one of four!
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
As a neutral both tries suspect - 1st tackled player got up again, 2nd in front of mark ...
It's a shame a rugby match is interrupting the DJ spinning some classic hip hop beats!
We are in this! 2 of 4!
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
why collapse it
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:21:15:53:58 by CoochieCoo.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:21:15:53:58 by CoochieCoo.
Should have been bath pen before 2 of their tries. This is tough enough without that
Stupid or classsic breakdown team work from Toulouse?
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
14 men guys, run back to your support and play boring rugby
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Olly Lawrence 3 of 4, left a hole in the ground slamming that down.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
This is turning into a classic game
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Quote:yes some clever stuff thereA.M 180
Grear effort to run down the sin bin from Russell there
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Brilliant. Goodness me it’s great fun supporting Bath at the moment.
Would be amazing to sneak a win, but they look excellent in attack, so one more try and I’ll be happy.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Would be amazing to sneak a win, but they look excellent in attack, so one more try and I’ll be happy.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
I was NOT expecting a first half like that.
And to think, we're a second-hand team this year.
Brilliant stuff, but let's not get carried away. Need that 4th try.
4 tries and a narrow score board would be Chrismas come very early
A man who cannot change his mind, cannot change anything
RAEBURN SHIELD
And to think, we're a second-hand team this year.
Brilliant stuff, but let's not get carried away. Need that 4th try.
4 tries and a narrow score board would be Chrismas come very early
RAEBURN SHIELD
Lawrence surely must start for England
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Quote:dr.bath1865
Brilliant. Goodness me it’s great fun supporting Bath at the moment.
Would be amazing to sneak a win, but they look excellent in attack, so one more try and I’ll be happy.
More than just 1BP on offer perhaps?
Are French players turning into to footballers? It's not just Toulouse players who are questioning everything with ref and officials and feigning head contact etc but all the French teams. It needs stamping out.
Another shocking call from Brace
Edit: at least he's had the humility to check it
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:21:16:29:55 by A.M 180.
Edit: at least he's had the humility to check it
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:21:16:29:55 by A.M 180.
Spencer off?
For once, he's off more than 3 minutes from the end - and it's not job done yet!
A man who cannot change his mind, cannot change anything
RAEBURN SHIELD
For once, he's off more than 3 minutes from the end - and it's not job done yet!
RAEBURN SHIELD
Bayliss is super busy, tackle wins the ball off to the corner.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Silly from Cloete
Edit: got away with that!
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:21:16:47:52 by A.M 180.
Edit: got away with that!
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:21:16:47:52 by A.M 180.
The TMO is basically telling Brace is wrong
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Falling surely, TMO and ref disagree.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Absurdly good defence
Toulouse look knackered
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:21:16:50:10 by A.M 180.
Toulouse look knackered
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:21:16:50:10 by A.M 180.
Outstanding however it ends up!
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Such a great game- but im struggling to enjoy it now! We should have had our fourth try by now (Obano held up, Jcok has to give it wide…) but suppose this is infinitely more enjoyable than the last couple of European campaigns! Some sort of enjoyable agony.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Cloete lucky to get away with penalty only there, surely? I get he was impeded a bit by their 12 but hitting the jackler's exposed shoulder joint like that looked really nasty.
15 minutes to go.
Dare we dream yet?
As I type - ouch
A man who cannot change his mind, cannot change anything
RAEBURN SHIELD
Dare we dream yet?
As I type - ouch
RAEBURN SHIELD
Quote:live, I thought hes arrived out of control, of his own accord, so reckless nd a card, coloyr depending on point of contact.Barnoid
Cloete lucky to get away with penalty only there, surely? I get he was impeded a bit by their 12 but hitting the jackler's exposed shoulder joint like that looked really nasty.
But replays show he's out of control because his foot is "taken" away from him, which removes fault.
RAEBURN SHIELD
Damn it far too narrow and we have invited them on instead of going after them
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Conceding probably the easiest way to change where the games being played I guess
Let’s get after them Bath
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Quote:A.M 180
Missing Spencer here
Schroeder is pedestrian and kicking not quite on it
Yeah that was an odd call
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Coaching staff will not be happy with the breakdown
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Willis is an absolute menace!
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Still some recruiting to be done in certain squad areas I think
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Quote:hasta
Please never take Ben Spencer off again.
This.
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Quote:Toast and Marmite
Still some recruiting to be done in certain squad areas I think
Hooker and 9 definitely
Odd to be so so so disappointed after such a great performance and campaign thus far.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Gutted. Part of me thinks we should have got something and part of me thinks we made some stupid decisions especially yanking Spencer.
But we look like we can go toe to toe with anyone
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
But we look like we can go toe to toe with anyone
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Quote:That was the swing, right tjere.Quel Carreleur
Spencer off?
For once, he's off more than 3 minutes from the end - and it's not job done yet!
RAEBURN SHIELD
Toe to toe with Europe's best for 70 mins. Immensely proud.
Very worried about the emotional toil on Bath. Wouldn't surprise me at all to lose to Bristol now
Very worried about the emotional toil on Bath. Wouldn't surprise me at all to lose to Bristol now
Quote:dr.bath1865
Odd to be so so so disappointed after such a great performance and campaign thus far.
We should definitely back ourselves to get a result away from home as well - although haven't looked who that might be yet
Cracking game Bath. Thought it would be 10 points difference so not far off.
Not quite sure who Toulouse were missing but a few Bath absentees would strengthen you a fair bit (Barbeary, Underhill?)
Willis an absolute menace and Toulouse just a great team to watch.
Not quite sure who Toulouse were missing but a few Bath absentees would strengthen you a fair bit (Barbeary, Underhill?)
Willis an absolute menace and Toulouse just a great team to watch.
Quote:dr.bath1865
Odd to be so so so disappointed after such a great performance and campaign thus far.
Frustrated- get to three tries and then started to sit back. Like the commentators said you can’t afford to invite Toulouse on to you.
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Quote:Thought the back row did very well today but undoubtedly could have been a different prospect with those two available, especially Barbeary with that 4th try opportunityOldMarovian
Cracking game Bath. Thought it would be 10 points difference so not far off.
Not quite sure who Toulouse were missing but a few Bath absentees would strengthen you a fair bit (Barbeary, Underhill?)
Willis an absolute menace and Toulouse just a great team to watch.
Quote:Assume it'll be team coming 2nd with the poorest record which is Stormers on 14 points or Exeter, currently on 13 and about to play at Bayonne? (Not very sure!).A.M 180Quote:dr.bath1865
Odd to be so so so disappointed after such a great performance and campaign thus far.
We should definitely back ourselves to get a result away from home as well - although haven't looked who that might be yet
Gutting.
Key was failing to score when totally dominant in the third quarter.
At least 2 Toulouse tries should have beeb scrubbed - Dupont about 5m in front of the mark, and the player getting up having been tackled and held. They also kept kicking or throwing the ball away.
Also noticable how non-English refs allow second man to play the ball (or even pull the man their way) at the breakdown, even if the tackler is still 'in the zone'.
but toe to toe for over 75 minutes
Key was failing to score when totally dominant in the third quarter.
At least 2 Toulouse tries should have beeb scrubbed - Dupont about 5m in front of the mark, and the player getting up having been tackled and held. They also kept kicking or throwing the ball away.
Also noticable how non-English refs allow second man to play the ball (or even pull the man their way) at the breakdown, even if the tackler is still 'in the zone'.
but toe to toe for over 75 minutes
Quote:I'll cheer for whatever result later keeps us away from teams who've no place in a European competition.TomReaganQuote:Assume it'll be team coming 2nd with the poorest record which is Stormers on 14 points or Exeter, currently on 13 and about to play at Bayonne? (Not very sure!).A.M 180Quote:dr.bath1865
Odd to be so so so disappointed after such a great performance and campaign thus far.
We should definitely back ourselves to get a result away from home as well - although haven't looked who that might be yet
RAEBURN SHIELD
Quote:lol!Quel CarreleurQuote:I'll cheer for whatever result later keeps us away from teams who've no place in a European competition.TomReaganQuote:Assume it'll be team coming 2nd with the poorest record which is Stormers on 14 points or Exeter, currently on 13 and about to play at Bayonne? (Not very sure!).A.M 180Quote:dr.bath1865
Odd to be so so so disappointed after such a great performance and campaign thus far.
We should definitely back ourselves to get a result away from home as well - although haven't looked who that might be yet
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
So, is there a 50/50 chance we get one of the South African sides on a neutral ground?
I would back us to beat Exeter or Stormers bf
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
Amazing performance from the boys for 65 minutes, so much to be proud of yet left feeling so disappointed not to come away with even a bonus point. How far we’ve come..!
A shame there was so little impact from the bench. As others have said, Spencer coming off was a pivotal moment, Schreuder slowed everything down and his passing from the base poor, really stifled the back line. Likewise Faiva’s darts have to be a concern. I thought Bayliss and Reid were superb but imagine having Ted Hill, Underhill, Barbeary & Coetzee available too, think we would have managed the breakdown (Willis) better.
Overall, despite the real disappointment at the end, so many positives to take away, went toe to toe with the best in Europe on their patch. Bravo.
A shame there was so little impact from the bench. As others have said, Spencer coming off was a pivotal moment, Schreuder slowed everything down and his passing from the base poor, really stifled the back line. Likewise Faiva’s darts have to be a concern. I thought Bayliss and Reid were superb but imagine having Ted Hill, Underhill, Barbeary & Coetzee available too, think we would have managed the breakdown (Willis) better.
Overall, despite the real disappointment at the end, so many positives to take away, went toe to toe with the best in Europe on their patch. Bravo.
Quote:Discussed by knowledgeable posters earlier; not me, I might add. Think they agreed that SA sides could host games up to and including the QF's.Bath Hammer
So, is there a 50/50 chance we get one of the South African sides on a neutral ground?
We had plenty of opportunities to not only get the TBP but potentially win this game.
Joe C had a wide open man but but chose to go himself . Cloete unlucky with clear out Toulouse did that all day long lye at the base of rucks and interfere with our ball without punishment.
Still magnificent effort from the boys and whoever they draw they have shown they can mix it with the best away from home.
Joe C had a wide open man but but chose to go himself . Cloete unlucky with clear out Toulouse did that all day long lye at the base of rucks and interfere with our ball without punishment.
Still magnificent effort from the boys and whoever they draw they have shown they can mix it with the best away from home.
Yeh I’d have taken 15 points from this European campaign at the outset. We hadn’t won a game in years- so winning 3 of 4 and going down bravely in Toulouse is absolutely nothing to be ashamed about.
We also proved today that we can compete away from home with anyone in the tournament. Roll on the last 16… and beyond!
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
We also proved today that we can compete away from home with anyone in the tournament. Roll on the last 16… and beyond!
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Increasingly if it's not written instructions on the ball Joe C struggles with what to do next. Look at what Lawrence does with a similar physique. Getting increasingly frustrated with him.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Bayonne on fire and it’s looking like Exeter away for us. I’d take that.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Slightly amusing that it is either the closest team or the furthest away team for us next!
Home advantage is BIG.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Quote:Gaughers
Very worried about the emotional toil on Bath. Wouldn't surprise me at all to lose to Bristol now
I don't think the emotional toll is that significant, is it? They held their own against one of the top dogs in Europe, at their place, and ended up missing out on a home tie. If they'd lost a knock out game and had to go again, I could understand the concern.
Quote:JK7Quote:Gaughers
Very worried about the emotional toil on Bath. Wouldn't surprise me at all to lose to Bristol now
I don't think the emotional toll is that significant, is it? They held their own against one of the top dogs in Europe, at their place, and ended up missing out on a home tie. If they'd lost a knock out game and had to go again, I could understand the concern.
On that showing if the game was at the Rec and we had a full strength bench they (Toulouse) would have lost.
First try was excellent (Blacket?)
We have to learn to move it wider 5m out from the line even if it's only 15m, its physically impossible to score if the defence is shoulder to shoulder.
I would say take it out on Bris.
I think the lack of Dunn, Hill, Underhill, Barbeary, Coetzee and the depth issue beyond Spencer showed us up there - it's the difference between having impact off the bench and hanging on from the bench.
I think the lack of Dunn, Hill, Underhill, Barbeary, Coetzee and the depth issue beyond Spencer showed us up there - it's the difference between having impact off the bench and hanging on from the bench.
Gutting but impressed with the performance.
I said at 55 mins when beno was held up over the line that it would come back to bite us- needed to get it done and dusted then as benches were always going to be mismatched.
That's what happens when there is a near £4m differential in salary cap- just didn't have the depth to see it through but should have secured the 4 try BP by then.
We need to be a bit smarter - manage down the 73 man squad and have a second team that could beat the firsts on their day. Less games, less attrition= no need for 73!
Utterly bamboozled we chose that game to hook spencer at 60 when he won't be playing next week- bizarre.
Thought the scrum last few weeks has been immense- please tell me tdt was OK as losing all 3 frontline props for bris would be a nightmare.
As well as the front row thought reid and bayliss stood up well and lawrence is just class.
.I would make 8 or 9 changes to the first xv for bris - need to freshen it up mentally and physically after that battle.
I said at 55 mins when beno was held up over the line that it would come back to bite us- needed to get it done and dusted then as benches were always going to be mismatched.
That's what happens when there is a near £4m differential in salary cap- just didn't have the depth to see it through but should have secured the 4 try BP by then.
We need to be a bit smarter - manage down the 73 man squad and have a second team that could beat the firsts on their day. Less games, less attrition= no need for 73!
Utterly bamboozled we chose that game to hook spencer at 60 when he won't be playing next week- bizarre.
Thought the scrum last few weeks has been immense- please tell me tdt was OK as losing all 3 frontline props for bris would be a nightmare.
As well as the front row thought reid and bayliss stood up well and lawrence is just class.
.I would make 8 or 9 changes to the first xv for bris - need to freshen it up mentally and physically after that battle.
Still proud of that performance, great team effort against one of the best teams around. We have come a long way over the last season.
Quote:TomReaganQuote:Discussed by knowledgeable posters earlier; not me, I might add. Think they agreed that SA sides could host games up to and including the QF's.Bath Hammer
So, is there a 50/50 chance we get one of the South African sides on a neutral ground?
Yes I recall but why is it being suggested that we will play Exeter away? I don’t fancy our charges away in South Africa though.
Quote:TomReaganQuote:Discussed by knowledgeable posters earlier; not me, I might add. Think they agreed that SA sides could host games up to and including the QF's.Bath Hammer
So, is there a 50/50 chance we get one of the South African sides on a neutral ground?
My pal thinks q/f matches must be played in Europe and Stormers have nominated Ashton Gate as their venue of choice. Can anyone confirm this?
Adopted players: 24/25 J Bayliss; [24] O Lawrence; [23] J Cokanasiga; [22] M Green; [21] A Watson; [20] T Faletau; [19] M V Vuuren; [18] T Faletau; [17] D Denton; [16] H. Agulla; [15] L Houston; [14] W Spencer; [13] F. Louw
Family . Community . Nation - [sdp.org.uk]
My mind's been going places without me lately - Bushfire The B52's
Quote:hasta
We had our chances to get that fourth one. Ahh, gutted.
We did. Undone by experience and the talent of Dupont & Ramos.
Team can be proud though & as others have said, should feel they can give even the best a tough game.
PG
May well be wrong BH, but the seeding basically means 1v16, 2v15 etc, etc. I think we're the best placed team coming 3rd, so seeded 9th. Would therefore play the 'weakest' team who finished 2nd who'd be 8th seeds
Not re-examined tables but thought that was Exe on 13 points. Of course if they beat Bayonne that would change and I think it would be Stormers. (Where's QT when you need him?!).
Not re-examined tables but thought that was Exe on 13 points. Of course if they beat Bayonne that would change and I think it would be Stormers. (Where's QT when you need him?!).
"My pal thinks q/f matches must be played in Europe and Stormers have nominated Ashton Gate as their venue of choice. Can anyone confirm this?"
True for QF but not for last 16 I believe.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:21:18:56:49 by Eastbath.
True for QF but not for last 16 I believe.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:21:18:56:49 by Eastbath.
That last Dupont/Ramos try was class TBF. Bit worried about us conceding tries out wide so easily off first phase.
Quote:hasta
That last Dupont/Ramos try was class TBF. Bit worried about us conceding tries out wide so easily off first phase.
That's the way we defend though Hasta but it does require a bit of a rugby brain exercise for our wingers.
Quote:Eastbath
"My pal thinks q/f matches must be played in Europe and Stormers have nominated Ashton Gate as their venue of choice. Can anyone confirm this?"
True for QF but not for last 16 I believe.
I believe it’s the Bulls not the Stormers and semi finals not quarters…
Anyone know what happens with the draw and who is home and away in the quarter finals?
Exeter away will be a mighty tough game, but it’s one we could well win, so id be interested to then know what happens after that.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Exeter away will be a mighty tough game, but it’s one we could well win, so id be interested to then know what happens after that.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Ties to be sorted pretty soon anyway but Bulls seeded above Stormers so I don't think we'd play them. Last 16 to QF's and beyond, I THINK (Not sure!!) that seedings carry on through, so Toulouse will play their next 2 games in Toulouse should they win of course, then nominate a ground in France for the SF. A bit like the NFL, if that helps!
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:21:19:29:13 by TomReagan.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:21:19:29:13 by TomReagan.
Away games are always harder but if I were to be given a choice I would probably choose Exeter away.
Its Exeter Away
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:21:19:43:38 by shipwrecked.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:21:19:43:38 by shipwrecked.
Lots of repeats from pool stages. Can't help thinking there must have been a better way than these seedings.
RAEBURN SHIELD
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:21:19:56:08 by Quel Carreleur.
Quote:like o ly having 16 teams, im 4 pools of 4?Rokobilly
Lots of repeats from pool stages. Can't help thinking there must have been a better way than these seedings.
Like not having South African teams in a European competition?
Like having a sensible format that actually makes it an elite competition?
There's just so much wrong with the current format.
RAEBURN SHIELD
There probably is but we have got to the last 16 with a good chance of progressing further. That is all that matters to me!
Quote:Bath Hammer
There probably is but we have got to the last 16 with a good chance of progressing further. That is all that matters to me!
Inclined to agree BH, draw format will be irrelevant to the eventual winners, does look as though if we get past Exeter we'll end up in Toulouse again though.
Fantastic atmosphere in the ground and I thought Bath fans made a lot of noise.
With a little more composure in the second half we’d have had the TBP and possibly the win.
Some of our attacking lines were a joy to watch and the performance really deserved a home last 16 game.
Toulouse without Dupont definitely beatable.
Only downside for me was Bath being held up over the line yet again, this is becoming a trend.
Also playing an English side in the last 16 is just tedious.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:21:20:56:33 by OutsideBath.
With a little more composure in the second half we’d have had the TBP and possibly the win.
Some of our attacking lines were a joy to watch and the performance really deserved a home last 16 game.
Toulouse without Dupont definitely beatable.
Only downside for me was Bath being held up over the line yet again, this is becoming a trend.
Also playing an English side in the last 16 is just tedious.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:21:20:56:33 by OutsideBath.
Yes, we always try to burrow our way through a pile of bodies & just occasionally we get the combination of a possible grounding on the line & a sympathetic referee but we usually we fail. It doesn’t fill me with confidence again having to try to beat Toulouse away & it’s apparently not certain that DuPont will not be playing (unless I haven’t heard something ) However, let’s be hopeful as for much of that match we were on top. We do, though, need to sort out that failure to get over the white line business & quickly if we are serious about winning something!
PS West Ham conceding a goal & losing 2 points in the 10th minute of injury time didn’t help my mood!
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:21:22:09:07 by Bath Hammer.
PS West Ham conceding a goal & losing 2 points in the 10th minute of injury time didn’t help my mood!
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:21:22:09:07 by Bath Hammer.
Quote:Quel CarreleurQuote:like o ly having 16 teams, im 4 pools of 4?Rokobilly
Lots of repeats from pool stages. Can't help thinking there must have been a better way than these seedings.
Like not having South African teams in a European competition?
Like having a sensible format that actually makes it an elite competition?
There's just so much wrong with the current format.
But it's so exciting that all those 0 win sides had a chance (and some did) progress after losing more games than winning. It's so exciting that positions are being decided by who are fortunate enough to play the SA (and some French) sides home or away. It's so exciting that the knockout stages deliver group stage repeats. It's so exciting that teams with lesser points can qualify higher by virtue of poor groups...
It's a tournament without natural justice and it'll harm it in the long run.
Quote:Bath Hammer
Yes, we always try to burrow our way through a pile of bodies & just occasionally we get the combination of a possible grounding on the line & a sympathetic referee but we usually we fail. It doesn’t fill me with confidence again having to try to beat Toulouse away & it’s apparently not certain that DuPont will not be playing (unless I haven’t heard something ) However, let’s be hopeful as for much of that match we were on top. We do, though, need to sort out that failure to get over the white line business & quickly if we are serious about winning something!
PS West Ham conceding a goal & losing 2 points in the 10th minute of injury time didn’t help my mood!
What did you hear on Dupont, BH? I thought it was a done deal that this was his last 15s game for a while?
It was mentioned in the commentary on TNT. The view was that Toulouse would do everything they could to keep him on whilst they were progressing in the competition. Whether they succeed though is another matter.
He has to play qualifying 7s tournaments. He might be back by the time of the QFs
Don’t write Racing off - they are top of the French league, and could well turn Toulouse over, particularly if DuPont isn’t playing. If they do, we would play Racing at home in the QFs if we beat the Chiefs!!
It seems ironic at this time of the draw no games are easy - going to Sandy Park a familiar ground familiar team seems a palatable option IMHO - an incredibly hard game but which game at this level isn’t? If and big if we beat the Chiefs a game against Toulouse or Racing 92 will not put the fear of god into our squad - they have beaten Racing and given Toulouse a really good run for their money. As mentioned without Du Pont Toulouse may struggle despite the obvious quality they have look at us without Spencer.
There was talk yesterday about Toulouse insisting Du Pont being available during the knockout stages - cannot see that being allowed- as they say you cannot give your blessing and then withdraw it.
There was talk yesterday about Toulouse insisting Du Pont being available during the knockout stages - cannot see that being allowed- as they say you cannot give your blessing and then withdraw it.
Sitting in the departure lounge I was wondering if we beat Exeter, no easy feat, I am correct in understanding we would then be away to Toulouse (again) or Racing (again)
I think if we bt exeter it's either toulouse away or racing at home based on the above thread (no idea myself!).
Annett had a curious performance. Set piece and carry were great but often way too high on the tackle and conceded easy metres. A strong case to he first choice hooker.
One thing is the next fixture is not for a while, beginning April I think? So that gives dupont the chance to get 7s ready but maybe come back.
It also means teams missing large numbers of players might have some of them back!
It also means teams missing large numbers of players might have some of them back!
Quote:Gaughers
Annett had a curious performance. Set piece and carry were great but often way too high on the tackle and conceded easy metres. A strong case to he first choice hooker.
Yes I would be much happier if Annett and Cloete chose not to try and crash balls into 20+ stone players - physics is only going to work one way in those collisions (i.e. backwards).
Also agree with all those above - the sneak around the breakdown 2m flop attempts are generally not working, chuck it beyond the crouching pod of tight 5 giants and it works a lot better. Billy Sela is great at that and almost inevitably scores, low at the 10s feet.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Mods must be delighted as the thing about our draw is that it makes preview writing a doddle as we already have them written for Racing 92 and Toulouse. 
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Quote:OldMarovian
One thing is the next fixture is not for a while, beginning April I think? So that gives dupont the chance to get 7s ready but maybe come back.
It also means teams missing large numbers of players might have some of them back!
And with luck we will have Hill, Underhill & Barbeary - The HUB - ready to outsmart Willis
Quote:hemingtonQuote:OldMarovian
One thing is the next fixture is not for a while, beginning April I think? So that gives dupont the chance to get 7s ready but maybe come back.
It also means teams missing large numbers of players might have some of them back!
And with luck we will have Hill, Underhill & Barbeary - The HUB - ready to outsmart Willis
Presumably they would have Romain Ntamack.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Quote:BathMatt53Quote:hemingtonQuote:OldMarovian
One thing is the next fixture is not for a while, beginning April I think? So that gives dupont the chance to get 7s ready but maybe come back.
It also means teams missing large numbers of players might have some of them back!
And with luck we will have Hill, Underhill & Barbeary - The HUB - ready to outsmart Willis
Presumably they would have Romain Ntamack.
Reminded me of Butch and Sundance:
Wait a minute - you didn't see Lefors out there did you?
Sundance Kid: Lefors? No, why?
Butch Cassidy: Thank God for that. For a moment there I thought we were in trouble.
To be honest, Ramos is playing SO well at 10, Ntamack may struggle to get his shirt back!
Agree that, for us, the biggest improvement we could make would be to add depth in the back row by getting Hill and Underhill available (obviously very much a "First World Problem" given how short our injury list currently is). Reid and Bayliss were immense yesterday. Reid carried so well and Bayliss' work rate, for only his second game, was remarkable. But in games like that, we need a 6-2 split, and the likes of Coetzee and Bayliss coming off the bench. I think Richards came on yesterday but for only about 5 minutes, so didn't make an impact.
Still can't get my head around Spencer's withdrawal. It was bang on 60 minutes so almost like it was planned, but the 20 minutes that Dupont had on the pitch without Spencer opposite decided the game. It's not like we've felt the need to replace Spencer in other games this season. He's played 80 plenty of times. So why oh why, versus the best 9 in the world, in our biggest game of the season, with the scores level, did he come off?
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Agree that, for us, the biggest improvement we could make would be to add depth in the back row by getting Hill and Underhill available (obviously very much a "First World Problem" given how short our injury list currently is). Reid and Bayliss were immense yesterday. Reid carried so well and Bayliss' work rate, for only his second game, was remarkable. But in games like that, we need a 6-2 split, and the likes of Coetzee and Bayliss coming off the bench. I think Richards came on yesterday but for only about 5 minutes, so didn't make an impact.
Still can't get my head around Spencer's withdrawal. It was bang on 60 minutes so almost like it was planned, but the 20 minutes that Dupont had on the pitch without Spencer opposite decided the game. It's not like we've felt the need to replace Spencer in other games this season. He's played 80 plenty of times. So why oh why, versus the best 9 in the world, in our biggest game of the season, with the scores level, did he come off?
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Quote:dr.bath1865
Still can't get my head around Spencer's withdrawal. It was bang on 60 minutes so almost like it was planned, but the 20 minutes that Dupont had on the pitch without Spencer opposite decided the game. It's not like we've felt the need to replace Spencer in other games this season. He's played 80 plenty of times. So why oh why, versus the best 9 in the world, in our biggest game of the season, with the scores level, did he come off?
Yes it is a huge drop off from Spencer at the moment, which is a worry. I can't really see it being solved any time soon withing the current squad.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Telling that we have been (seemingly unsuccessfully) linked with Ben White.
Options are:
Sign someone (tough one when we have spencer in situ as capt)
Play schreuder more to give him a chance
Place trust in TCS / Lock
Games like that really shine the light on squad shortcomings. We stood up remarkably well. As I have said I think now we need to focus on a smaller, higher quality squad where second choices are v v close to first choices.
There are already quite a 50:50ish calls in the squad I think.
Tdt/ stuart
Dunn/ annett
Stooke/ roux
Hill/ underhill / barbeary vs bayliss/ reid/ coetzee
Cam/mojo
Tdg/gallagher/ Harris
V happy to see any of them playing.
Half back is so specialist and so key - really difficult box to square off.
Options are:
Sign someone (tough one when we have spencer in situ as capt)
Play schreuder more to give him a chance
Place trust in TCS / Lock
Games like that really shine the light on squad shortcomings. We stood up remarkably well. As I have said I think now we need to focus on a smaller, higher quality squad where second choices are v v close to first choices.
There are already quite a 50:50ish calls in the squad I think.
Tdt/ stuart
Dunn/ annett
Stooke/ roux
Hill/ underhill / barbeary vs bayliss/ reid/ coetzee
Cam/mojo
Tdg/gallagher/ Harris
V happy to see any of them playing.
Half back is so specialist and so key - really difficult box to square off.
Schreuder seemed a bit overwhelmed which for a scrum half at 33 seems a bit concerning, we have to give TCS a go from the start or sign another Peter Stringer type player!
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Was it certain that Spencer was taken off for tactical reasons or could he have sustained an injury that wasn't obvious to the naked eye. I have no idea, just asking?
Although disappointed by the final result and the fact that we certainly had opportunities to score more tries, it would not have been too long ago that I would have feared a cricket score defeat against Toulouse. We are certainly improving week by week.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:22:12:49:34 by bathwickboy.
Although disappointed by the final result and the fact that we certainly had opportunities to score more tries, it would not have been too long ago that I would have feared a cricket score defeat against Toulouse. We are certainly improving week by week.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:22:12:49:34 by bathwickboy.
Quote:bathwickboy
Was it certain that Spencer was taken off for tactical reasons or could he have sustained an injury that wasn't obvious to the naked eye. I have no idea, just asking?
Although disappointed by the final result and the fact that we certainly had opportunities to score more tries, it would not have been too long ago that I would have feared a cricket score defeat against Toulouse. We are certainly improving week by week.
It's listed as 'tactical' in the official match stats.
Ok thanks for that, in which case, it was a very strange decision at such a crucial time.
One thing I want to point out and give huge plaudits to is our front 5 - I was fed up in the lead up to this match to hear from English journalists how Toulouse were going to destroy our pack and our front row was going to be "mincemeat".
Have to say it drove me insane the Toulouse/French loving journalists - Thomas Du Toit who is a World Cup Winning Spingbok International prop did a job and more than held his own against the "Wonderful, unbelievable, most powerful and greatest loose head prop" Cyril Baille who looked "shellshocked when he was subbed off - looked like a man who had been given a torrid time in the scrum and loose. Same for Aldegheri and Mauvaka looked a shadow of the player although I did think Julien Marchand shored things up for them in the set piece and you can see why he is Number 1.
Jelonch again looked battered when he came off - I think the two players IMHO who caused us the most issues was Tom Willis (he did get away with a lot - at one point it was picked up on Brace's ref link "Ref same rules for our 7 please" and Meafou who was a monster although again Brace let him get away with hands and swimming up the side of rucks and mauls.
The worst thing for me and I actually kind of thought Brace was alright for him - was his total lack of penalising Toulouse's lazy runners and tacklers who just hung around slowing our ball all game, and his insistence on wanting to card Cloete for the no arms ruck - when Frank Murphy and the TMO were literally begging him to reconsider and look once again at the lazy tackler in this case Akhi who tripped Cloete (who I personally thought had a great game) as he came to clear out and still Brace gave a penalty to Toulouse.
Had Akhi not done what he did we would have walked over the line for the TBP - although apart from the fact we are not at home I am not disappointed with the outcome/draw.
Have to say it drove me insane the Toulouse/French loving journalists - Thomas Du Toit who is a World Cup Winning Spingbok International prop did a job and more than held his own against the "Wonderful, unbelievable, most powerful and greatest loose head prop" Cyril Baille who looked "shellshocked when he was subbed off - looked like a man who had been given a torrid time in the scrum and loose. Same for Aldegheri and Mauvaka looked a shadow of the player although I did think Julien Marchand shored things up for them in the set piece and you can see why he is Number 1.
Jelonch again looked battered when he came off - I think the two players IMHO who caused us the most issues was Tom Willis (he did get away with a lot - at one point it was picked up on Brace's ref link "Ref same rules for our 7 please" and Meafou who was a monster although again Brace let him get away with hands and swimming up the side of rucks and mauls.
The worst thing for me and I actually kind of thought Brace was alright for him - was his total lack of penalising Toulouse's lazy runners and tacklers who just hung around slowing our ball all game, and his insistence on wanting to card Cloete for the no arms ruck - when Frank Murphy and the TMO were literally begging him to reconsider and look once again at the lazy tackler in this case Akhi who tripped Cloete (who I personally thought had a great game) as he came to clear out and still Brace gave a penalty to Toulouse.
Had Akhi not done what he did we would have walked over the line for the TBP - although apart from the fact we are not at home I am not disappointed with the outcome/draw.
Yep esp strange in the context of not playing this week vs bris.
Was tdt OK when he came off? Looked like he was getting treated before he came off but seemed like stuart was already due to come in with a few other subs at that exact break in play
Was tdt OK when he came off? Looked like he was getting treated before he came off but seemed like stuart was already due to come in with a few other subs at that exact break in play
Very good analysis Ali, Jelonch got constantly battered by Reid who was incessant.
Toulouse were 50:50 with us until the changes were made then they just changed gear.
They are very hard to beat in Toulouse but at the Rec it’s doable.
Missing that 4th try will be costly!
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Toulouse were 50:50 with us until the changes were made then they just changed gear.
They are very hard to beat in Toulouse but at the Rec it’s doable.
Missing that 4th try will be costly!
Quote:Quel CarreleurQuote:like o ly having 16 teams, im 4 pools of 4?Rokobilly
Lots of repeats from pool stages. Can't help thinking there must have been a better way than these seedings.
Like not having South African teams in a European competition?
Like having a sensible format that actually makes it an elite competition?
There's just so much wrong with the current format.
Totally agree, if only the organisers considered what fans want.
Might also help if they had some form of geography education so they would understand SA isn’t part of Europe.
Quote:JK7
Literally begging, were they Ali?
I think it is fair to say it is unusual if you watch for an assistant referee to raise the subject of the tackler on more than 2 occasions and then the TMO joining in on more than 2 occasions - Brace wanted to give Cloete a card and at first would not listen to his assistant or his TMO - it was only the persistence of both Frank Murphy and the TMO which made Brace actually realise why the incident had occurred - he still gave a penalty though despite finally accepting Akhi's presence and part in causing the issue.
Quote:Ali1969Quote:JK7
Literally begging, were they Ali?
I think it is fair to say it is unusual if you watch for an assistant referee to raise the subject of the tackler on more than 2 occasions and then the TMO joining in on more than 2 occasions - Brace wanted to give Cloete a card and at first would not listen to his assistant or his TMO - it was only the persistence of both Frank Murphy and the TMO which made Brace actually realise why the incident had occurred - he still gave a penalty though despite finally accepting Akhi's presence and part in causing the issue.
The crowd also wanted Brace to give a yellow card and were very vocal about it!
At the ground it looked like we were totally outplayed at the breakdown, which highlighted how much we missed Sam Underhill. For me Cloete is too small and fairly ineffective for us at the breakdown.
We were definitely outplayed at the breakdown, particularly by Willis. I also think that one or both of Dunn and Barbeary would have turned one of those times we were pounding on their line into a try.
I'm still gutted but I came away proud of the effort and with a sneaking suspicion we could turn them over with a second shot at it.
I'm still gutted but I came away proud of the effort and with a sneaking suspicion we could turn them over with a second shot at it.
Quote:Ali1969Quote:JK7
Literally begging, were they Ali?
I think it is fair to say it is unusual if you watch for an assistant referee to raise the subject of the tackler on more than 2 occasions and then the TMO joining in on more than 2 occasions - Brace wanted to give Cloete a card and at first would not listen to his assistant or his TMO - it was only the persistence of both Frank Murphy and the TMO which made Brace actually realise why the incident had occurred - he still gave a penalty though despite finally accepting Akhi's presence and part in causing the issue.
Agree Ali, just being picky with the language.
I think the penalty was a fair outcome. I’ve been critical of Cloete’s discipline but he was unlucky in that instance, as he’d have made a different clear out if he hadn’t been impeded. Still, fair penalty.
Problem in that passage was JCok not giving it to Muir following Lawrence’s unbelievable offload. Muir would have walked it in.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Problem in that passage was JCok not giving it to Muir following Lawrence’s unbelievable offload. Muir would have walked it in.
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
Joe C not reading situations seems to be becoming a more regular feature of his game - possibly because he is getting his hands on the ball so much more often? But you have to wonder whether his physical advantages over, a (fit) McConnoghie/De Glanville might at some point cede to their better peripheral vision?
Its not in attack that the issue lies more defence for me, over running the kick chase and his positioning just seems laboured, he was offside at the breakdown on one occasion and looked started when the ref told him to take a step back.
Compare that to Will Muir's acceleration onto a dropping ball which inevitably resulted in a massive legal collision. Can we clone Muir perhaps?
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Compare that to Will Muir's acceleration onto a dropping ball which inevitably resulted in a massive legal collision. Can we clone Muir perhaps?
And therein lies the debate at contract renewal time- I'd imagine JCok can demand a fair whack nowadays, but how much of our cap does he deserve?
He feels a little like a luxury when, especially given the investment we've made in our inside backs, another Muir-style workhorse might be preferable. Given the way we play, I'd almost prefer a worse winger (less pace, smaller etc) but a better rugby player (better vision, hands, positioning etc). Someone said something about Dupont- Aaron Smith is the best 9 in the world but Dupont is the best rugby player. I'm beginning to think that maybe instead of JCok, I'd prefer a better player.
Having said that, the improvements JCok has made in form and fitness over the last 6 months under JVG, Blackett, and our S&C have been impressive. And everyone always talks about his high ceiling. So he might be a guy that we need to keep investing in as he might just score a cracker in a final and win a trophy for us one day. In JvG we trust...
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
He feels a little like a luxury when, especially given the investment we've made in our inside backs, another Muir-style workhorse might be preferable. Given the way we play, I'd almost prefer a worse winger (less pace, smaller etc) but a better rugby player (better vision, hands, positioning etc). Someone said something about Dupont- Aaron Smith is the best 9 in the world but Dupont is the best rugby player. I'm beginning to think that maybe instead of JCok, I'd prefer a better player.
Having said that, the improvements JCok has made in form and fitness over the last 6 months under JVG, Blackett, and our S&C have been impressive. And everyone always talks about his high ceiling. So he might be a guy that we need to keep investing in as he might just score a cracker in a final and win a trophy for us one day. In JvG we trust...
2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper
JCok has really improved under JvG and I’d be disappointed if he now left.
However in that moment against Toulouse he wasn’t thinking clearly, which is something to work on.
Unfortunately as a result Quins have been handed a relative bye into the next round and we have to go to an Exeter side who are almost unbeatable at home.
Small margins.
However in that moment against Toulouse he wasn’t thinking clearly, which is something to work on.
Unfortunately as a result Quins have been handed a relative bye into the next round and we have to go to an Exeter side who are almost unbeatable at home.
Small margins.
“Unfortunately as a result Quins have been handed a relative bye into the next round and we have to go to an Exeter side who are almost unbeatable at home”
Possibly entering a slump, though, and even with home advantage none of the other match ups would have been easy.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:23:10:34:46 by Bath Hammer.
Possibly entering a slump, though, and even with home advantage none of the other match ups would have been easy.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:01:23:10:34:46 by Bath Hammer.
Quote:OutsideBath
Unfortunately as a result Quins have been handed a relative bye into the next round and we have to go to an Exeter side who are almost unbeatable at home
The same Glasgow that should have beaten Exeter at home a couple of weeks ago?
[quote by][quote=OutsideBath]Unfortunately as a result Quins have been handed a relative bye into the next round and we have to go to an Exeter side who are almost unbeatable at home[/quote]
No disrespect to Exeter but I just don’t think that’s true in the way it used to be.
Not a gimme by any stretch but Bath should travel with confidence
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
No disrespect to Exeter but I just don’t think that’s true in the way it used to be.
Not a gimme by any stretch but Bath should travel with confidence
’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”
The fact that, with all of his physical gifts, with England's lack of nailed-on wingers, and England's need for some ball-carrying heft in midfield, Joe isn't in Borthwick's thinking means there is definitely room for improvement in his all-round game. However - I'd really hate him to leave. Would very much like to see him carry on the upwards trajectory under JvG/Blackett.
Given the bracket, you'd have to say we'd rather be on our side of the draw.
[www.epcrugby.com]
Without wishing to hex anything, I'm looking at flights to the UK for the w/e of 25th of May... and dusting off my ancient yellow away jersey
... IMHO, of course.
Now in Honolulu
[www.epcrugby.com]
Without wishing to hex anything, I'm looking at flights to the UK for the w/e of 25th of May... and dusting off my ancient yellow away jersey
... IMHO, of course.
Now in Honolulu
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