Bath
DESPERATE DERBY. GLOUCESTER v BATH
Ewels: must lead
By PG Tips
April 26 2022
Both teams should be desperate for victory at Kingsholm on Saturday. Gloucester, 6th in the table have a top 4 finish in their sights, while Bath have only 3 games to conjure enough points to claw themselves off the bottom. The hosts, with Harlequins and Saracens to follow will see this as their easiest remaining fixture and should be in ruthless and focused mood. Bath, cursing another match they let slip last weekend, have only pride to play for. They will be desperate to put some gloss on a dreadful season.
Under George Skivington Gloucester have revived the basics of their traditions. Their victories this season have been fashioned on a game that is simple, powerful and direct. Their defence is tight and tenacious, they are secure in the scrum and brutal at the breakdown. Most threatening of all for Bath though is their lineout and driving maul which inflicted so much damage at the Rec on Boxing Day and in the Premiership Cup in November.
Gloucester may lack star names up front, but Ruskin, Socino and Balmain are chips off the old Kingsholm block while the loose forwards Reid, Ludlow and Ackermann are combative at the breakdown and deadly in driving play. In the backs, hard running centres Atkinson and Harris tend to take the direct route, narrowing the defence to make space for the power of Thornley and zip of Rees-Zammit on the wings. With Hastings kicking astutely from hand and tee, they will expect a feast of scoring to decorate the derby.
Bath will be working on ways to blunt Gloucester’s driving maul, which Bristol did so effectively at Ashton Gate last Friday. Bristol also exposed the Cherry and White’s vulnerability to slick offload and late changes to the point of attack. Bath must aim to stretch their opponents and vary both the point and style of attack to make inroads.
Two familiar ills undid Bath against Northampton last Saturday. As feared, an inability to sustain intensity and focus for 80 minutes, combined with a shaky and shambolic defence in the final 15 minutes allowed Saints 24 unanswered points and a fortunate, if ultimately deserved victory. The turning point appeared to be the injury to Saints lock Nansen. While he was being treated Ludlam got his troops together and read them the riot act. Bath, by contrast, seemed content to rest and wait. Saints pack attacked the ensuing scrum as if in the dying seconds of a major final, splintering Bath and inspiring a dominant spell which brought 3 more tries. Skipper Ewels is aware of Bath’s tendency to switch off. He and his lieutenants must provide the leadership to ensure it does not happen again.
Once again a full 80 plus minute effort is needed – physically and mentally. If not, this derby date will be desperate indeed.
Possible Teams:
Bath:, Morozov, Dunn, Stuart, Ewels (Capt.), Spencer, Faletau, Underhill, Coetzee. B Spencer, Cipriani. Muir, Clark, Joseph, Cokanasiga. De Glanville.
Replacements: Du Toit, Cordwell, Rae, Richards, Reid. Simpson, Bailey, Ojomoh.
Gloucester: Ruskin, Socino, Balmain, Clarke, Alemanno, Reid, Ludlow (Capt.), Ackermann. Chapman, Hastings. Thorley, Atkinson, Harris, Rees- Zammit. Carreras.
Replacements: Singleton, Elrington, Ford-Robinson, Davidson, Morgan. Meehan, Twelvetrees, Seabrook.
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StumbleuponDESPERATE DERBY. GLOUCESTER v BATH. TEAM UP!
Discussion started by Comeonmylovers.co.uk (IP Logged), 26/04/2022 10:16
26/04/2022 10:16
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Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2022:05:09:12:04:27 by P G Tips.
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Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2022:05:09:12:04:27 by P G Tips.
Has Roko been cloned he is starting and on the bench. not a bad idea we won’t miss him when he leaves.
I think we can win this!
If we can get Glos to agree to 30 minutes each way.
If we can get Glos to agree to 30 minutes each way.
Quote:Will he be at the Army v Navy game too??TG Kesmo
Has Roko been cloned he is starting and on the bench. not a bad idea we won’t miss him when he leaves.
Quote:PGTips
Bath will be working on ways to blunt Gloucester’s driving maul, which Bristol did so effectively at Ashton Gate last Friday.
This could sum up the season in some ways, if we have made progress on our own maul and worked out how to wreck the opposition's then that will indicate development up front. We await with interest.
To sum up this forum at present then, if we stick to previous strategies we need to be about 25 points up with 20m to go?
Or have an adjusted strategy, such as the starting forwards make it through >70 mins?
Or have an adjusted strategy, such as the starting forwards make it through >70 mins?
Quote:B4thB4ck
To sum up this forum at present then, if we stick to previous strategies we need to be about 25 points up with 20m to go?
Or have an adjusted strategy, such as the starting forwards make it through >70 mins?
I’m not sure it works like that. Any points advantage seems capable of being overturned with this mindset & on field leadership
Team up, Reid's 50th:
Miles Reid will make his 50th Bath Rugby appearance in the West Country derby with Gloucester on Saturday.
The 23-year-old homegrown flanker debuted for the Blue, Black and White in January 2018 and developed into an integral player in the club’s squad.
He is joined in the back row by England international Sam Underhill who returns looking to add to his six tries scored this season.
Underhill is just behind Will Muir on Bath’s try-scoring list. The wing has seven tries to his name and lines up in a back three alongside Tom de Glanville and Joe Cokanasiga – both of whom have five scores.
The remaining members of the starting XV began the match against Northampton Saints last time out.
Max Clark and Jonathan Joseph pair up once again in the centre while Ben Spencer and Danny Cipriani are at scrum-half and fly-half respectively.
The front row of Valeriy Morozov, Tom Dunn and Will Stuart continues as a trio for the fourth consecutive match. Mike Williams, Charlie Ewels and Taulupe Faletau complete the pack.
On the bench, there is a return for Ollie Fox who is in line for his first league outing since the win over Worcester Warriors in January.
Bath Rugby team to play Gloucester
15 Tom de Glanville, 14 Joe Cokanasiga, 13 Jonathan Joseph, 12 Max Clark, 11 Will Muir, 10 Danny Cipriani, 9 Ben Spencer; 1 Valeriy Morozov, 2 Tom Dunn, 3 Will Stuart, 4 Mike Williams, 5 Charlie Ewels ©, 6 Miles Reid, 7 Sam Underhill, 8 Taulupe Faletau
Replacements
16 Jacques du Toit, 17 Arthur Cordwell, 18 Ma’afu Fia, 19 Ewan Richards, 20 Jaco Coetzee, 21 Ollie Fox, 22 Orlando Bailey, 23 Will Butt
P G Tips
Jaco Coetzee: my adopted Player, 2023-24.
Miles Reid will make his 50th Bath Rugby appearance in the West Country derby with Gloucester on Saturday.
The 23-year-old homegrown flanker debuted for the Blue, Black and White in January 2018 and developed into an integral player in the club’s squad.
He is joined in the back row by England international Sam Underhill who returns looking to add to his six tries scored this season.
Underhill is just behind Will Muir on Bath’s try-scoring list. The wing has seven tries to his name and lines up in a back three alongside Tom de Glanville and Joe Cokanasiga – both of whom have five scores.
The remaining members of the starting XV began the match against Northampton Saints last time out.
Max Clark and Jonathan Joseph pair up once again in the centre while Ben Spencer and Danny Cipriani are at scrum-half and fly-half respectively.
The front row of Valeriy Morozov, Tom Dunn and Will Stuart continues as a trio for the fourth consecutive match. Mike Williams, Charlie Ewels and Taulupe Faletau complete the pack.
On the bench, there is a return for Ollie Fox who is in line for his first league outing since the win over Worcester Warriors in January.
Bath Rugby team to play Gloucester
15 Tom de Glanville, 14 Joe Cokanasiga, 13 Jonathan Joseph, 12 Max Clark, 11 Will Muir, 10 Danny Cipriani, 9 Ben Spencer; 1 Valeriy Morozov, 2 Tom Dunn, 3 Will Stuart, 4 Mike Williams, 5 Charlie Ewels ©, 6 Miles Reid, 7 Sam Underhill, 8 Taulupe Faletau
Replacements
16 Jacques du Toit, 17 Arthur Cordwell, 18 Ma’afu Fia, 19 Ewan Richards, 20 Jaco Coetzee, 21 Ollie Fox, 22 Orlando Bailey, 23 Will Butt
P G Tips
Jaco Coetzee: my adopted Player, 2023-24.
Again virtually down to Hobson's choice at prop & lock. Back row, centres and back 3 look good. Continuing absence of Ojomoh suggests either that he needs rest or there are work-ons to address.
Just hope Cipriani can withstand the inevitable onslaught, physical on the pitch and mental (from the Shed) off it.
P G Tips
Jaco Coetzee: my adopted Player, 2023-24.
Just hope Cipriani can withstand the inevitable onslaught, physical on the pitch and mental (from the Shed) off it.
P G Tips
Jaco Coetzee: my adopted Player, 2023-24.
The 2 Russian props up against each other should be fun. Still banging the play Coetzee at 8 drum but I guess Toby owes us a big game. Should be a belter!
adopted player, 24/25 Hame Faiva. 23/24 Ted Hill. 22/23 Cam Redpath. 21/22 Max Clark. 20/21 Henry Thomas. 19/20 Max Wright. 18/19 Cooper Vuna.
adopted player, 24/25 Hame Faiva. 23/24 Ted Hill. 22/23 Cam Redpath. 21/22 Max Clark. 20/21 Henry Thomas. 19/20 Max Wright. 18/19 Cooper Vuna.
Quote:woodpecker
Got offered a ticket £70....maybe not
Been given a ticket to watch first game for years with Glos fan and his very Glos family. First visit to Kingsholm since I played for the Bath Youth there over 30 years ago. Hoping I retain happy memories!
Good looking starting XV that. Packed with internationals. Should comfortably win a random 20-minute period of the game.
Quote:Optimist
Good looking starting XV that. Packed with internationals. Should comfortably win a random 20-minute period of the game.
I lol and I cry.
Quote:Optimist
Good looking starting XV that. Packed with internationals. Should comfortably win a random 20-minute period of the game.
What quarter are the following incidents then? The red card, the hamstring injury, the refereeing balls up and the shed's mocking jeering?
Think the real question is how many points do Bath need to be up with 20 minutes to go and still have a chance of winning?
I reckon 30pts should do it.
I reckon 30pts should do it.
Quote:P G Tips
Again virtually down to Hobson's choice at prop & lock. Back row, centres and back 3 look good. Continuing absence of Ojomoh suggests either that he needs rest or there are work-ons to address.
Just hope Cipriani can withstand the inevitable onslaught, physical on the pitch and mental (from the Shed) off it.
Hatley mentioned in his match preview that Max Ojomo is coming back from an injury and will be challenging for a place in the team
Stuart out. Fia starts. Rae on the bench.
It feels as if that extinguishes even the slimmest of hopes I had.
It feels as if that extinguishes even the slimmest of hopes I had.
Quote:dr.bath1865
Stuart out. Fia starts. Rae on the bench.
It feels as if that extinguishes even the slimmest of hopes I had.
Exactly my reaction
Quote:P G Tips
Richards also out, replaced by Casson.
PG
Forgotten about him actually, wonder what his status is?
Quote:RokobillyQuote:dr.bath1865
Stuart out. Fia starts. Rae on the bench.
It feels as if that extinguishes even the slimmest of hopes I had.
Exactly my reaction
Mine too
Maybe this is recency bias, but has anyone else noticed that we seem to be having a lot more last minute withdrawals from the match squad this year?
I know that we’ve had injury issues and our league position probably means that it’s not worth risking players who are margin calls but it does seem excessive in comparison to previous years and other teams.
I know that we’ve had injury issues and our league position probably means that it’s not worth risking players who are margin calls but it does seem excessive in comparison to previous years and other teams.
Agree. As you say, Reclus, might be a bias but feels that way.
Our selection is chaos every week. It’s been better recently, but there has been no consistency for years. I guess if you have a long injury list it has knock on effects as you hope guys who have knocks might make it rather than having the luxury of being able to leave them out from the off.
I might not know their setup well enough, but if you look the spine of a team like Quins, 2 Walker 8 Domb 9 Care 10 Smith 12 Est seem to play almost every game. Our spine is in constant rotation so no wonder we never gel.
As said, might be bias, but JvG needs to fix as a priority the squad depth and the fitness/injury record as a priority so we pick similar squads from week to week.
Our selection is chaos every week. It’s been better recently, but there has been no consistency for years. I guess if you have a long injury list it has knock on effects as you hope guys who have knocks might make it rather than having the luxury of being able to leave them out from the off.
I might not know their setup well enough, but if you look the spine of a team like Quins, 2 Walker 8 Domb 9 Care 10 Smith 12 Est seem to play almost every game. Our spine is in constant rotation so no wonder we never gel.
As said, might be bias, but JvG needs to fix as a priority the squad depth and the fitness/injury record as a priority so we pick similar squads from week to week.
Morosov yellow card high tackle in the first few minutes.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
We give away SO many stupid penalties that result in either field position or cards against. So dumb.
What is Morosov supposed to do? He has to tackle him. That is his job. The Gloucester 15 is almost sitting on his heels when contact is made.
TDG uses his ‘dangly bits’ to prevent a try !
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Max. Lark yellow for a trip, Mike Williams got away with two yellows already!
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
We don’t need a new head coach. We need a primary school teacher to these guys a bit of common sense.
Quote:dr.bath1865
We don’t need a new head coach. We need a primary school teacher to these guys a bit of common sense.
😂😂😂
No territory, no possession, no discipline. We are very lucky to be within 2 scores. Given our recent 2nd half performances, and the tackles we've had to make already. I fear this could get ugly.
Joe C, love him in attack but his defensive clumsiness is dreadful !
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
That was a truly embarrassing half of rugby, given how poor we’ve been in second half’s this could be a cricket score if they don’t come out and show some fight.
How Mike Williams is still on the field, I’ve no idea. Lucky to avoid head contact in a couple of upright hits but if I was management I’d pull him, a walking penalty / knock on waiting to happen.
To echo the above comments, love Joe C on the ball but defensively he leaves a lot to be desired…
On the plus side, Underhill is outstanding.
How Mike Williams is still on the field, I’ve no idea. Lucky to avoid head contact in a couple of upright hits but if I was management I’d pull him, a walking penalty / knock on waiting to happen.
To echo the above comments, love Joe C on the ball but defensively he leaves a lot to be desired…
On the plus side, Underhill is outstanding.
Well that was a wasted 40 mins.
Bath offering nothing of any value to this game, players look totally disinterested and lacking any leadership. What is our captain doing just standing around after each try?
If I were JvG I’d be checking my contract for a get out clause, he’s been given a real hospital pass coming to Bath.
Bath offering nothing of any value to this game, players look totally disinterested and lacking any leadership. What is our captain doing just standing around after each try?
If I were JvG I’d be checking my contract for a get out clause, he’s been given a real hospital pass coming to Bath.
Damning comment in commentary about “lack of emotion from Bath”.
In a derby?
JvG has much to do!
PG
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022:04:30:16:06:37 by P G Tips.
In a derby?
JvG has much to do!
PG
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022:04:30:16:06:37 by P G Tips.
Ugo sums it up as Gloucester score their 5th, 52 seconds into the second half - EMBARASSING
Jeez, good luck JvG.
The front five are abysmal, lineouts all over the show, poor discipline and not fronting up as a unit. Ewels is an abomination of a skipper, no-one listens to him, players or refs, never seemingly giving strategic direction or leading by example. Please lets get McNally back, either him or Underhill skipper for me next season please. Aside from Stuart the rest of the starting front five today can do one and leave the club.
Not sure what's going on with backs either, Cips only ever seems to have one runner outside him, where are the patterns of play.
C'mon Bath, give me something, next season can't come soon enough
The front five are abysmal, lineouts all over the show, poor discipline and not fronting up as a unit. Ewels is an abomination of a skipper, no-one listens to him, players or refs, never seemingly giving strategic direction or leading by example. Please lets get McNally back, either him or Underhill skipper for me next season please. Aside from Stuart the rest of the starting front five today can do one and leave the club.
Not sure what's going on with backs either, Cips only ever seems to have one runner outside him, where are the patterns of play.
C'mon Bath, give me something, next season can't come soon enough
Feel sorry for any Bath fans who wasted their time and money going to the game.
Perhaps the club will do the decent thing and reimburse them.
Perhaps the club will do the decent thing and reimburse them.
Got away with ity.
Commentary just said this season Gloucs have scored a try every 9 minutes vs Bath this season.
Utterlyu pathetic performance.
Commentary just said this season Gloucs have scored a try every 9 minutes vs Bath this season.
Utterlyu pathetic performance.
The boring commentator seemed to praise Ewels captaincy at the beginning with no justification. The combination of Ewels & Hatley gets us nowhere & has to change next season. I wonder how much time is spent on the training field instilling moves & actions by constant repetition rather than having leisurely chats in front of a white board. Other teams do their work instinctively & seem to know how to avoid illegal moves whereas we constantly fall foul of them.. Who looks after our defence now after Van Rensberg departed, no one it seems!
Underhill angrily scraps Hastings while WS and DC spectate!
Bath given up plus Bailey failing HIA can it get any worse!
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Bath given up plus Bailey failing HIA can it get any worse!
This is an utter shambles and a disgrace to all those players who have worn the shirt with PRIDE before. There nothing on show today to be proud of. Totally pi**ed off
Well one side clearly understands what a west country derby means.
One doesn't deserve to wear the shirt.
One doesn't deserve to wear the shirt.
This is worse than the 55-20 something hiding we got a few years ago up there. Will we score any points?
Adopted players: 24/25 J Bayliss; [24] O Lawrence; [23] J Cokanasiga; [22] M Green; [21] A Watson; [20] T Faletau; [19] M V Vuuren; [18] T Faletau; [17] D Denton; [16] H. Agulla; [15] L Houston; [14] W Spencer; [13] F. Louw
Family . Community . Nation - [sdp.org.uk]
My mind's been going places without me lately - Bushfire The B52's
Adopted players: 24/25 J Bayliss; [24] O Lawrence; [23] J Cokanasiga; [22] M Green; [21] A Watson; [20] T Faletau; [19] M V Vuuren; [18] T Faletau; [17] D Denton; [16] H. Agulla; [15] L Houston; [14] W Spencer; [13] F. Louw
Family . Community . Nation - [sdp.org.uk]
My mind's been going places without me lately - Bushfire The B52's
Quote:Dorset Boy
Well one side clearly understands what a west country derby means.
One doesn't deserve to wear the shirt.
Must admit I’m not keen on the not fit to wear the shirt sentiment, however the players don’t appear to be that bothered today.
Not sure when relegation is coming back, but Bath really deserve to be in the championship.
Agree OB.
I would never question effort, and do not believe anyone should, but something is very wrong today in the morale department.
PG
I would never question effort, and do not believe anyone should, but something is very wrong today in the morale department.
PG
Everything Gloucs do works.
Everything Bath do ends in a clumsy mistake.
50+ with 13 minutes for Bath to properly capitulate.
I don't think I've ever seen anything worse from Bath, but didn't bother to watch some of the earlier humiliations.
Everything Bath do ends in a clumsy mistake.
50+ with 13 minutes for Bath to properly capitulate.
I don't think I've ever seen anything worse from Bath, but didn't bother to watch some of the earlier humiliations.
I would say we're like bloody amateurs...but we were better, much better when we were amateurs!
Glos still fighting even with a 52 point lead. We have given up and just want to hear the final whistle. Really poor!
Meehan - that shoud be yellow for unsporting behaviour - well, well out of order pulling a player's boot off and throwing it away.
This is disgraceful. I think Hatley should go immediately, preferably by resignation but if not he should be sacked. Someone has to carry the can for this calamitous season.
That glaws try just about sums it. Our 100% ability not to score having huffed and puffed to get into red zone, then lose it contact and they go through about 12 hands for 90 metres and prop scores in corner
Hatley and Hooper are so lucky to have contracts for next year
Hatley and Hooper are so lucky to have contracts for next year
Lost the man advantage 10 minutes by 14 points.
A few heads should roll today.
There may have been individual effort, but zero collective effort.
Nilled for first time in 10 years.
Gloucs biggest win ever in the league, against anyone.
A few heads should roll today.
There may have been individual effort, but zero collective effort.
Nilled for first time in 10 years.
Gloucs biggest win ever in the league, against anyone.
Utterly embarrassing.
No desire, thank goodness I chose not to travel.
Apart from Underhill, every player was humiliated.
No desire, thank goodness I chose not to travel.
Apart from Underhill, every player was humiliated.
Quote:Whether it's Hatley or someone else, but making changes for next year just doesn't feel enough.Bath Hammer
This is disgraceful. I think Hatley should go immediately, preferably by resignation but if not he should be sacked. Someone has to carry the can for this calamitous season.
Shifting some people sideways is not a big enough penalty for the absolutely dire performances we've put in this season.
This has to be the lowest of the low. I haven’t renewed my ST and was going to renew next week but frankly the demolishment of the Bath name is depressing!
You know when you are advised not to post when you are angry 😡 in case you say something you might regret!
That’s why I’m not going to continue …….
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
That’s why I’m not going to continue …….
Abject misery. Why should I hand over £600+ for another season based on what I've just seen?
Assume its all down to injuries and we arent allowed to make any comments on the abilities of the management, coaches and players.
If so I won't bother saying anything.
Roll on the off- season.....
If so I won't bother saying anything.
Roll on the off- season.....
Quote:Bath Hammer
This is disgraceful. I think Hatley should go immediately, preferably by resignation but if not he should be sacked. Someone has to carry the can for this calamitous season.
I’d suggest as Hooper appointed him he should go as well.
A record Premiership loss to Gloucester…. And they could have scored many more in the first quarter.
Only 2 more matches to endure until we can final close the book on this season.
Only 2 more matches to endure until we can final close the book on this season.
Quote:OutsideBathQuote:Bath Hammer
This is disgraceful. I think Hatley should go immediately, preferably by resignation but if not he should be sacked. Someone has to carry the can for this calamitous season.
I’d suggest as Hooper appointed him he should go as well.
I wouldn’t disagree!
Why anyone would waste their hard earned money to buy a ticket to watch Bath at the moment I don't know?
Even the Elvis year wasn't as bad as this.
Even the Elvis year wasn't as bad as this.
Quote:I was planning to wait for the last minute to renew, as if that would send some kind of message, but in a moment of optimism while on holiday I renewed - keep the faith.CoochieCoo
This has to be the lowest of the low. I haven’t renewed my ST and was going to renew next week but frankly the demolishment of the Bath name is depressing!
Cmonbath renewed our season tickets on Tuesday or I'd be thinking very hard atm. We moved to Bath 12 years ago, mainly because of the rugby. I don't regret moving 'ere for one minute but I won't be renewing next season if they do this again. I don't need this to feel at home here.
Come on boys, start showing some respect for the fans - we've been showing up more than you this season. And that's saying something in my case - it's the first ever season where I've actually been a fair weather fan and stayed away when it was cold or wet. Why should I turn up when you've been consistently incapable of doing so. And you get paid for it whereas we have to pay.
Come on boys, start showing some respect for the fans - we've been showing up more than you this season. And that's saying something in my case - it's the first ever season where I've actually been a fair weather fan and stayed away when it was cold or wet. Why should I turn up when you've been consistently incapable of doing so. And you get paid for it whereas we have to pay.
I don’t know why I renewed so soon, especially with Hatley & Hooper still in position.
Perhaps if anyone from the club is reading the comments they will show us some respect and respond.
Quote:charlieboa
Assume its all down to injuries and we arent allowed to make any comments on the abilities of the management, coaches and players.
If so I won't bother saying anything.
Roll on the off- season.....
Of course you’re allowed to discuss the abilities of management, players etc. the rules allow that but they do not allow personal abuse. Pointing out weaknesses and there are clearly many is part of this discussion.
Question is CC there is a point where intensely strong criticism fuelled by passion is almost indistinguishable from abuse. I get where CB is coming from, he rather not take a chance.
Some individuals involved in running the club have had their reputations permanently and irreparably damaged.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Some individuals involved in running the club have had their reputations permanently and irreparably damaged.
Well if you can’t criticise a person fairly then yes do not post I am sure that the players, coaches, management are all hurting after that debacle. Perhaps they all need help so would welcome constructive criticism.
Luckily, it's only a game. It's not that important. In the greater scheme of things. It's what you have to remind yourself.
It just happens to be a game that we are not vey good at. Pathetically abject, in fact. And the people who shape and run the team have no idea or ability on how to bring about improvement. And the players, seemingly, are not interested, overmuch.
When the family game gets this bad at Christmas someone usually tips the board and pieces to the floor and we start again from scratch.
I think some serious tipping time beckons. Can't be too soon.
Pass the brandy.
It just happens to be a game that we are not vey good at. Pathetically abject, in fact. And the people who shape and run the team have no idea or ability on how to bring about improvement. And the players, seemingly, are not interested, overmuch.
When the family game gets this bad at Christmas someone usually tips the board and pieces to the floor and we start again from scratch.
I think some serious tipping time beckons. Can't be too soon.
Pass the brandy.
There are no words after that result and I was listening to BBC Radio Bristol. All of us are hurting, owner, management, players and supporters. If ever there was a need for a Brendan Ventner style clear out it is upon us now. If Tigers can go from zeros to heroes in 20mth it must be possible for us too if we have hired the right people. We all need a break from this misery, roll on 22/23...
Adopted players: 24/25 J Bayliss; [24] O Lawrence; [23] J Cokanasiga; [22] M Green; [21] A Watson; [20] T Faletau; [19] M V Vuuren; [18] T Faletau; [17] D Denton; [16] H. Agulla; [15] L Houston; [14] W Spencer; [13] F. Louw
Family . Community . Nation - [sdp.org.uk]
My mind's been going places without me lately - Bushfire The B52's
Adopted players: 24/25 J Bayliss; [24] O Lawrence; [23] J Cokanasiga; [22] M Green; [21] A Watson; [20] T Faletau; [19] M V Vuuren; [18] T Faletau; [17] D Denton; [16] H. Agulla; [15] L Houston; [14] W Spencer; [13] F. Louw
Family . Community . Nation - [sdp.org.uk]
My mind's been going places without me lately - Bushfire The B52's
You could see the hunger throughout the Glaws team, exemplified by Ludlow. Somehow we need to discover that level of passion and leadership before next season. At least Tom Dunn looked utterly frustrated and animated at the end. We can only hope that this is the lowest point from which there can be only one possible direction forward, starting in 3 weeks v Irish.
Quote:CoochieCoo
Well if you can’t criticise a person fairly then yes do not post I am sure that the players, coaches, management are all hurting after that debacle. Perhaps they all need help so would welcome constructive criticism.
Which person would you criticise then CC? I think it's way past comment, we have a new HC in two games time. Comments on management have been made repeatedly with some staying loyal to the bitter end.
Thing is though, what does the bitter end look like? Was it todays debacle.
I've always liked this song lyric, "the strong give up and move on but the weak give up and stay".
Simply awful!
Quote:CoochieCoo
Well if you can’t criticise a person fairly then yes do not post I am sure that the players, coaches, management are all hurting after that debacle. Perhaps they all need help so would welcome constructive criticism.
It was a playful, tongue in cheek comment that some posters think we are the only club to have faced adversity this season in terms of prep, injuries etc and that our opinions as supporters are nil and void.
The truth is we have been consistently an absolute rabble, game to game, week to week, irrespective of the names in the 23. The sarries game was about third or fourth game , weren't missing many players.....conceded 70+ points and were an embarrassment.
I agree that we are supporters, our role is to try and support, be constructive and positive where possible. Testing us this season!
I actually think it's v possible it can be turned around and we could be mid table next season. Jvg/jpf/mad dog will be running the show and bring a totally different energy. Literally a manager has just said on radio 5 live that 'confidence is king' in pro sport - it staggers me how important it is for mentally tough individuals but it's absolutely true.
Today I think it was telling on the radio that even banners wasn't trying to defend the indefensible that was today's performance.... what else can you say about this season!?
So, WHY did it happen AGAIN!!! We’re all massively hacked off by the result & manner of it & some of us are wanting heads to roll but results like this are so rare we need to understand why it happened. Clearly the players gave up but that is so unbelievably unprofessional & I can’t fathom how that mentality has set in. To me it is inexplicable. Can anyone work out the reasons for this historic defeat?
Quote:CoochieCooQuote:charlieboa
Assume its all down to injuries and we arent allowed to make any comments on the abilities of the management, coaches and players.
If so I won't bother saying anything.
Roll on the off- season.....
Of course you’re allowed to discuss the abilities of management, players etc. the rules allow that but they do not allow personal abuse. Pointing out weaknesses and there are clearly many is part of this discussion.
Not a dig at the mods at all for clarity (as per my last post). You do a grand job and tread the line well.
My only major frustration is that once we had clarity on chairman, jvg, hoops/hats staying I really thought excuses had run out, we would regroup and improve- we have got worse arguably which is staggering given they must all know jvg/jpf/mad dog will be pouring over the footage etc.
Have hoops and hats retained/earnt the respect of jvg over the last few months? Have the players?
Quote:Bath Hammer
So, WHY did it happen AGAIN!!! We’re all massively hacked off by the result & manner of it & some of us are wanting heads to roll but results like this are so rare we need to understand why it happened. Clearly the players gave up but that is so unbelievably unprofessional & I can’t fathom how that mentality has set in. To me it is inexplicable. Can anyone work out the reasons for this historic defeat?
Sheridan and banners basically said they gave up.
Some think you can't say that 'because they are professionals'..... I won't say it but safe to say they didn't cover themselves in glory with their attitude based on the comments by someone as fiercely loyal as banners
SW there is no single person that I would criticise for that debacle. The energy on the field of play from our players was collectively non existent after all it is a team game. It may be the case that a complete overhaul of our culture to get the zing back in the club is required, top to bottom. Sometimes the bad stuff gets infectious in an organisation and that started at the beginning of the season when we were not performing.
The players are not bad players, the coaches are not incompetent, the problem as I see it is they are not singing off the same song sheet!
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022:04:30:18:16:25 by CoochieCoo.
The players are not bad players, the coaches are not incompetent, the problem as I see it is they are not singing off the same song sheet!
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022:04:30:18:16:25 by CoochieCoo.
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Monye not pulling punches....disrespectful, disgraceful, apathetic.....
Hats is the man in charge of the day to day rugby. For me that is an issue that he keeps getting performances like that out of his players. Yes we always have players out....but 64 nil....was the 3rd or 4th most points conceded this season!?
I expect him to be forwards coach next season , respect him as a forwards coach and man,....I was supportive of him staying, I am now less sure but I am not in the inner sanctum of the club so will get shot down by some for having an opinion on that. Hopefully it's such a different role for him everyone can compartmentalise it and retain respect for him.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022:04:30:18:14:42 by charlieboa.
Monye not pulling punches....disrespectful, disgraceful, apathetic.....
Hats is the man in charge of the day to day rugby. For me that is an issue that he keeps getting performances like that out of his players. Yes we always have players out....but 64 nil....was the 3rd or 4th most points conceded this season!?
I expect him to be forwards coach next season , respect him as a forwards coach and man,....I was supportive of him staying, I am now less sure but I am not in the inner sanctum of the club so will get shot down by some for having an opinion on that. Hopefully it's such a different role for him everyone can compartmentalise it and retain respect for him.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022:04:30:18:14:42 by charlieboa.
Self respect would lead most HC/DORs to fall on their sword after the season that has been delivered.
What other business would retain operational leaders after such a long string ofpoordismal results have been consistently delivered?
I worry that with Hooper in the background, JvG may not have the total autonomy required to undertake the radical surgery required here.
What other business would retain operational leaders after such a long string of
I worry that with Hooper in the background, JvG may not have the total autonomy required to undertake the radical surgery required here.
We have given up, apart from Underhill and Muir perhaps, we were right to go the JvG route and Ed Griffiths is changing things but whose decision was it to NOT have a defence coach, then appoint one then let them go with 6 games to go basically abandoning the players to defend individually.
The players have seen their management abandon the season with the attitude, "JvG will sort it out next season"
In the mean time serious young talent has had to endure defeat, humiliation and shame, some of that is character building but too much of that becomes toxic.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
The players have seen their management abandon the season with the attitude, "JvG will sort it out next season"
In the mean time serious young talent has had to endure defeat, humiliation and shame, some of that is character building but too much of that becomes toxic.
Quote:Agree, but for me morale has been an issue on and off for longer than this season , now when was it SH took over ?P G Tips
Agree OB.
I would never question effort, and do not believe anyone should, but something is very wrong today in the morale department.
PG
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"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
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Quote:shipwrecked
Some individuals involved in running the club have had their reputations permanently and irreparably damaged.
Exactly, who would want Bath Rugby’s worst ever season on their CV ?
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"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
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Quote:charlieboaQuote:Bath Hammer
So, WHY did it happen AGAIN!!! We’re all massively hacked off by the result & manner of it & some of us are wanting heads to roll but results like this are so rare we need to understand why it happened. Clearly the players gave up but that is so unbelievably unprofessional & I can’t fathom how that mentality has set in. To me it is inexplicable. Can anyone work out the reasons for this historic defeat?
Sheridan and banners basically said they gave up.
Some think you can't say that 'because they are professionals'..... I won't say it but safe to say they didn't cover themselves in glory with their attitude based on the comments by someone as fiercely loyal as banners
What was Banners take on it as it all unravelled before the ‘gave up’ comment? Or was he, perhaps understandably, very PC?
Banners obviously has had a boot in each camp and tried to be positive, focus on glos playing well. He was surprised shall we say by what he seemed to see as a lack of desire to keep the score half sensible at the end. Sheridan was a bit more free with "disgraceful ', 'embarrassment ' etc...
I find myself feeling that the abolition of relegation has had an effect. It no longer *matters* if a team finishes bottom or not. The only downside is that some rich guys have to sulk in a lower league for one season plus.
Bring back relegation as soon as possible.
Bring back relegation as soon as possible.
At various times this season I have been dismayed, frustrated, horrified, sanguine, encouraged, sad but today I am just angry. That was a disgraceful result.
Quote:Kidney Stone
Self respect would lead most HC/DORs to fall on their sword after the season that has been delivered.
What other business would retain operational leaders after such a long string ofpoordismal results have been consistently delivered?
I worry that with Hooper in the background, JvG may not have the total autonomy required to undertake the radical surgery required here.
+1
Any self respecting employee would resign if they abjectly failed in their objectives. Sadly I doubt Hooper or Hatley will quit over the weekend. When the bar for success is set as low as it is at Bath it’s not surprising that the club is nothing but a total failure.
Sadly Hooper will still be overseeing next season’s inevitable failure and the poor recruitment gives us little chance to change things for the better.
I wonder how long JvG will stay once he sees first hand what a disaster zone the club is.
Has the defence coach left? Not much evidence he’s still here but it was Williams, the attack coach, who left, wasn’t it?
Either way, Underhill aside, what a completely gutless 80 minutes.
Either way, Underhill aside, what a completely gutless 80 minutes.
Dismal Bath ! Pitiful
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"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
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"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
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Oddly enough I find I’m not as bothered by the result as I thought I would be.
Glos had something to play for we didn’t.
My thoughts the management it has been style over substance but is definitely not the only issue.
Lack of leadership on pitch, no Nathan Hughes, multiple injuries before and during game. Joe C deffo needs to work on his defence. Midfield defence is a revolving door. To name a few.
Glos had something to play for we didn’t.
My thoughts the management it has been style over substance but is definitely not the only issue.
Lack of leadership on pitch, no Nathan Hughes, multiple injuries before and during game. Joe C deffo needs to work on his defence. Midfield defence is a revolving door. To name a few.
Good line from S Barnes in The Times:
“Bath received Gloucester’s traditional `Ee-ore’. It was a tough verdict on donkeys.”
“Bath received Gloucester’s traditional `Ee-ore’. It was a tough verdict on donkeys.”
The game was up the moment the players took the pitch.
Losing Stuart before the match really set the scene. That was one of the few areas of the pitch where we had a clear man for man advantage.
Morozov's yellow was a smack in the knackers. It was one of those ridiculous referee-by-numbers decisions that put a team without confidence, that quite honestly on recent performances shows that it doesn't believe itself that it can be competitive, immediately on the back foot.
From that point on everything that could have gone wrong, did go wrong, and that has been the theme of the season.
Bath battled bravely in defence but couldn't get their hands on the ball. When the dam burst the heads palpably went down.
The yellow given to Max Clark was another shining example. When I say "shining" I really mean "faecal encrusted". He was clearly impeded by a dummy runner and taken out as he advanced in defence. The referee was only looking in one direction by then though, much like last week when Rokoduguni was pushed into the Saints ruck, dislodging the ball, but the referee could only see the effect and not the cause.
When Clark was injured before half time and replaced by a 19 year old academy flyhalf playing out of position, who was then immediately injured himself, that was the final straw. From that point on Bath clearly felt that the odds were stacked against them and that it was pointless to even try to compete.
And that is shameful.
I don't like picking out individual players but I will make an exception for this game.
Bath Rugby should never again be in the position of having to start a derby match in the Premiership with two emergency loan props. The fact this situation had been allowed to occur is a damning indictment of player acquisition and retention at the club.
Mike Williams was one of the few players who showed the levels of passion and determination we should expect from every player who pulls on the shirt, but he also showed that as a lock forward he is not equipped to play at that level. He made absolutely no meaningful impact on the game in either tight or lose phases and was perilously close to adding to his ridiculous tally of cards this season thanks to his frankly appalling tackle technique.
But at least he tried. Which is more than you could say for Faletau or Cipriani, who both went completely AWOL for the entire duration of the match. Cipriani cleverly ran away from every potential point of contact, much like Brave Sir Robin on Monty Python and the Holy Grail. Faletau skulked about on the wing, studiously avoiding all meaningful action.
The only players who really put up were Underhill, who looked like a cross between General Custer and Michael Caine in Zulu (oi, Hastings, don't you point that spear down my defensive channel), Muir, who was Bath's best wing and second best back row, and De Glanville who did what he could whilst hopelessly exposed on countless occasions.
I wanted to add Dunn to that list but despite scowling effectively throughout the match he undermined this by regularly chucking the ball to Gloucester's lineout jumpers.
This was a seminal moment in the history of our club because for the first time it became unarguably clear that a number of players were not only technically not good enough or physically not fit enough, but also showed themselves either not to believe they could compete or lacking in the basic competitive drive to try.
And that is a shameful disgrace to the club and its supporters.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022:04:30:20:09:09 by Malco.
Losing Stuart before the match really set the scene. That was one of the few areas of the pitch where we had a clear man for man advantage.
Morozov's yellow was a smack in the knackers. It was one of those ridiculous referee-by-numbers decisions that put a team without confidence, that quite honestly on recent performances shows that it doesn't believe itself that it can be competitive, immediately on the back foot.
From that point on everything that could have gone wrong, did go wrong, and that has been the theme of the season.
Bath battled bravely in defence but couldn't get their hands on the ball. When the dam burst the heads palpably went down.
The yellow given to Max Clark was another shining example. When I say "shining" I really mean "faecal encrusted". He was clearly impeded by a dummy runner and taken out as he advanced in defence. The referee was only looking in one direction by then though, much like last week when Rokoduguni was pushed into the Saints ruck, dislodging the ball, but the referee could only see the effect and not the cause.
When Clark was injured before half time and replaced by a 19 year old academy flyhalf playing out of position, who was then immediately injured himself, that was the final straw. From that point on Bath clearly felt that the odds were stacked against them and that it was pointless to even try to compete.
And that is shameful.
I don't like picking out individual players but I will make an exception for this game.
Bath Rugby should never again be in the position of having to start a derby match in the Premiership with two emergency loan props. The fact this situation had been allowed to occur is a damning indictment of player acquisition and retention at the club.
Mike Williams was one of the few players who showed the levels of passion and determination we should expect from every player who pulls on the shirt, but he also showed that as a lock forward he is not equipped to play at that level. He made absolutely no meaningful impact on the game in either tight or lose phases and was perilously close to adding to his ridiculous tally of cards this season thanks to his frankly appalling tackle technique.
But at least he tried. Which is more than you could say for Faletau or Cipriani, who both went completely AWOL for the entire duration of the match. Cipriani cleverly ran away from every potential point of contact, much like Brave Sir Robin on Monty Python and the Holy Grail. Faletau skulked about on the wing, studiously avoiding all meaningful action.
The only players who really put up were Underhill, who looked like a cross between General Custer and Michael Caine in Zulu (oi, Hastings, don't you point that spear down my defensive channel), Muir, who was Bath's best wing and second best back row, and De Glanville who did what he could whilst hopelessly exposed on countless occasions.
I wanted to add Dunn to that list but despite scowling effectively throughout the match he undermined this by regularly chucking the ball to Gloucester's lineout jumpers.
This was a seminal moment in the history of our club because for the first time it became unarguably clear that a number of players were not only technically not good enough or physically not fit enough, but also showed themselves either not to believe they could compete or lacking in the basic competitive drive to try.
And that is a shameful disgrace to the club and its supporters.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022:04:30:20:09:09 by Malco.
Quote:Held upQuote:woodpecker
Got offered a ticket £70....maybe not
Been given a ticket to watch first game for years with Glos fan and his very Glos family. First visit to Kingsholm since I played for the Bath Youth there over 30 years ago. Hoping I retain happy memories!
Well that didn’t go well!
Quote:Borked Login
I find myself feeling that the abolition of relegation has had an effect. It no longer *matters* if a team finishes bottom or not. The only downside is that some rich guys have to sulk in a lower league for one season plus.
Bring back relegation as soon as possible.
I agree, it is embarrassing that we will be playing in the premiership next season
And can you believe that tonight is the Annual Awards Dinner for Bath? Will be interesting to see how that is reported by the club.
Today was shameful.
Today was shameful.
How can Hooper and Co stay after that. Ewels needs to stand down as Captain too. Needs to happen by Monday.
How Hooper has continued to take his salary as “Director of Rugby” as this shitshow has gone from bad to worse this season is beyond me.
This is a point of shame now - we’re not watching a professional outfit, it’s a complete mess.
Every minute the man stays at the club is one where its credibility takes another blow. Enough, just go.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022:04:30:21:47:45 by Martlet75.
This is a point of shame now - we’re not watching a professional outfit, it’s a complete mess.
Every minute the man stays at the club is one where its credibility takes another blow. Enough, just go.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022:04:30:21:47:45 by Martlet75.
There are faults from top to bottom (and for sure in any other walk of life, maybe bar politics, Hooper would be gone), but on the pitch there is worrying absence of passion and leadership - compare Bath today with Glaws, led by a fired-up Ludlow.
We have conceded so many second half points this season that it must call into question fitness and conditioning.
The new management team has a very challenging pre-season ahead.
I just hope there is a reaction in the final home game v Irish, the fans deserve it!
We have conceded so many second half points this season that it must call into question fitness and conditioning.
The new management team has a very challenging pre-season ahead.
I just hope there is a reaction in the final home game v Irish, the fans deserve it!
I've supported Bath since the late 50s and have witnessed games in which Bath were thrashed! Like the time the game against Neath was switched to Claverton Down because the pitch at the Rec was flooded! But even in that game, Bath tried to stem the tide ... today, during the time I was prepared to watch, Bath seemed resigned to a humiliating defeat from early in the game ... I was impressed with Sam Underhill but it is a team game ... and so many of his team didn't seem to be that interested in playing at all ... Very depressing! Fortunately, the rugby I watch now is in Coventry and costs me about £20 per ticket (unlike at Bath!) - and Wasps have performed pretty well despite lots of key players being injured!
My immediate thought, as last week, is what a shame there is no relegation. We are not even Championship standard and don't deserve to play next season with the top tier clubs. It started when Hooper was promoted, we all knew it was a disaster waiting to happen, but just hoped by some chance we may be wrong, well we know for certain now how right we were. The biggest defeat by Gloucester in rugby history.
I cant blame any player, it has been coming for years, I wonder if Craig was at Kingsholm to see the result of his disastrous time in charge of a once great club?
I cant blame any player, it has been coming for years, I wonder if Craig was at Kingsholm to see the result of his disastrous time in charge of a once great club?
Just watched the "match". The only decisions we made effectively were which foot to shoot ourselves in. When we stop making stupid decisions, we might amount to something. Fifteen individuals (some of the time) who had clearly met the others just before kick off versus a team. JvG has a mountain to climb.
But the most stupid decison we've made this year? "We don't need a specialist defence coach". In retrospect that has set the scene for everything that has followed.
Sam was everywhere, Horse kept trying hard but everyone else seemed to be barely interested bystanders.
I hope OB2 is OK.
I am very sad at what we have become.
My MotM - not after that debacle.
... IMHO, of course.
Now in Honolulu
Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2022:05:01:01:09:19 by joethefanatic.
But the most stupid decison we've made this year? "We don't need a specialist defence coach". In retrospect that has set the scene for everything that has followed.
Sam was everywhere, Horse kept trying hard but everyone else seemed to be barely interested bystanders.
I hope OB2 is OK.
I am very sad at what we have become.
My MotM - not after that debacle.
... IMHO, of course.
Now in Honolulu
Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2022:05:01:01:09:19 by joethefanatic.
I was at Castle Grim for that shitshow. Pathetic. Embarrassing. Limp. We should do the honourable thing & relegate ourselves & do a proper reset. And I have to live near Cheltenham & take the crowing from the Glaws fans ☹️
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022:05:01:08:10:19 by CoochieCoo.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022:05:01:08:10:19 by CoochieCoo.
Quote:Unlike elite football you don't get paid off as a coach for failure. As a result the owner/CEO would have to sack them. With their fingerprints all over the appointments a gradual fade away is their MO. Face saving at supporters expense!Bath Blues
No one Resigned yet?????
Embarrassing, grow a set.
Interesting to note 3 of Bath's 4 wins this season Harlequins,Sale and Newcastle were all when Nathan Hughes played at 8. He anchored the Scrum weighing around 126kg and a real wrecking ball carrier. That type of player puts you on the front foot for the backs to feed off.
Bathiron comments on Tom Dunn being quite animated whilst talking to Hooper what was noticeable was that Hooper appeared totally disinterested, rather mirroring the Bath outfit, it must be obvious that he is only being retained until the end of the season he has presided over what must be the worst season by any club in the so called modern day era. Congratulations to Glouc' good all round squad with a good attitude.
I asked the question WHY? because we know the quality within the team. Almost every player has excelled at some time or other, some on numerous occasions at international level. The excuse peddled out by some, with very little legitimacy in my view, that we had put our a team including many inexperienced youths, doesn’t exist. Yellow cards often make little difference so don’t give me that. Also, last week we were leading a top 4 team for 75 mins, though if it had gone on for 90 mins we would have lost by 20 points. To not get a point in the entire game is extraordinary. Gloucester are not the All Blacks for heavens sake. Someone has to carry the can, surely? The idea of Hatley & Hooper, decent guys that they undoubtedly are, being involved next year or even the rest of this seems ludicrous. The players ought to be able to organise themselves better.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022:05:01:08:43:07 by Bath Hammer.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2022:05:01:08:43:07 by Bath Hammer.
Quote:Sheddings
And can you believe that tonight is the Annual Awards Dinner for Bath? Will be interesting to see how that is reported by the club.
Today was shameful.
If I was one of the squad I would have been too embarrassed to turn up.
Quote:BathIron
There are faults from top to bottom (and for sure in any other walk of life, maybe bar politics, Hooper would be gone), but on the pitch there is worrying absence of passion and leadership - compare Bath today with Glaws, led by a fired-up Ludlow.
We have conceded so many second half points this season that it must call into question fitness and conditioning.
The new management team has a very challenging pre-season ahead.
I just hope there is a reaction in the final home game v Irish, the fans deserve it!
I believe that a new Strength and Conditioning team has been appointed for next year. Another Ed G cull.
Quote:OutsideBathQuote:Sheddings
And can you believe that tonight is the Annual Awards Dinner for Bath? Will be interesting to see how that is reported by the club.
Today was shameful.
If I was one of the squad I would have been too embarrassed to turn up.
BBC Bristol rugby commentator Sheridan was pondering the same thing and if his invitation had got lost in the post. Listening to his comments yesterday I doubt he'll be invited again, ever...
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I dont even think the threat of relegation would have made the players bother to turn up either.
They would have just picked up more yellows and red cards...
Designed in Scotland | Made in the West Country
They would have just picked up more yellows and red cards...
Designed in Scotland | Made in the West Country
Mr Craig must be a bit unhappy.
Is it 12 years?
Is it £30m/£40m?
Is it 12 years?
Is it £30m/£40m?
Deliberately didn't post anywhere last night as for the first time (after all that's happened this season) I was actually angry at what I saw yesterday. As others have said , I can accept losing if Gloucs are better, but I won't have players obviously giving up. I don't want to see a single leaver against LI , If that means, .Merrigan, Venter, and Doughty etc play so be it. It can't get any worse than this.
Quote:Old Bath Tub
Dismal Bath ! Pitiful
Neal Hatley “ We looked low on confidence , that starts with the coaching group so we’ve got to look at what we can do better to help reinstall belief into them “ .
Answers please on a postcard to Ed at Bath Rugby @ # Coaching on the cheap…….’ We can manage without a specialist Defence Coach and replacing Elliott Stooke “
I’ve recently renewed our Season Tickets ! Is there a ‘ get out ‘ clause ?
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"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
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Quote:SheddingsQuote:BathIron
There are faults from top to bottom (and for sure in any other walk of life, maybe bar politics, Hooper would be gone), but on the pitch there is worrying absence of passion and leadership - compare Bath today with Glaws, led by a fired-up Ludlow.
We have conceded so many second half points this season that it must call into question fitness and conditioning.
The new management team has a very challenging pre-season ahead.
I just hope there is a reaction in the final home game v Irish, the fans deserve it!
I believe that a new Strength and Conditioning team has been appointed for next year. Another Ed G cull.
Has there been a cull? I thought it was just a bit of tinkering around the edges to save those responsible for the failures.
What is so frustrating is there is a team in there somewhere. Lastbweek we looked like a top half team for 60 mins and a championship mid table team for 20. This week we went straight to championship level.
Quote:dr.bath1865
Good line from S Barnes in The Times:
“Bath received Gloucester’s traditional `Ee-ore’. It was a tough verdict on donkeys.”
He doesn’t pull punches, spare blushes. “shambolic”, “uninterested”, “pathetic”, “deserve to be relegated”.
That must hurt him to write.
PG
Saw that CC and you only have to watch that video with the sound down to realise that is NOT the Neal Hately of old.
If you want a video try this one, absolutely inspiring. Sign this kid up!
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
If you want a video try this one, absolutely inspiring. Sign this kid up!
Quote:P G TipsQuote:dr.bath1865
Good line from S Barnes in The Times:
“Bath received Gloucester’s traditional `Ee-ore’. It was a tough verdict on donkeys.”
He doesn’t pull punches, spare blushes. “shambolic”, “uninterested”, “pathetic”, “deserve to be relegated”.
That must hurt him to write.
PG
Shame it doesn’t hurt the club reading comments like that, much easier for them to continue burying their collective heads in the sand.
I notice two revered posters have yet to comment on this defeat, probably simmering in adrenaline fuelled anger tempering their comments. Very wise.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
[quote OutsideBath][quote P G Tips][quote dr.bath1865]Good line from S Barnes in The Times:
“Bath received Gloucester’s traditional `Ee-ore’. It was a tough verdict on donkeys.”[/quote]
He doesn’t pull punches, spare blushes. “shambolic”, “uninterested”, “pathetic”, “deserve to be relegated”.
That must hurt him to write.
PG[/quote]
I doubt that very much Mr Barnes has been so anti Bath since he left it has been embarrassing to read at times. I think he is the sort that revels in saying how rubbish a team is now he no longer plays for them. He may have been right at times like the stopped clock but he was never anything other than totally grudging if Bath played well or won. Currently I suspect supreme schardenfreude.
“Bath received Gloucester’s traditional `Ee-ore’. It was a tough verdict on donkeys.”[/quote]
He doesn’t pull punches, spare blushes. “shambolic”, “uninterested”, “pathetic”, “deserve to be relegated”.
That must hurt him to write.
PG[/quote]
I doubt that very much Mr Barnes has been so anti Bath since he left it has been embarrassing to read at times. I think he is the sort that revels in saying how rubbish a team is now he no longer plays for them. He may have been right at times like the stopped clock but he was never anything other than totally grudging if Bath played well or won. Currently I suspect supreme schardenfreude.
Quote:shipwrecked
I notice two revered posters have yet to comment on this defeat, probably simmering in adrenaline fuelled anger tempering their comments. Very wise.
Yes Matt, we await your logical and reasoned comments please !!
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
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Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Quote:OutsideBathQuote:SheddingsQuote:BathIron
There are faults from top to bottom (and for sure in any other walk of life, maybe bar politics, Hooper would be gone), but on the pitch there is worrying absence of passion and leadership - compare Bath today with Glaws, led by a fired-up Ludlow.
We have conceded so many second half points this season that it must call into question fitness and conditioning.
The new management team has a very challenging pre-season ahead.
I just hope there is a reaction in the final home game v Irish, the fans deserve it!
I believe that a new Strength and Conditioning team has been appointed for next year. Another Ed G cull.
Has there been a cull? I thought it was just a bit of tinkering around the edges to save those responsible for the failures.
More to come without a doubt.
I thought the S&C looked off from the start of the season, always seemed weaker and less fit than the competition. A few late spats early in the season to put a bit of gloss on an awful first half but I thought that was just a bit of individual brilliance from our more fit and more agile players against a team who were half way to the post match beers.
I guess you could probably see this coming a mile off if you watched the United or prem cup games over the last 3 or 4 seasons. Gloucester and Tigers academy players always rocked up looking twice the size of their Bath counterparts. Likewise comments from Mercer and Bayliss saying they don't want to put too much muscle and lose their speed seemed naive.
That said, PJ Wilson has an amazing pedigree, Munster have always seemed like a fit team who punch above their weight. I really don't get what has gone soo wrong at Bath, maybe the facilities aren't good enough. Maybe BoB was right all along.
Anyways I've noticed the teams that have done better this season like Gloucester, Quins and Tigers, appear to attack the breakdown a lot more than teams that haven't i.e. us and Bristol. I know we've got Cloete coming in, and Coetzee seems quite handy at the breakdown but we really need to start slowing the opposition ball down.
We've got a great squad but we definitely need a bit more hunger and fight, which will be hard to install in a team so low on confidence. I think we'll need a massive shake up, I'd go as far as saying we need to rebrand ourselves, start training elsewhere immediately, and never speak about this season again.
I guess you could probably see this coming a mile off if you watched the United or prem cup games over the last 3 or 4 seasons. Gloucester and Tigers academy players always rocked up looking twice the size of their Bath counterparts. Likewise comments from Mercer and Bayliss saying they don't want to put too much muscle and lose their speed seemed naive.
That said, PJ Wilson has an amazing pedigree, Munster have always seemed like a fit team who punch above their weight. I really don't get what has gone soo wrong at Bath, maybe the facilities aren't good enough. Maybe BoB was right all along.
Anyways I've noticed the teams that have done better this season like Gloucester, Quins and Tigers, appear to attack the breakdown a lot more than teams that haven't i.e. us and Bristol. I know we've got Cloete coming in, and Coetzee seems quite handy at the breakdown but we really need to start slowing the opposition ball down.
We've got a great squad but we definitely need a bit more hunger and fight, which will be hard to install in a team so low on confidence. I think we'll need a massive shake up, I'd go as far as saying we need to rebrand ourselves, start training elsewhere immediately, and never speak about this season again.
And while we are at it the social media side has to give it a rest for a few days.
I don’t want to see “pics of the action” at 9 o clock on a Saturday night.
J
I don’t want to see “pics of the action” at 9 o clock on a Saturday night.
J
Assuming that there will be a new structure with new coaches for next season, I’m interested as to who should be captain.
I saw nothing yesterday to suggest Ewels, as good as he may be as a player, is a leader. A captain must inspire those around to perform at their best.
For me a captain must be on the field for the entire game setting standards from the 1st to last minute. They must have respect from the team and the referee. Ideally someone who is committed to Bath for the long-term and unlikely to be absent for every international.
Based on this, I’d not select a front row (only play 60-70 min).
I see 2 options stand out - Sam Underhill or Josh Bayliss.
I saw nothing yesterday to suggest Ewels, as good as he may be as a player, is a leader. A captain must inspire those around to perform at their best.
For me a captain must be on the field for the entire game setting standards from the 1st to last minute. They must have respect from the team and the referee. Ideally someone who is committed to Bath for the long-term and unlikely to be absent for every international.
Based on this, I’d not select a front row (only play 60-70 min).
I see 2 options stand out - Sam Underhill or Josh Bayliss.
I received a reminder from Bath that my early bird ST window expires this week.
Loving their sense of humour! ………. Not
Loving their sense of humour! ………. Not
Quote:Held up
For me a captain must be on the field for the entire game setting standards from the 1st to last minute. They must have respect from the team and the referee. Ideally someone who is committed to Bath for the long-term and unlikely to be absent for every international.
Based on this, I’d not select a front row (only play 60-70 min).
I see 2 options stand out - Sam Underhill or Josh Bayliss.
They also need to be vocal as well HU, by example SU by a mile I'd say, Orlando Bailey is a skipper in a couple of years I'd say.
Bayliss speaks well but a rousing skipper that bosses his team mates, I'm not sure we have one of those?
Quote:by
We've got a great squad
I see this repeated here but really, have we? The overwhelming evidence suggests otherwise.
Also, the guff about how Dunn was showing "passion" after the final whistle. Leave it out. Dunn committed one of the most brainless errors in the game, and not for the first time. I think there are a few clouded views of how good our players are, which contributes to the problem.
We've been dysfunctional for many years, and this season has been coming.
Quote:Kidney Stone
I received a reminder from Bath that my early bird ST window expires this week.
Loving their sense of humour! ………. Not
At least they've stopped mentioning exciting announcements.
Quote:Kidney Stone
I received a reminder from Bath that my early bird ST window expires this week.
Loving their sense of humour! ………. Not
Yes and i have just received a reminder about the last chance to have a shirt signed, but who do i choose ?
Wait until you read the report on the game, If they have the ability to gloss over that debacle !!
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
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"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Quote:Held up
Assuming that there will be a new structure with new coaches for next season, I’m interested as to who should be captain.
I saw nothing yesterday to suggest Ewels, as good as he may be as a player, is a leader. A captain must inspire those around to perform at their best.
For me a captain must be on the field for the entire game setting standards from the 1st to last minute. They must have respect from the team and the referee. Ideally someone who is committed to Bath for the long-term and unlikely to be absent for every international.
Based on this, I’d not select a front row (only play 60-70 min).
I see 2 options stand out - Sam Underhill or Josh Bayliss.
We are desperate for a new captain.
Ewels neither inspires nor challenges those around him on match days. He rarely interacts with the referee.
I well remember when we went from 11th to top of the league the following season under Knuckles. Jonathan Humphreys was brought in and made captain and he set entirely new standards. His “talks” under the posts if we conceded a try were worth the admission price alone stood on the terraces at the dressing room end.
Compare that with the almost silent Ewels.
Perhaps we should consider making one of the new guys captain aka Humphreys. No baggage that way.
I don't think you get results like yesterday unless there is a leadership issue. Not sure where, only the players will know.
Quote:recmanQuote:by
We've got a great squad
I see this repeated here but really, have we? The overwhelming evidence suggests otherwise.
Also, the guff about how Dunn was showing "passion" after the final whistle. Leave it out. Dunn committed one of the most brainless errors in the game, and not for the first time. I think there are a few clouded views of how good our players are, which contributes to the problem.
We've been dysfunctional for many years, and this season has been coming.
I think the earlier Craig-era, where the incoming signings were so much more exciting than the outgoing and the performance appeared to improve, has bred a certain sense of sentimentality where we hold onto how a player performed when the team was better over all than how are they are now. I know I'm guilty of that but the necessary changes are certainly going to be a painful experience for us supporters.
Quote:Malco
The yellow given to Max Clark was another shining example. When I say "shining" I really mean "faecal encrusted". He was clearly impeded by a dummy runner and taken out as he advanced in defence. The referee was only looking in one direction by then though, much like last week when Rokoduguni was pushed into the Saints ruck, dislodging the ball, but the referee could only see the effect and not the cause.
Sorry Malco, but that's just completely incorrect. Watching it back this afternoon, he plants his leg then makes movement towards the Glos player. Clear yellow.
Quote:recmanQuote:by
We've got a great squad
I see this repeated here but really, have we? The overwhelming evidence suggests otherwise.
+1
We have a decent squad, but not a great squad and the new signings have done nothing to change that.
With a proper coaching team in place for next season at best we are capable of finishing 8th, which will pretty much meet the club’s aspirations.
Quote:The BearQuote:recmanQuote:by
We've got a great squad
I see this repeated here but really, have we? The overwhelming evidence suggests otherwise.
Also, the guff about how Dunn was showing "passion" after the final whistle. Leave it out. Dunn committed one of the most brainless errors in the game, and not for the first time. I think there are a few clouded views of how good our players are, which contributes to the problem.
We've been dysfunctional for many years, and this season has been coming.
I think the earlier Craig-era, where the incoming signings were so much more exciting than the outgoing and the performance appeared to improve, has bred a certain sense of sentimentality where we hold onto how a player performed when the team was better over all than how are they are now. I know I'm guilty of that but the necessary changes are certainly going to be a painful experience for us supporters.
An issue with the "Craig era" was that we bought "names" (both established and up-and-coming) with no coherent plan as to how they would fit into the team.
Faletau, for example, turned out to be a really, really poor signing.
Didn't it start with Lewis Moody? Waste of time. Remember the Dan Carter rumours, and we probably only went for Donald when the Carter deal fell through because of Donald's World Cup five minutes of fame.
Underhill is a glowing exception (perhaps the only one?) to all this.
Have just watched London Irish battling away to the very last play of the game to earn a 42-42 draw against Wasps. The attitude and spirit of Irish was in sharp contrast to our utter capitulation after just a few minutes yesterday.
Quote:bathwickboy
Have just watched London Irish battling away to the very last play of the game to earn a 42-42 draw against Wasps. The attitude and spirit of Irish was in sharp contrast to our utter capitulation after just a few minutes yesterday.
Was thinking the same BWB. Trouble is our ‘never say die’ attitude, has, errrr………. died!
Arrrggghhh! No spoilers, please 
I was planning to watch that game this afternoon. Won't bother now.
... IMHO, of course.
Now in Honolulu
I was planning to watch that game this afternoon. Won't bother now.
... IMHO, of course.
Now in Honolulu
Quote:joethefanatic
Arrrggghhh! No spoilers, please
I was planning to watch that game this afternoon. Won't bother now.
No Joe watch it, its worth it!
Quote:recmanQuote:The BearQuote:recmanQuote:by
We've got a great squad
I see this repeated here but really, have we? The overwhelming evidence suggests otherwise.
Also, the guff about how Dunn was showing "passion" after the final whistle. Leave it out. Dunn committed one of the most brainless errors in the game, and not for the first time. I think there are a few clouded views of how good our players are, which contributes to the problem.
We've been dysfunctional for many years, and this season has been coming.
I think the earlier Craig-era, where the incoming signings were so much more exciting than the outgoing and the performance appeared to improve, has bred a certain sense of sentimentality where we hold onto how a player performed when the team was better over all than how are they are now. I know I'm guilty of that but the necessary changes are certainly going to be a painful experience for us supporters.
An issue with the "Craig era" was that we bought "names" (both established and up-and-coming) with no coherent plan as to how they would fit into the team.
Faletau, for example, turned out to be a really, really poor signing.
Didn't it start with Lewis Moody? Waste of time. Remember the Dan Carter rumours, and we probably only went for Donald when the Carter deal fell through because of Donald's World Cup five minutes of fame.
Underhill is a glowing exception (perhaps the only one?) to all this.
Yeah, of all the 'star names', only Underhill has come out of this with his reputation intact. Some, like Faletau, I wouldn't even regard as international class anymore. Not too mention far too many 'near the England squad' who have just performed terribly since.
Underhill certainly leads by example but I think the problem with the other big signings is that their character wasn't transformational.
They are all great players when the foundation is there and can do things others can't. But they can't influence a squad and the standards in the way a Nick Evans did for Quins, Gopperth for Wasps or Borthwick for Sarries.
With Worcester resting next round, bottom slot will be entirely dependent on the last round of the season. The match against Irish is immaterial to the overall outcome, so, it all comes down to this last match.
If ever there was an incentive to motivate a team and justify ones credentials as a coach and DOR, then this is the match. Anything less...
(For the statos, there is the (unlikely) situation where Bath and Worcester outpoint Newcastle but that is entirely based on Bath beating a strong Irish team at home in the penultimate round... And that just ain't gonna happen....)
If ever there was an incentive to motivate a team and justify ones credentials as a coach and DOR, then this is the match. Anything less...
(For the statos, there is the (unlikely) situation where Bath and Worcester outpoint Newcastle but that is entirely based on Bath beating a strong Irish team at home in the penultimate round... And that just ain't gonna happen....)
Quote:St JimmyQuote:Malco
The yellow given to Max Clark was another shining example. When I say "shining" I really mean "faecal encrusted". He was clearly impeded by a dummy runner and taken out as he advanced in defence. The referee was only looking in one direction by then though, much like last week when Rokoduguni was pushed into the Saints ruck, dislodging the ball, but the referee could only see the effect and not the cause.
Sorry Malco, but that's just completely incorrect. Watching it back this afternoon, he plants his leg then makes movement towards the Glos player. Clear yellow.
You are absolutely right, he did and it was petulant and silly. But he was clearly frustrated because he had been taken out and was unable to make the tackle as a result.
What he should have done was force the ref to look by theatrically throwing himself to the ground. Then we'd all be calling him a cheat and lamenting how much more like football the game is becoming.
Quote:MalcoQuote:St JimmyQuote:Malco
The yellow given to Max Clark was another shining example. When I say "shining" I really mean "faecal encrusted". He was clearly impeded by a dummy runner and taken out as he advanced in defence. The referee was only looking in one direction by then though, much like last week when Rokoduguni was pushed into the Saints ruck, dislodging the ball, but the referee could only see the effect and not the cause.
Sorry Malco, but that's just completely incorrect. Watching it back this afternoon, he plants his leg then makes movement towards the Glos player. Clear yellow.
You are absolutely right, he did and it was petulant and silly. But he was clearly frustrated because he had been taken out and was unable to make the tackle as a result.
What he should have done was force the ref to look by theatrically throwing himself to the ground. Then we'd all be calling him a cheat and lamenting how much more like football the game is becoming.
Who cares, it had absolutely zero impact on the result. Bath didn’t even qualify to be second best yesterday and are hopefully totally embarrassed today.
Quote:Bath Blues
No one Resigned yet?????
Embarrassing, grow a set.
Could be this week as Ben Coles reports in the Telegraph today that the futures of SH & TM are unclear, not sure exactly what that means, Sorry can’t do the link for the full story , behind a paywall and I don’t buy Sunday papers !
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"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Bath aspire to mediocrity and are very successful in that respect. This season is the culmination of a great deal of poor management over a number of seasons. There appears to be no desire to improve, change, or develop a winning mentality. Time for the Championship, if we are good enough.
Having watched Beno’s doc on Quins I just wonder how a similar documentary would compare with our rag, tag & bobtail mob? Interesting how Tabai Matson couldn’t leave us quick enough, what a job he’s doing now.
Instead of analysing yesterdays horror show they ought to watch Beno’s doc instead. Oh my days, we are light years away in all aspects.
Instead of analysing yesterdays horror show they ought to watch Beno’s doc instead. Oh my days, we are light years away in all aspects.
[www.telegraph.co.uk]
Bath face big changes after horror season hits rock bottom with Gloucester thrashing
Telegraph Sport understands the futures of Stuart Hooper, the club's director of rugby, and chief executive Tarquin McDonald are unclear
By
Ben Coles,
1 May 2022 • 6:55pm
The Bath players following their 0-64 defeat during the Gallagher Premiership Rugby match between Gloucester Rugby and Bath Rugby at Kingsholm Stadium on April 30, 2022
Bath face further upheaval in the wake of the club's disastrous 64-0 West Country derby defeat by Gloucester after the Gallagher Premiership's bottom club suffered their worst loss in a dismal season....
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Bath face big changes after horror season hits rock bottom with Gloucester thrashing
Telegraph Sport understands the futures of Stuart Hooper, the club's director of rugby, and chief executive Tarquin McDonald are unclear
By
Ben Coles,
1 May 2022 • 6:55pm
The Bath players following their 0-64 defeat during the Gallagher Premiership Rugby match between Gloucester Rugby and Bath Rugby at Kingsholm Stadium on April 30, 2022
Bath face further upheaval in the wake of the club's disastrous 64-0 West Country derby defeat by Gloucester after the Gallagher Premiership's bottom club suffered their worst loss in a dismal season....
Cue massive speculation, big question is does the article mention the owner?
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
It also asks the question would BC continue at Bath without his right hand man?
You don’t write comments like that in the Telegraph without good reason.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
You don’t write comments like that in the Telegraph without good reason.
Indeed sw.
I just don't think Ed g pulls any punches and if he believes tarquin and hoops don't fit the bill after a few more months of monitoring things i imagine he wouldn't by shy about saying so.
I don't know him but can believe he is bl**dy ruthless..... which I think is exactly what we need at this stage. Who is this 'source'....they must be v senior/trusted!
Where Bruce and the ownership issue fits into all this I have no idea.
I just don't think Ed g pulls any punches and if he believes tarquin and hoops don't fit the bill after a few more months of monitoring things i imagine he wouldn't by shy about saying so.
I don't know him but can believe he is bl**dy ruthless..... which I think is exactly what we need at this stage. Who is this 'source'....they must be v senior/trusted!
Where Bruce and the ownership issue fits into all this I have no idea.
Sometimes it’s what people don’t say that gives more information than what they say.
Change of ownership was mooted a few months ago, I wonder if it is a bit closer given recent events.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Change of ownership was mooted a few months ago, I wonder if it is a bit closer given recent events.
Quote:charlieboa
Indeed sw.
I just don't think Ed g pulls any punches and if he believes tarquin and hoops don't fit the bill after a few more months of monitoring things i imagine he wouldn't by shy about saying so.
I don't know him but can believe he is bl**dy ruthless..... which I think is exactly what we need at this stage. Who is this 'source'....they must be v senior/trusted!
Where Bruce and the ownership issue fits into all this I have no idea.
I would say 'ruthless' would describe an owner who says mid table or 4th place isn't good enough so he wouldn't even need to be ruthless in this case, just following common sense.
In fairness, I have not been impressed with our on pitch leadership so EdG should be looking to see if that is the only problem.
It would be utterly ironic if the head coach stayed in place whilst all those below & above him were dismissed. It’s also difficult to see why TM was responsible for yesterday’s debacle & previous similar results. Despite the comments made above the personnel who lined up yesterday were of sufficient quality to have won the game if properly coached & motivated.
I think Hooper provides useful cover for now. I imagine he will be invited to tender his resignation after the post-season review. JvG then becomes DoR and HC, of which he has both experience and a track record of success.
... IMHO, of course.
Now in Honolulu
... IMHO, of course.
Now in Honolulu
Quote:Bath Hammer
Despite the comments made above the personnel who lined up yesterday were of sufficient quality to have won the game if properly coached & motivated.
Gets a bit overlooked doesn't it- the likes of dunn, ewels, underhill, reid, faletau, spencer, jj, muir, coko, tdg aren't exactly dreadful players.
Yes we were missing big players like stuart, mcnally, redpath, watson which means I can accept an away win was a big ask. That's v different to a 64 nil defeat- with those players there really is no excuse for that imho
I learnt last night that Ed G "started" as CEO of Exeter in the early 90's...................
Quote:Bath HammerQuote:joethefanatic
I think Hooper provides useful cover for now. I imagine he will be invited to tender his resignation after the post-season review. JvG then becomes DoR and HC, of which he has both experience and a track record of success.
Would that be running into the sort of problems we had under Geevh trying to perform two demanding roles. I don’t like this combining of jobs & think it rarely works. I want to see JvG just focusing on leading the coaching team & without the help of Hatley & appoint another DOR if necessary.
1. The problems we had with Geech merging two roles were nothing compared to the problems we currently face with a high profile DoR
2. I can't think of many teams that have a DoR and a HC where neither was really the selection of the other (except when Ford or Dimes relocates to a new club).
3. JvG needs the tools to turn the team around. I still struggle to see what value having a DoR above him adds. The theory sounds logical and reasonable but it has been a disaster and there's no point pretending that's just because we've got the wrong people...
Tom Dunn's twitter this morning
Quote:Darkest day in the shirt, the video people may of seen post game of Hoops and I was purely me venting frustration that as a players group we haven’t/don’t learn. The situation we find ourselves in now as a group.
Thank you for all the continued support , stick with us
Quote:joethefanatic
I think Hooper provides useful cover for now. I imagine he will be invited to tender his resignation after the post-season review. JvG then becomes DoR and HC, of which he has both experience and a track record of success.
Similar to my thoughts, if there is going to be a night of the long knives suspect it will happen quietly before preseason.
But I still think we are owed a proper apology from the club for the debacle this season has been. And not mealy mouthed words in the middle of interviews or presentations to a group of fans. A proper, public one in writing to the in box of everyone they have addresses for, on the website and in the press.
Quote:SusanneQuote:joethefanatic
I think Hooper provides useful cover for now. I imagine he will be invited to tender his resignation after the post-season review. JvG then becomes DoR and HC, of which he has both experience and a track record of success.
Similar to my thoughts, if there is going to be a night of the long knives suspect it will happen quietly before preseason.
But I still think we are owed a proper apology from the club for the debacle this season has been. And not mealy mouthed words in the middle of interviews or presentations to a group of fans. A proper, public one in writing to the in box of everyone they have addresses for, on the website and in the press.
Quite agree Susanne, but don’t hold your breath waiting !
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"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Bath ST for a few years now. The body language of our player group has deteriorated through the season. I read this as proud players being ignored and now frustrated as their ideas are turned down. It seems to be they are forced to play to a failing game plan = ignore the breakdown is one example. That same coaching has also ignored back filling with quality forwards and hence the scrums and line outs we continue to lose. Rugby is a game of play into the spaces. To do that we need some ball, oops, and then it needs to be fast ball.
Why lead on the pitch if you are told you are wrong and play to the failed game plan plse.
Our issue is management, at more than 1 layer.
Why lead on the pitch if you are told you are wrong and play to the failed game plan plse.
Our issue is management, at more than 1 layer.
I wonder which coach it was having a round of golf on Friday?
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Who 'writes' the stuff on Rugbypass - they have minimal ability to write and copy and paste the twatter quote they then screenshot. They're as abysmal in their competence at Bath Rugby this season.
Quote:shipwrecked
I wonder which coach it was having a round of golf on Friday?
Do the team train on a Friday. SH?
Quote:Widcombe BoyQuote:shipwrecked
I wonder which coach it was having a round of golf on Friday?
Do the team train on a Friday. SH?
No idea but it seems a strange concern, not sure how abstaining from golf changes anything?
So, just got back from a few days away...what did I miss? 
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
I found a thread on twitter this morning looking at some of Gloucester's line breaks coming from really simple mistakes in the Bath defence, and a complete lack of work rate.
Morgan's score after half time was the worst. Beats the Bath defenders from a standing start to support LRZ and score.
[twitter.com]
As horrible as it is watching it, to me it highlights that we can be a much better team by just putting in more effort. Something that can change instantly.
Morgan's score after half time was the worst. Beats the Bath defenders from a standing start to support LRZ and score.
[twitter.com]
As horrible as it is watching it, to me it highlights that we can be a much better team by just putting in more effort. Something that can change instantly.
Bath rugby will only improve with a completely clean clear out of everyone associated with the current team and give the new coach a chance to put his own stamp on it. SH/TM must be top of the list, both have failed miserably and must go. Recman is right, with all our apparent wealth we have ended up with a playing group no better than average, made even worse by poor coaching.
Someone on average income buying two ST's spends a huge amount of his disposable income and deserves far better than we have seen for the past couple of decades. Just when we think we have reached rock bottom we manage to find a new low. The club must act decisively or there will be many more empty seats at the Rec.
Someone on average income buying two ST's spends a huge amount of his disposable income and deserves far better than we have seen for the past couple of decades. Just when we think we have reached rock bottom we manage to find a new low. The club must act decisively or there will be many more empty seats at the Rec.
Quote:warrenball
Bath rugby will only improve with a completely clean clear out of everyone associated with the current team and give the new coach a chance to put his own stamp on it. SH/TM must be top of the list, both have failed miserably and must go. Recman is right, with all our apparent wealth we have ended up with a playing group no better than average, made even worse by poor coaching.
Someone on average income buying two ST's spends a huge amount of his disposable income and deserves far better than we have seen for the past couple of decades. Just when we think we have reached rock bottom we manage to find a new low. The club must act decisively or there will be many more empty seats at the Rec.
I thought that TM was literally only dealing with off field things like club finances and the Rec development now? In which case it seems harsh to me to apportion blame to him. May as well sack the person who irons the socks.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
True Matt and I was surprised by his mention in the Telegraph article, nevertheless it was there, it would be nice to know more about that and what an unclear future actually meant.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
There is precedent for what is going on today. Nick Blofeld was appointed when AB was still our owner alongside Bob Caleja. This I believe was in line with an agreement with Bruce whilst negotiations were taking place. My guess and I emphasise it’s only a guess as I am not in the know, is that EdG is in place for a similar reason. Who is behind a possible ownership change is up to speculation if indeed there is going to be a change.
The uncertainty is not good for the Club, players, management and us and the sooner there is an announcement one way or the other the better.
The uncertainty is not good for the Club, players, management and us and the sooner there is an announcement one way or the other the better.
Quote:BathMatt53Quote:warrenball
Bath rugby will only improve with a completely clean clear out of everyone associated with the current team and give the new coach a chance to put his own stamp on it. SH/TM must be top of the list, both have failed miserably and must go. Recman is right, with all our apparent wealth we have ended up with a playing group no better than average, made even worse by poor coaching.
Someone on average income buying two ST's spends a huge amount of his disposable income and deserves far better than we have seen for the past couple of decades. Just when we think we have reached rock bottom we manage to find a new low. The club must act decisively or there will be many more empty seats at the Rec.
I thought that TM was literally only dealing with off field things like club finances and the Rec development now? In which case it seems harsh to me to apportion blame to him. May as well sack the person who irons the socks.
I think you’ve identified the root cause of the problems BM, the club irons the socks!
Still nothing then!
Not even an apology for the silence. What a way to run an outfit.
Not even an apology for the silence. What a way to run an outfit.
Sometimes Annie organisations are unable to say anything because discussions are under way and until they are finalised they can say absolutely nothing.
I am sure that Ed G is not sitting on his hands
I am sure that Ed G is not sitting on his hands
I also get the impression that Ed G will say exactly what he wants when he wants.
They have announced Cipriani is leaving but he had already said he was going and by last weekends showing in his mind he has already left. Hopefully we won’t have to play him again if Bailey is ok after his HIA.
They have announced Cipriani is leaving but he had already said he was going and by last weekends showing in his mind he has already left. Hopefully we won’t have to play him again if Bailey is ok after his HIA.
I do not agree.
There is no excuse for staying totally silent after such an abysmal series of results. I don't give a d*** what is going on 'behind the scenes' currently. Yet another hastily cobbled together change of personnel? At least 'they' could have the decency to acknowledge the pain and continuing embarrassment their corporate (as in a group of highly paid employees) decisions have caused to, at the very simplest, 'paying customers'.
Bath Rugby supporters have had to suck it up and smile once too often in the face of incredulous comments from other Premiership Club supporters at the recent performance of our players and consequential results. "They just gave up", They just had no idea what to do" "Why is your Coaching team still in post". They didn't look fit enough for a top class 80 minutes of rugby. Just making soothing mooing noises about how all will be well in due course doesn't cut it.
p.s. Please don't patronise me, BSJ. There are enough off the record intelligent experienced contacts away from this board for everyone who has an interest in Bath Rugby, including myself, to be aware of political issues.
There is no excuse for staying totally silent after such an abysmal series of results. I don't give a d*** what is going on 'behind the scenes' currently. Yet another hastily cobbled together change of personnel? At least 'they' could have the decency to acknowledge the pain and continuing embarrassment their corporate (as in a group of highly paid employees) decisions have caused to, at the very simplest, 'paying customers'.
Bath Rugby supporters have had to suck it up and smile once too often in the face of incredulous comments from other Premiership Club supporters at the recent performance of our players and consequential results. "They just gave up", They just had no idea what to do" "Why is your Coaching team still in post". They didn't look fit enough for a top class 80 minutes of rugby. Just making soothing mooing noises about how all will be well in due course doesn't cut it.
p.s. Please don't patronise me, BSJ. There are enough off the record intelligent experienced contacts away from this board for everyone who has an interest in Bath Rugby, including myself, to be aware of political issues.
If any Bath supporters are genuinely experiencing pain and continuing embarrassment I think that it is probably a good opportunity to get a grip and reflect on their life values given everything else that is happening in the world at the moment. It's only a game.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Quote:BathMatt53
If any Bath supporters are genuinely experiencing pain and continuing embarrassment I think that it is probably a good opportunity to get a grip and reflect on their life values given everything else that is happening in the world at the moment. It's only a game.
+1
Blimey Annie, sounds like you don't have anything of real substance going on in your life to worry about so you are free to direct all your rage at a rugby club for having a@#$%&season.
They don't owe you anything. If they cause you that much outrage just by failing to do what you would like them to, you could always just go back to supporting Bristol again, like you used to.
They don't owe you anything. If they cause you that much outrage just by failing to do what you would like them to, you could always just go back to supporting Bristol again, like you used to.
Quote:annie blackthorn
I do not agree.
There is no excuse for staying totally silent after such an abysmal series of results. I don't give a d*** what is going on 'behind the scenes' currently. Yet another hastily cobbled together change of personnel? At least 'they' could have the decency to acknowledge the pain and continuing embarrassment their corporate (as in a group of highly paid employees) decisions have caused to, at the very simplest, 'paying customers'.
Bath Rugby supporters have had to suck it up and smile once too often in the face of incredulous comments from other Premiership Club supporters at the recent performance of our players and consequential results. "They just gave up", They just had no idea what to do" "Why is your Coaching team still in post". They didn't look fit enough for a top class 80 minutes of rugby. Just making soothing mooing noises about how all will be well in due course doesn't cut it.
p.s. Please don't patronise me, BSJ. There are enough off the record intelligent experienced contacts away from this board for everyone who has an interest in Bath Rugby, including myself, to be aware of political issues.
Quote:BathMatt53
If any Bath supporters are genuinely experiencing pain and continuing embarrassment I think that it is probably a good opportunity to get a grip and reflect on their life values given everything else that is happening in the world at the moment. It's only a game.
Well I’ve stopped wearing my Bath shirt in public so I guess I must be a bit embarrassed. However I do agree there are more important things happening to care that much what happens to Bath rugby.
I agree with BM53 and Malco, although at the final whistle the outrage was understandable a cool sense of perspective is definitely required at the club and supporters should understand that.
It is not that change isn't warranted, more that the right decisions are taken at the right time in the right way.
People have moaned about the club being unprofessional at times, well knee jerk decisions would be just that.
It is not that change isn't warranted, more that the right decisions are taken at the right time in the right way.
People have moaned about the club being unprofessional at times, well knee jerk decisions would be just that.
I’m with The Quiet Ones it makes no sense to me to announce anything with only 2 games to go. Give the incoming and outgoing a break and let’s draw a line under proceedings at the end of the season.
Quote:BathMatt53
If any Bath supporters are genuinely experiencing pain and continuing embarrassment I think that it is probably a good opportunity to get a grip and reflect on their life values given everything else that is happening in the world at the moment. It's only a game.
I was with you right up until that final sentence. For some, possibly many the sporting team they support is much more than a group of people playing a game. It can be their main, possibly only source of connection and we all need that in life. It can be part of someone's identity if they have been a lifelong fan living in the centre of the team's community
Try going into a pub on match day in Liverpool centre and telling people there "it's only a game"
It isn't where I am [though I'm much closer there than indifference] but I fully understand why those who are there feel the pain of Saturday like they do
Quote:gaz59Quote:BathMatt53
If any Bath supporters are genuinely experiencing pain and continuing embarrassment I think that it is probably a good opportunity to get a grip and reflect on their life values given everything else that is happening in the world at the moment. It's only a game.
I was with you right up until that final sentence. For some, possibly many the sporting team they support is much more than a group of people playing a game. It can be their main, possibly only source of connection and we all need that in life. It can be part of someone's identity if they have been a lifelong fan living in the centre of the team's community
Try going into a pub on match day in Liverpool centre and telling people there "it's only a game"
It isn't where I am [though I'm much closer there than indifference] but I fully understand why those who are there feel the pain of Saturday like they do
A game that generates lots of emotions - after all that is perhaps the point - but notwithstanding that, being in 'pain' and continuous embarrassment a week after the event can't be healthy. Even the supporters of the worst teams can be pragmatic about wins and losses - just look at the supporters of Faroe Islands and Brechin City.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Part of it BathMatt is expectations. I would suggest losing regularly with the occasional big defeat wouldn't be far from the expectations for most Faroe Islands supporters
Bath fans surely are entitled to expect a far better performance and certainly not being nilled in an absolute mullering from one of our closest rivals. It's the expectations - reality gap that causes the pain
Bath fans surely are entitled to expect a far better performance and certainly not being nilled in an absolute mullering from one of our closest rivals. It's the expectations - reality gap that causes the pain
Quote:gaz59
It's the expectations - reality gap that causes the pain
Fair enough, I was pretty miffed for a bit but nothing a few pints with some mates didn't put right - you must take it all a bit more seriously than I do!
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
The issue is that without some reaction from supporters complacency sets in at the top. I recall our owner clearly stating that he respected Bath's history and wanted them under his stewardship to be a top European club. Well, that has not gone to plan! The complacency and lack of drive to win, and the view that all is well after a couple of beers, no matter the result is a hangover from the amateur days, and disrespectful to the paying supporters. Bath has failed to move forwards in 15 years and for some the choice of loyalty to the game or the club becomes a reality with ongoing impoverished performances. Supporters have every right to feel let down when year after year the club seems unable to improve, or to compete at the highest level.
Just looking at the Sarries performance just shows how far away we are from being a top English side. I just don't see how we can ever be a top European side. The gulf is just immense
Last week the Bath result was partially softened by the Fijian Drua game v Highlanders. Drua still lost - but only just, having been in front at half time (sound familiar?). This week no Bath game to get depressed about - so Drua result 67-5 v Hurricanes managed to do that all on its own. Maybe I should stop supporting........
OBinFiji
OBinFiji
Maybe this is a bit too soon for some, but a little positivity to cheer up your Sunday ..
So we have two games left, the one against LI will probably be another (potential tonking) defeat as they will be desperate to secure a top eight finish so they are a good team and have everything to play for, we on the other hand confidence shot and nothing to play for will struggle, so no point getting invested in the result on this one .
However, perhaps we can end the season with a good result and performance against Wuss to finish above them this will lift the spirits going into the off season... a bit.. So something to get up for, but either way win or lose, time to draw a line and look forward..
The way I see it JVG has a very low starting point to build from, I have no information to support this but I feel he is a strong character and experienced coach who must have when accepting the job said "I'm going to do this and I will change this and this is how its going to be, its my way and no interference"
We are at rock bottom at the moment so the only way is up bring on 22/23 season .
PS well done Somerset county big win and cricket score against Essex yesterday !
So we have two games left, the one against LI will probably be another (potential tonking) defeat as they will be desperate to secure a top eight finish so they are a good team and have everything to play for, we on the other hand confidence shot and nothing to play for will struggle, so no point getting invested in the result on this one .
However, perhaps we can end the season with a good result and performance against Wuss to finish above them this will lift the spirits going into the off season... a bit.. So something to get up for, but either way win or lose, time to draw a line and look forward..
The way I see it JVG has a very low starting point to build from, I have no information to support this but I feel he is a strong character and experienced coach who must have when accepting the job said "I'm going to do this and I will change this and this is how its going to be, its my way and no interference"
We are at rock bottom at the moment so the only way is up bring on 22/23 season .
PS well done Somerset county big win and cricket score against Essex yesterday !
Quote:LSAR
The way I see it JVG has a very low starting point to build from, I have no information to support this but I feel he is a strong character and experienced coach who must have when accepting the job said "I'm going to do this and I will change this and this is how its going to be, its my way and no interference"
We are at rock bottom at the moment so the only way is up bring on 22/23 season .
His words were more likely (allegedly) 'Thanks for the huge salary that you have just offered me plus the deal on accommodation. My family and I were beginning to get a bit bored of Limerick so Bath seems a nice enough place to hangout for a couple of years before going back to SA. I cannot really fail as a coach because the team are so cr** at the moment that there is only one possible direction to go and the fans will treat me as some sort of Messiah if we manage the odd win here and there. Heigh ho things are looking up!'
Haha, it's what I said but the cynical , glass half empty version ! Im not denying it's a possibility your right, it's just for some reason my glasses have a nice rosy tint today.Let's hope the reports he's a good coach and a decent guy who is going to turn things around and not just trouser a big payday and swan back to SA after gettiing us relegated .
Damn you've got me at it now.
Damn you've got me at it now.
Watching these games over the weekend I cannot help agreeing with Gaz, the gap between Bath and even the top Premiership teams is huge, but then you have to step up from there to become the top European team. Bruce Craig came in with big ideas and no doubt has tried hard, but as a supporter of several generations standing I can only think he has failed miserably. I can think of no consolation, not only for this terrible season, but the steady and consistent decline of Bath over a very long time.
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