Bath
SALVATION OR DAMNATION? BATH v NORTHAMPTON SAINTS
Mercer: send off.
By PG Tips
June 8 2021
Bath have one last chance of salvation in the final Premiership fixture, hosting Northampton this weekend. They hope to salvage Champions Cup rugby next season and some credit and pride from a season that has recently gone off the rails. There was a time when people prayed to the saints for salvation, but these Northampton Saints seem more likely to condemn Bath to a sixth successive defeat and their worst league finish since 2003. So will it be salvation or damnation by 4 PM on Saturday?
When the Covid induced moratorium on relegation was announced many feared that would render most late season games meaningless. As it turns out, by a quirk of fate & fixture list the last two rounds have thrown together ties between teams closely contesting similar league positions, as if to inject excitement into a ringfenced tournament, as the table below shows.
|
WEEK 21 |
3rd v 4th |
SALE v HARLEQUINS |
|
|
10th v 9th |
GLOUCESTER v BATH |
|
|
11th v 12th |
NEWCASTLE v WORCESTER |
|
|
7th v 8th |
LONDON IRISH v WASPS |
|
WEEK 22 |
2nd v 3rd |
EXETER v SALE |
|
|
8th v 5th |
BATH v NORTHAMPTON |
|
|
7th v 6th |
WASPS v LEICESTER |
|
|
12th v 11th |
WORCESTER v GLOUCESTER |
Bath cannot rob Saints of 5th place, but can secure 8th or even 7th if they win. If they slip up, any of 3 teams below them could push them out of top European rugby next season. Bath’s task looks a lot more difficult after Northampton’s performance v Exeter last Sunday. A man down for more than 60% of the match, Saints still completely dominated the first half, taking an 18-0 lead and even after the visitors had taken back control, found the spirit and energy to threaten a final reversal deep into injury time. They will be in no mood to do Bath any favours. As coach Matt Proudfoot said, although their league position cannot change, they do not understand the concept of “nothing to play for.” Courtney Lawes looked to be playing himself into the Lions test team with his tackling and turnovers, similarly Dan Biggar, showcasing the best of his game management. There are danger men throughout their team: Ratuniyarawa, Ludlam and Wood in the forwards for example, scrum halves James and Mitchell, backs Hutchinson, Procter and the rampaging Naiyaravoro. It is their collective power though that makes them such a daunting prospect for struggling Bath. If they bring that same mix of aggression, physicality and passion they will be hard to hold, never mind beat.
Saints first half dominance at Franklin’s Gardens suggests Bath may have to play much of the game without the ball, further compounding the challenge for the side with the leakiest defence in the Premiership- surely an issue that must be plugged through off season recruitment of a specialist coach?
Bath do have some hope. Both East Midlands sides showed the way last weekend. Take the game to your opponents with focus, ferocity and flashes of flair and even table leaders can be rattled into error. The home side need to dig back to their best patch this season, a period of self- belief and cussedness in February and March, for the necessary aggression and build on some of the fluency and flair shown against Quins to catch Saints napping.
The coaches should naturally chose the team they think best equipped to win, but personally I hope there will be parts at some stage for Henry Thomas, Elliott Stooke, Zach Mercer and Rhys Priestland, to sign off their Bath careers with the thanks of a home crowd.
This will be a test not only of Bath’s squad, their resilience and their ambition for next season, but also of the home support. The crowds at Welford Road & Franklin’s Gardens lifted their teams last weekend. They also intimidated officials, helping the home team edge the 50-50 decisions. This is the one and only chance for Bath supporters to cheer their team this season. If they can find the fervour to fuel fight in their team, they can make the difference.
Come on you Bath!
Possible Teams:
Bath: Obano, Du Toit, Stuart, Ewels (Capt.), McNally, Faletau, Underhill, Mercer. Spencer, Priestland. Muir, Ojomoh, Joseph, Watson. De Glanville.
Replacements: Schoeman, Doughty,Thomas, Stooke, Reid. Chudley, Bailey, Cokanasiga.
Northampton: Waller, Matavesi, Painter, Moon, Ratuniyarawa, Lawes, Ludlam, Wood. James, Biggar. Naiyaravoro, Hutchinson, Proctor, Sleightholme. Freeman.
Replacements: Haywood, Iyogun, Heffernan, Coles, Harrison. Mitchell, Grayson, Dingwall.
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StumbleuponSALVATION OR DAMNATION? BATH v NORTHAMPTON SAINTS. TEAM UP!
Discussion started by Comeonmylovers.co.uk (IP Logged), 08/06/2021 11:47
08/06/2021 11:47
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Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2021:06:14:17:25:12 by P G Tips.
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Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2021:06:14:17:25:12 by P G Tips.
Haven't seen the tackle, but ribbans has been given a 3 week ban for his red card at the weekend. He will miss the Bath game and two pre-season friendlies....
I have no idea what the Saints coaching staff may be thinking, but as there is nothing for them to play for except pride, could they possibly rest Biggar and Lawes as greater tests lie in wait for them with the Lions.
I am sure even the hardest of hearts would be put under strain if either of these players had a serious injury in what is a fairly meaningless match for them.
I am sure even the hardest of hearts would be put under strain if either of these players had a serious injury in what is a fairly meaningless match for them.
Ribbans absence will be welcomed, he destroyed us a couple of years ago. And, the red card was deserved.
Bizarre that we are battling for a result in the last game of the season just to make the top 8.
Whatever the result, hopefully we can give Zac, Rhys and Elliott and others a good send off, which would be richly deserved.
Bizarre that we are battling for a result in the last game of the season just to make the top 8.
Whatever the result, hopefully we can give Zac, Rhys and Elliott and others a good send off, which would be richly deserved.
A bit like the Montpelier game I think the match will be won or lost in the first 20 minutes
We will start hard and fast. If we go two plus scores clear in first quarter the game will be ours. If we don't Saints, I reckon will get stronger and will win it in last quarter
A lot could hang on whether Biggar wants to be rested, looked like a muscle tweak when he came off
We will start hard and fast. If we go two plus scores clear in first quarter the game will be ours. If we don't Saints, I reckon will get stronger and will win it in last quarter
A lot could hang on whether Biggar wants to be rested, looked like a muscle tweak when he came off
Quote:gaz59
We will start hard and fast. If we go two plus scores clear in first quarter the game will be ours.
Really? Because all evidence in the last few years has shown that when we start well, we stop playing after going a couple of scores ahead and struggle to hold onto a lead.
The alternative is that we start terribly and sleepwalk into games, get demolished in the first half and claw our way back into contention in the second once the opposition make a few changes.
A third viewpoint, is that, for a number of recent games, we have shaken off the 'can't last for 80 minutes' syndrome , and have played for the complete 80!
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:06:08:13:54:22 by Mike the Taxi.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:06:08:13:54:22 by Mike the Taxi.
Quote:Mike the Taxi
A third viewpoint, is that, for a number of recent games, we have shaken off the 'can't last for 80 minutes' syndrome , and have played for the complete 80!
Really? Any examples of good 80 minute performances?
So now with Glaws v Wuss called off and points going to Wuss, we only have to concern ourselves with Irish and Falcons. Each going up against a top 4 club... so that's a positive at least.
Now just need to see strength of sides Bristol and Quins push out on last league game.
Fingers crossed all round.
Now just need to see strength of sides Bristol and Quins push out on last league game.
Fingers crossed all round.
Quote:West Wilts Wanderer
So now with Glaws v Wuss called off and points going to Wuss, we only have to concern ourselves with Irish and Falcons. Each going up against a top 4 club... so that's a positive at least.
Now just need to see strength of sides Bristol and Quins push out on last league game.
Fingers crossed all round.
We haven't won a Champions Cup game in three years, why does it matter if we make it or not.
Quote:It is two years, not three, and we can’t correct that if we aren’t in the competition. And this season we only played one game in the competition!ballsoutQuote:West Wilts Wanderer
So now with Glaws v Wuss called off and points going to Wuss, we only have to concern ourselves with Irish and Falcons. Each going up against a top 4 club... so that's a positive at least.
Now just need to see strength of sides Bristol and Quins push out on last league game.
Fingers crossed all round.
We haven't won a Champions Cup game in three years, why does it matter if we make it or not.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:06:08:16:44:38 by dcsh.
"we stop playing" & "claw our way back into contention" were the phrases you used, implying that Bath were not capable of playing the full distance.
Quote:dcshQuote:It is two years, not three, and we can’t correct that if we aren’t in the competition. And this season we only played one game in the competition!ballsoutQuote:West Wilts Wanderer
So now with Glaws v Wuss called off and points going to Wuss, we only have to concern ourselves with Irish and Falcons. Each going up against a top 4 club... so that's a positive at least.
Now just need to see strength of sides Bristol and Quins push out on last league game.
Fingers crossed all round.
We haven't won a Champions Cup game in three years, why does it matter if we make it or not.
1 Champions Cup win in our last 13 games, a 2 point home win against Wasps.
Quote:Mike the Taxi
"we stop playing" & "claw our way back into contention" were the phrases you used, implying that Bath were not capable of playing the full distance.
I don't believe we are. So what are these examples of 80 minute performances you claimed?
I'd rather see Reid, Bayliss, Mercer in the back row. Reid on merit, and Bayliss to save Faletau from the risk of injury, but arguably on form.
Quote:ballsoutQuote:West Wilts Wanderer
So now with Glaws v Wuss called off and points going to Wuss, we only have to concern ourselves with Irish and Falcons. Each going up against a top 4 club... so that's a positive at least.
Now just need to see strength of sides Bristol and Quins push out on last league game.
Fingers crossed all round.
We haven't won a Champions Cup game in three years, why does it matter if we make it or not.
It might help with recruitment of good players who want to play in the Ch Cup and there will be more TV coverage of the club. Win or lose all clubs should be ambitious. Do you think Italy should give up on the 6N?
Quote:Sure, it’s a poor record and the notion of a competition called the “Champions Cup” having the 8th best teams in it is a bit bizarre. But this is the reality of 2021, surely it is better to try to get into it if you can. But if not then we must make the most of the Challenge Cup.ballsout
[
1 Champions Cup win in our last 13 games, a 2 point home win against Wasps.
As I said on another thread, our last win in the Champions Cup was in Jan 2019 when we beat Wasps. In the same season our other match with Wasps drawn, while losing to Leinster and Toulouse. We lost both Toulouse matches by a combined 5 points and only took a beating in one Leinster match, the other was 7 points.
The year after we were beaten convincingly by Clermont twice, but the other 4 loses were by an average of less than 5 points each.
And this year we lost by 4 points in the only actual Champions Cup match we played.
So there was plenty of potential to have multiple wins with only small improvements. On the whole these are not embarrassing loses, they are frustrating for fans because they were close in many cases. Can Bath make those improvements is a different thing.
Good post dcsh. I'm not bothered which European cup we're in as I do feel we'll just make up the numbers in the Champions Cup but those stats offer a more positive slant on our pretty abysmal recent record.
In terms of Saints back, there's also Olly Sleightholme (as in son of ex Bath & Saints Jon) and Tommy Freeman to watch out for, more so than Procter and Naiyaravoro IMO.
Sleightholme is properly fast but is physical too, and has a very good scoring record.
Freeman has only just turned 20 and looks to have a big future ahead of him - namechecked in the Guardian team of the year article.
Sleightholme is properly fast but is physical too, and has a very good scoring record.
Freeman has only just turned 20 and looks to have a big future ahead of him - namechecked in the Guardian team of the year article.
Sleightholme failed a HIA on Sunday so I believe will be unable to play under the 7 day rule.
Hopefully with crowds and international travel back, I for one hope we qualify for the Champions Cup and a potentially great away weekend in France!
Quote:Disunited
Sleightholme failed a HIA on Sunday so I believe will be unable to play under the 7 day rule.
Who knows how these things actually work!
Quote:shendy
In terms of Saints back, there's also Olly Sleightholme (as in son of ex Bath & Saints Jon) and Tommy Freeman to watch out for, more so than Procter and Naiyaravoro IMO.
Sleightholme is properly fast but is physical too, and has a very good scoring record.
Freeman has only just turned 20 and looks to have a big future ahead of him - namechecked in the Guardian team of the year article.
Freeman was excellent against Chiefs I thought. Certainly agree about an exciting future for him
Champions Cup is worth 250k plus more than Challenge Cup. Which is money we could use
Quote:hasta
Champions Cup is worth 250k plus more than Challenge Cup. Which is money we could use
Hmm its less than I expected.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:06:09:11:43:58 by woodpecker.
Quote:It depends how he does during the week following the return to play protocol. A failed HIA doesn’t necessarily mean a concussion.shendyQuote:Disunited
Sleightholme failed a HIA on Sunday so I believe will be unable to play under the 7 day rule.
Who knows how these things actually work!
Quote:woodpeckerQuote:hasta
Champions Cup is worth 250k plus more than Challenge Cup. Which is money we could use
Hmm its less than I expected.
250k is the straight qualification amount. It's worth more in revenue as well (as generally crowds are full for Champs Cup and... not for Challenge).
I would be interested to see the difference in revenue with going out at first stage of champs vs winning the final of the challenge. Potentially only get a couple of home games in the champs with our record.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Are some clubs going to drop down to the Challenge Cup again next season when they exit the Champions Cup?
One would assume so since the higher numbers in the Champions Cup compared to Challenge Cup.
If that is the case then you can take a shot at the group stage of the Champions Cup and if they doesn’t workout still have a run in the Challenge Cup. Like we did this season.
One would assume so since the higher numbers in the Champions Cup compared to Challenge Cup.
If that is the case then you can take a shot at the group stage of the Champions Cup and if they doesn’t workout still have a run in the Challenge Cup. Like we did this season.
I don't get many peoples thinking with regards to either playing in the champions Cup or challenge Cup. The team get slated for playing in the champions Cup as they struggle to win and get slated for playing in the change Cup if they don't win the competition.
How can we say we are a ambitious club if we don't want to compete year after year in the biggest European competition. Do you really think international players who bath try and sign will see playing in the challenge Cup as a good thing? Bath get far more out of playing the top teams in Europe than playing random teams who arent quite good enough to challenge the big boys.
Im not saying the challenge Cup is a bad competition and it's a great opportunity to blood younger players or help gain confidence/ form but we should always want to be mixing it with the best in Europe.
How can we say we are a ambitious club if we don't want to compete year after year in the biggest European competition. Do you really think international players who bath try and sign will see playing in the challenge Cup as a good thing? Bath get far more out of playing the top teams in Europe than playing random teams who arent quite good enough to challenge the big boys.
Im not saying the challenge Cup is a bad competition and it's a great opportunity to blood younger players or help gain confidence/ form but we should always want to be mixing it with the best in Europe.
Quote:ollyshep
Bath get far more out of playing the top teams in Europe than playing random teams who arent quite good enough to challenge the big boys.
Like Bath?
Sirs for the weekend:
Referee; Ian Tempest (90th Premiership game)
Assistant referees; Hamish Smales & Peter Allan
TMO; David Rose
Citing Officer; Duncan Bell
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Referee; Ian Tempest (90th Premiership game)
Assistant referees; Hamish Smales & Peter Allan
TMO; David Rose
Citing Officer; Duncan Bell
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Quote:ballsoutQuote:ollyshep
Bath get far more out of playing the top teams in Europe than playing random teams who arent quite good enough to challenge the big boys.
Like Bath?
Yeah just like bath who have been challenging the "big boys" nearly every season ......
Quote:ollyshepQuote:ballsoutQuote:ollyshep
Bath get far more out of playing the top teams in Europe than playing random teams who arent quite good enough to challenge the big boys.
Like Bath?
Yeah just like bath who have been challenging the "big boys" nearly every season ......
Really?
By "challenging the big boys" do you mean sitting 8th in the table (11th had Gloucester beaten us at the weekend), with a minus 116 points difference, second worst only to Worcester, with a team full of internationals? Or maybe winning 1 Champions Cup game in our last thirteen? A 2pt home win against Wasps back when they were rubbish. No trophy to speak of in 14 years.
How ridiculous to condescendingly talk down Challenge Cup teams as if they're somehow beneath us, when the reality is that they're exactly the type of crowd Bath currently belong with.
Quote:ballsoutQuote:ollyshepQuote:ballsoutQuote:ollyshep
Bath get far more out of playing the top teams in Europe than playing random teams who arent quite good enough to challenge the big boys.
Like Bath?
Yeah just like bath who have been challenging the "big boys" nearly every season ......
Really?
By "challenging the big boys" do you mean sitting 8th in the table (11th had Gloucester beaten us at the weekend), with a minus 116 points difference, second worst only to Worcester, with a team full of internationals? Or maybe winning 1 Champions Cup game in our last thirteen? A 2pt home win against Wasps back when they were rubbish. No trophy to speak of in 14 years.
How ridiculous to condescendingly talk down Challenge Cup teams as if they're somehow beneath us, when the reality is that they're exactly the type of crowd Bath currently belong with.
I guess you have totally missed my point. I'm not talking about premiership which we have had a bad season. I read your comments alot and think does this person even support Bath or does he enjoy constantly being so negative about everything. Also I take it you have never played rugby as your thinking never makes sense. The point I was making is surely we want to be going up against the best and attracting the best possible players.
Quote:ollyshepQuote:ballsoutQuote:ollyshepQuote:ballsoutQuote:ollyshep
Bath get far more out of playing the top teams in Europe than playing random teams who arent quite good enough to challenge the big boys.
Like Bath?
Yeah just like bath who have been challenging the "big boys" nearly every season ......
Really?
By "challenging the big boys" do you mean sitting 8th in the table (11th had Gloucester beaten us at the weekend), with a minus 116 points difference, second worst only to Worcester, with a team full of internationals? Or maybe winning 1 Champions Cup game in our last thirteen? A 2pt home win against Wasps back when they were rubbish. No trophy to speak of in 14 years.
How ridiculous to condescendingly talk down Challenge Cup teams as if they're somehow beneath us, when the reality is that they're exactly the type of crowd Bath currently belong with.
I guess you have totally missed my point. I'm not talking about premiership which we have had a bad season. I read your comments alot and think does this person even support Bath or does he enjoy constantly being so negative about everything. Also I take it you have never played rugby as your thinking never makes sense. The point I was making is surely we want to be going up against the best and attracting the best possible players.
Yes, we've had "1 bad season in the Premiership". That's it exactly.
Quote:ollyshep
The point I was making is surely we want to be going up against the best and attracting the best possible players.
I don't think that we have too much of an issue attracting good players (10 aside?), although actually paying for them under the new cap is going to become more of a problem.
If the Champs cup teams are indeed dropping down to the challenge cup then the difference would only really be playing a Leinster in the first couple of rounds rather than a Yenisey-STM Krasnoyarsk so not too fussed, both games would be one sided and we would be in the same place come January.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
It's worth pointing out that the Rec is one of only two grounds Saints haven't managed to win at since Boyd arrived (plus Sale).
In terms of the side logic says both Lawes and Biggar are rested ahead of the Lions but neither are the type to want to miss any game whether there is anything on the line or not! Although with Ribbans banned there is maybe less scope to rest Lawes.
Either way, hopefully a good game to sign off the season with (for both of us anyway).
In terms of the side logic says both Lawes and Biggar are rested ahead of the Lions but neither are the type to want to miss any game whether there is anything on the line or not! Although with Ribbans banned there is maybe less scope to rest Lawes.
Either way, hopefully a good game to sign off the season with (for both of us anyway).
Skybet has Bath by 10 before the team announcement, which seems very optimistic on our side?
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Teams up
Bath Rugby side to play Northampton Saints
15. Tom de Glanville, 14. Anthony Watson, 13. Jonathan Joseph, 12. Max Ojomoh, 11. Joe Cokanasiga, 10. Rhys Priestland, 9. Ben Spencer; 1. Beno Obano, 2. Jacques du Toit, 3. Christian Judge, 4. Josh McNally, 5. Charlie Ewels ©, 6. Miles Reid, 7. Sam Underhill, 8. Taulupe Faletau
Replacements
16. Tom Doughty, 17. Juan Schoeman 18. Henry Thomas, 19. Will Spencer, 20. Zach Mercer, 21. Josh Bayliss, 22. Will Chudley, 23. Orlando Bailey
PG
Bath Rugby side to play Northampton Saints
15. Tom de Glanville, 14. Anthony Watson, 13. Jonathan Joseph, 12. Max Ojomoh, 11. Joe Cokanasiga, 10. Rhys Priestland, 9. Ben Spencer; 1. Beno Obano, 2. Jacques du Toit, 3. Christian Judge, 4. Josh McNally, 5. Charlie Ewels ©, 6. Miles Reid, 7. Sam Underhill, 8. Taulupe Faletau
Replacements
16. Tom Doughty, 17. Juan Schoeman 18. Henry Thomas, 19. Will Spencer, 20. Zach Mercer, 21. Josh Bayliss, 22. Will Chudley, 23. Orlando Bailey
PG
And Northampton's selection:
BATH RUGBY vs NORTHAMPTON SAINTS
15 Tommy Freeman
14 Tom Collins
13 Fraser Dingwall
12 Rory Hutchinson
11 Taqele Naiyaravoro
10 James Grayson
9 Alex Mitchell
1 Nick Auterac
2 Mike Haywood
3 Paul Hill
4 Alex Coles
5 Alex Moon
6 Courtney Lawes
7 Lewis Ludlam (capt)
8 Tom Wood
Replacements:
16 James Fish
17 Alex Waller
18 Ehren Painter
19 Api Ratuniyarawa
20 Ollie Newman
21 Connor Tupai
22 Matt Proctor
23 Josh Gillespie
Not available due to injury:
Owen Franks (foot), George Furbank (calf), Danny Hobbs-Awoyemi (achilles), Teimana Harrison (calf), Nick Isiekwe (pectoral), and Ollie Sleightholme (concussion).
BATH RUGBY vs NORTHAMPTON SAINTS
15 Tommy Freeman
14 Tom Collins
13 Fraser Dingwall
12 Rory Hutchinson
11 Taqele Naiyaravoro
10 James Grayson
9 Alex Mitchell
1 Nick Auterac
2 Mike Haywood
3 Paul Hill
4 Alex Coles
5 Alex Moon
6 Courtney Lawes
7 Lewis Ludlam (capt)
8 Tom Wood
Replacements:
16 James Fish
17 Alex Waller
18 Ehren Painter
19 Api Ratuniyarawa
20 Ollie Newman
21 Connor Tupai
22 Matt Proctor
23 Josh Gillespie
Not available due to injury:
Owen Franks (foot), George Furbank (calf), Danny Hobbs-Awoyemi (achilles), Teimana Harrison (calf), Nick Isiekwe (pectoral), and Ollie Sleightholme (concussion).
Is Will Muir crocked then? Missed that, interesting winger match ups Watson gets Naiyaravoro and Joe C gets Tom Collins. Doesn't really seem fair.
Big game for Max Ojomoh outside Priestland. Presumably Faletau and Mercer will get a half each.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Big game for Max Ojomoh outside Priestland. Presumably Faletau and Mercer will get a half each.
Good to see Beno back, Stuart must be injured as must be Muir again seems strange why we are so coy about stating someone is injured - it is made that much more obvious when other teams list their unavailables - Josh M reported fit but not selected in the 23 or Coetzee? Judge concerns me on recent showings - would have thought Henry Thomas was a better starter.
Positive - Max O being given the confidence to start again, feel though for Josh Bayliss not sure what the lad has to do to overcome Underhill's reputation - I think all of us will agree that both Bayliss and Reid have well and truly shown up their illustrious team mates this season - but we seem to revert to named superstars rather than trusting form.
Finally, I hope that Will Spencer's nightmare injury jinx is finally behind him and we start to see the true potential - pushing for regular starting berth - I think I might have considered starting him behind Judge.
Positive - Max O being given the confidence to start again, feel though for Josh Bayliss not sure what the lad has to do to overcome Underhill's reputation - I think all of us will agree that both Bayliss and Reid have well and truly shown up their illustrious team mates this season - but we seem to revert to named superstars rather than trusting form.
Finally, I hope that Will Spencer's nightmare injury jinx is finally behind him and we start to see the true potential - pushing for regular starting berth - I think I might have considered starting him behind Judge.
Quote:BathIron
No final farewell for Elliot Stooke it seems.
No - they clearly don't rate him anywhere near as high as supporters do.
Quote:BathIron
Bristol and Quins putting out strong teams which is good for Bath!
We've been given such a lifeline by Glos, that I would feel even more sheepish if we accessed a HC place only via Quins/Bris beating off our only challengers for 8th. At least if we go out and take 5 points tomorrow, it will feel as though we're 8th on merit (and if that isn't 'damning with faint praise'!).
Quote:I can see your point but how can 'superstars' gain form if they are never played?Ali1969
feel though for Josh Bayliss not sure what the lad has to do to overcome Underhill's reputation - I think all of us will agree that both Bayliss and Reid have well and truly shown up their illustrious team mates this season - but we seem to revert to named superstars rather than trusting form.
Quote:OptimistQuote:BathIron
No final farewell for Elliot Stooke it seems.
No - they clearly don't rate him anywhere near as high as supporters do.
We forgave him his 'indiscretions' and gave him games when some on here where calling for his head yet he still decided to go to Wasps (although i accept that he might have been tied to that contract before the 'events'). Whether he got the hump with management, decided to leave for ambition, money, new pastures (I don't believe he has any ties in Bath) we may never know. It's a shame cos he was a very good stalwart for us for many a game but I would rather give Spencer more time at the coal face because he will be here next year
Quote:Ali1969
Positive - feel though for Josh Bayliss not sure what the lad has to do to overcome Underhill's reputation - I think all of us will agree that both Bayliss and Reid have well and truly shown up their illustrious team mates this season - .
They have been outstanding but I do not agree that they outshine Underhill.
We are lucky to have such a rich depth of loose forwards.
PG
Sad to see the Saints board discussing closing down.
Maybe we could offer them ‘lodger status’ on ‘ere.
Maybe we could offer them ‘lodger status’ on ‘ere.
I read the Saints board regularly and it is generally interesting and knowledgeable but Saint Ted has had a lot to put up with from a few posters and has finally gone nuclear on them. Good for him.
... IMHO, of course.
Now in Honolulu
... IMHO, of course.
Now in Honolulu
He'll of a backline when you consider its missing redpath and arguably our 2 form wingers this season in rmc and the horse.
Cips should be desperate to get stuck into ot next season.
Shame no coetzee-was excited to see him get a game but if anything less than 100% then no point taking a chance.
Agree that reid and bayliss have been outstanding this season but also think underhill has been excellent and added a real carrying threat to his game.
Cips should be desperate to get stuck into ot next season.
Shame no coetzee-was excited to see him get a game but if anything less than 100% then no point taking a chance.
Agree that reid and bayliss have been outstanding this season but also think underhill has been excellent and added a real carrying threat to his game.
Quote:charlieboa
He'll of a backline when you consider its missing redpath and arguably our 2 form wingers this season in rmc and the horse.
Cips should be desperate to get stuck into ot next season.
Shame no coetzee-was excited to see him get a game but if anything less than 100% then no point taking a chance.
Agree that reid and bayliss have been outstanding this season but also think underhill has been excellent and added a real carrying threat to his game.
It's nice to hear someone else who thinks positively. Breath of fresh air on this site
Makes sense to save Coetzee for next season even if he’s available; we’ve still got 5 quality back rowers in the 23, need to give Mercer the send off he deserves, and it means he doesn’t count towards the cap.
Irish game is off so apparently we only need 1 point
Adopted Players: All of the little blighters!!!
Adopted Players: All of the little blighters!!!
Quote:Ali1969
Good to see Beno back, Stuart must be injured as must be Muir
.
On the team selection podcast Hoops says Stuart has a "minor injury- not too long out". Muir is unavailable - maybe England 7s? Anybody know?
PG
Quote:That was my thought too, I believe he was named in the Olympic training squad, but can find very little up to date information in this.P G Tips
Muir is unavailable - maybe England 7s? Anybody know?
PG
Too many penalties….again, 2 tries in 2 mins for Bath 15-7……27 mins in ! 
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Watson fails to ground - no try: Saints succeed in grounding - try
15 v 14
15 v 14
Easy try for Saints 15- 14 , and another 15- 19 whole season in one half 
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Cipriani and Cokanasiga in defence next season is going to be something to behold...
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:06:12:15:55:31 by The Bear.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:06:12:15:55:31 by The Bear.
Tempest determined to rule out Spencer’s try even though T-M-O says ball went backwards !!
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Try for Du Toit ! 22-19
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Spencer is magnificent. And Priestland’s kicking out of hand must be worth about 500 metres so far
Naiyavora yellow , another mess up going for the line !
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Mercifully we don’t need to win - just one more try. Can we actually stuff it up from here?
Grayson scores 4th try with 14 on the pitch 22- 24
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Quote:Optimist
Mercifully we don’t need to win - just one more try. Can we actually stuff it up from here?
Of course we can Never in Doubt !
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Quote:The Bear
Cipriani and Cokanasiga in defence next season is going to be something to behold...
No need to worry Bear, DC won't let the opposition have the ball...
Adopted players: 24/25 J Bayliss; [24] O Lawrence; [23] J Cokanasiga; [22] M Green; [21] A Watson; [20] T Faletau; [19] M V Vuuren; [18] T Faletau; [17] D Denton; [16] H. Agulla; [15] L Houston; [14] W Spencer; [13] F. Louw
Family . Community . Nation - [sdp.org.uk]
My mind's been going places without me lately - Bushfire The B52's
Oh dear another lost ball going for the line and then Doughty scores but disallowed, another yellow for Saints.
Why does JC now almost always look for contact instead of gaps ?
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Why does JC now almost always look for contact instead of gaps ?
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Quote:Old Bath Tub
Oh dear another lost ball going for the line and then Doughty scores but disallowed, another yellow for Saints.
Why does JC now almost always look for contact instead of gaps ?
He doesn’t seem to have much pace
The inefficiency of this team is astounding. I’ll be amazed if we avoid getting beaten.
We’ll get losing BP - the scabbiest way into Europe ever
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:06:12:16:59:14 by Optimist.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:06:12:16:59:14 by Optimist.
How can we play against 14 twice and look second best, twice? If we win this we'll have stolen it
Crazy. Bayliss has great pace.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:06:12:17:02:05 by Maeght.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:06:12:17:02:05 by Maeght.
That is some wheels from Bayliss. Was not expecting that as a finish
That is a bizarre end to the game .... was expecting a penalty against us at the scrum which could have seen us lose and within a minute we get the 5 point victory. Lots wrong with us as ever but live to lose another today in Europe.
And what a score from Bayliss! Assisted by McNally 30-24.
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Was really thinking we should have just kicked it out as soon as McNally made that turnover, but I'm glad we didn't
How often have we had at least 4 tries chalked off?
Two certainly dropped balls, but both the others could have been given.
Missed the first 30+ minutes, tuned in to see Watson's drop & 2 Saints tries - worried I brought bad luck.
Kept going to the end, great rip from McNally and what wheels from Baylis.
Nice way for Zac, Henry, Rhys and others to say goodbye.
Two certainly dropped balls, but both the others could have been given.
Missed the first 30+ minutes, tuned in to see Watson's drop & 2 Saints tries - worried I brought bad luck.
Kept going to the end, great rip from McNally and what wheels from Baylis.
Nice way for Zac, Henry, Rhys and others to say goodbye.
Why can't refs make decisions. All this TMO stuff takes all the momentum out of the game. Fine for some decisions but when just about every try has to be reviewed...... Refs get paid to ref the game not watch TV. Well done Bath you deserved that whatever naysayers on here may say.
Thought that was another poor display where we tried to find ways to lose and were abject during the sin bins. Dropped the ball over the line 5 times in 2 games? Staggering.
Great work by mcnally and bayliss fot the BP try.
Win is a win etc and lovely to see fans there and glad the leavers bow out with a win
Great work by mcnally and bayliss fot the BP try.
Win is a win etc and lovely to see fans there and glad the leavers bow out with a win
Quote:Never In Doubt
Lots wrong with us as ever but live to lose another today in Europe.
Not next season NID, we now have Danny who is the messiah, as well as being an occasional naughty boy. McNally for pack leader, Spencer to boss the forwards, DC to shape our attack and we will be a force to be reckoned with. Roll on season 21/22, very excited but will have to wait
Adopted players: 24/25 J Bayliss; [24] O Lawrence; [23] J Cokanasiga; [22] M Green; [21] A Watson; [20] T Faletau; [19] M V Vuuren; [18] T Faletau; [17] D Denton; [16] H. Agulla; [15] L Houston; [14] W Spencer; [13] F. Louw
Family . Community . Nation - [sdp.org.uk]
My mind's been going places without me lately - Bushfire The B52's
Id be interested to see Bayliss on the wing, he seems a tad more agile than Joe C
Quote:Clarkey3kQuote:Never In Doubt
Lots wrong with us as ever but live to lose another today in Europe.
Not next season NID, we now have Danny who is the messiah, as well as being an occasional naughty boy. McNally for pack leader, Spencer to boss the forwards, DC to shape our attack and we will be a force to be reckoned with. Roll on season 21/22, very excited but will have to wait
Next you’ll be saying that England will win the Euro’s
The one time we actually look at the space from 3 metres out Watson, of all people, contrives to drop the ball! You couldn’t make it up. We were abject in many ways, but brim full of talent. Still, I guess our young coaches are another year older and more experienced. I retain hope that it will come together.
Well we did it so great credit to mcAnally & Baylis but we make such hard work of everything. They need to have a big re-think during the close season & get better coaching systems in place. What they are doing currently isn’t working despite us somehow ending in 7th place.
A win is a win, I would never turn a win down against a Saints outfit down especially a bonus point win - but I would agree that Boyd should be the happier DoR given the side he put out.
So much to work on for coaches and players alike. Why is Watson making those kind of errors, he would never ever try that in an England or Lions shirt so why does he think it is OK in a Bath shirt?
Well played yet again Josh Bayliss. Plenty of promise we just desperately need someone to unlock it.
Plenty to work on and look forward to, please let there be an improvement not another season of under achieving, disappointment and excuses from all.
It would be great to post nothing but positive comments. It seems such a long time since our performances from the team and Coaches have deserved it.
An old cliché- maybe next season?
So much to work on for coaches and players alike. Why is Watson making those kind of errors, he would never ever try that in an England or Lions shirt so why does he think it is OK in a Bath shirt?
Well played yet again Josh Bayliss. Plenty of promise we just desperately need someone to unlock it.
Plenty to work on and look forward to, please let there be an improvement not another season of under achieving, disappointment and excuses from all.
It would be great to post nothing but positive comments. It seems such a long time since our performances from the team and Coaches have deserved it.
An old cliché- maybe next season?
I agree, it's pointless being positive for the sake of it.
We have been fairly clueless for much of the season.
Good squad, good young players and a new coach coming in gives some hope but we are light years behind the top 2 currently.
We have been fairly clueless for much of the season.
Good squad, good young players and a new coach coming in gives some hope but we are light years behind the top 2 currently.
And the saints were a top outfit who did nothing wrong, never screwed up passes neve gave a way a penalty let alone 2 yellow cards, stupid offsides, giving lip to the ref etc etc Guys please get some perspective. If you were a Saints supporter what would you be saying?
Quote:hemington
And the saints were a top outfit who did nothing wrong, never screwed up passes neve gave a way a penalty let alone 2 yellow cards, stupid offsides, giving lip to the ref etc etc Guys please get some perspective. If you were a Saints supporter what would you be saying?
I think this is exactly the point, saints were poor, were twice down to 14 men and we could v easily have lost.
If scraping 7th (with the help of a covid win last week) and scraping home wins against mid table teams is the limit of our ambition then yay.
I have plenty of optimism for next season but the coaches need to up their game and fast. If they kid themselves that they and the squad are doing OK then we have serious problems.
Nice to be able to enjoy the win without having an underlying frustration at not having more fuel for
an agenda! Watching the players at the end of the game you could see that it's fundamentally still about them playing for each other even if in the professional era a successful product for the paying customer is vital in the eyes of some.
an agenda! Watching the players at the end of the game you could see that it's fundamentally still about them playing for each other even if in the professional era a successful product for the paying customer is vital in the eyes of some.
Well I guess we got we deserved really. Not a great season and we ended up top of the bottom half which is about our station at present. Not relegation fodder even if it existed but nowhere near the play offs and not likely to be unless major changes take place. I never thought SH was a good appointment and have seen nothing to change my mind. If we are stuck with him then so be it but SH with a team in the top four - not in my lifetime I fear and I am 77 - sad for a man who has supported thru good and bad for over 60 years. Not much else you can say really is there !
Well the club objective was to finish 8th so I guess Hooper has the champagne out to toast the overachievement.
No one is happy with where we finished. But, apart from a brief period in the first half, we attacked much better. We had two tries incorrectly ruled out (Spencer and Doughty) and two dropped over the line that were extremely close.
It was a good game.
It was a good game.
Was at the Rec today. Glorious weather and a great atmosphere (beer helped)
Very entertaining game, but the most telling moment for me was a team huddle under the posts where Ewels was obviously trying to manage the troops. Then Ben Spencer took over, giving everyone a right rocket, f-ing and blinding - "if you want this then your going to have to step up"
By this time Ewels had shuffled to the back and looked rather sheepish.
I know what sort of Captain I'd prefer if I was in that side.
Very entertaining game, but the most telling moment for me was a team huddle under the posts where Ewels was obviously trying to manage the troops. Then Ben Spencer took over, giving everyone a right rocket, f-ing and blinding - "if you want this then your going to have to step up"
By this time Ewels had shuffled to the back and looked rather sheepish.
I know what sort of Captain I'd prefer if I was in that side.
Interesting comments from Chris Boyd suggesting that our fitness levels are questionable "I thought they were out on their feet at half time".
Not for the first time our fitness levels questioned by opposing DoRs or pundits? Thoughts?
Or is it:
Signs of another arduous and exhausting season and not an issue?
Not for the first time our fitness levels questioned by opposing DoRs or pundits? Thoughts?
Or is it:
Signs of another arduous and exhausting season and not an issue?
And he noted we brought Saints down to 'their level'. A bit churlish when you've lost! My mates went to the game, enjoyed it and thought we just about deserved it. Saints are a good side yet we beat them and got a BP. I'm not suggesting we're playing anywhere near as well as we should do, but most sides have their frailties and do things that drive their fans mad. Bath do so more than many, but when we win it would be good to see a little more positivity.
We scored 4 tries and could / should have had 4 more, beat the 5th best side in the league, and people still b!tch and moan.
We've beaten Saints three times in the last nine months so I suspect he's just really salty. Considering they also lost to Glaws and Newcastle, hard to believe that their level is really that much higher than ours.
Ignore Boyd's comments.
There was plenty of cynical play from Saints at the breakdown and maybe he did not like his team being penalised for it.
He should be grateful that the officials ruled out Bath scores that seemed quite legitimate.
PG
There was plenty of cynical play from Saints at the breakdown and maybe he did not like his team being penalised for it.
He should be grateful that the officials ruled out Bath scores that seemed quite legitimate.
PG
Well I was there and enjoyed the game but how frustrating. It seemed we were not getting the rub of the green and should have won that by a canter. Couldn’t really see why the Tdg try was disallowed even on the big screen. Then when Tempest gave the Saints guy a yellow and still disallowed the try I really was confused! Perhaps one of you will tell me why it was disallowed!
Good win in the end but lovely to be back.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:06:12:23:36:33 by CoochieCoo.
Good win in the end but lovely to be back.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:06:12:23:36:33 by CoochieCoo.
It was disallowed as Bayliss separated from the maul without realising it and was adjudged to have obstructed the scrum half so that he could not make a tackle on Doughtly. We then came back to the earlier lineout infringement and the Saints player was shown a yellow card for too many team penalties.
As has been mentioned before there really isn't much between 5-11. A bit more consistency here or there. There's nothing to stop any of them having a Harlequins-type season if things fall their way (indeed that was us last season). But hard to see any.of them, and especially us, kicking on as Sale and Bristol have.
Still it was a fun game. The players achieved.what they set out to do but boy do we squander chances. No team turns an offensive set 5 out to a defensive set in our half quite like Bath.
Watching on TV I thought the refereeing was not unbalanced but odd - like the reality failed to match his narrative.
Still it was a fun game. The players achieved.what they set out to do but boy do we squander chances. No team turns an offensive set 5 out to a defensive set in our half quite like Bath.
Watching on TV I thought the refereeing was not unbalanced but odd - like the reality failed to match his narrative.
Bayliss separated but didn't engage. The scrum half tackled him without the ball.
I’d be interested to know what was the average number of phases we managed. It feels like maximum 5-6 and typically 2-3. There’s more than one way to walk n a game of rugby, but it feels as though we are more reliant than most on moments of brilliance rather than multi-phase, mistake-free rugby. However, swap Muir for Coka in that game, and we’d have won at a canter (as it were).
Quote:abendanon-anon-anon
Was at the Rec today. Glorious weather and a great atmosphere (beer helped)
Very entertaining game, but the most telling moment for me was a team huddle under the posts where Ewels was obviously trying to manage the troops. Then Ben Spencer took over, giving everyone a right rocket, f-ing and blinding - "if you want this then your going to have to step up"
By this time Ewels had shuffled to the back and looked rather sheepish.
I know what sort of Captain I'd prefer if I was in that side.
this... all season. Skipper and DOR too passive by half.
I sometimes wonder what Spencer thinks about what he walked into. He no doubt received a hefty wedge for his services but he must be finding things really disappointing.
Not everyone can play for Briz and Exeter, and in Briz's case whilst they seem to have everything in place to enjoy long term success you never know. Some might cite Sale as another club you'd want to play for but again, whilst they seem to be heading in the right direction they have a big Saffer contingent and don't get big crowds. People are understandably frustrated with our long period of chronic underachievement but that's less of an issue to Spencer. Perhaps he sees more to be optimistic about than jaundiced fans. We've a good squad, always sell out despite our lack of success and whilst we play in a bit of a shed it's in the centre of a lovely city in a great part of the country. Everyone's fully entitled to feel whatever about our years of mediocrity but like many others I renewed my ST knowing we probably won't win anything next year either, but there will still be plenty to appreciate and enjoy along the way, and when we're carp the banter's good and there are tons of pubs within 200 yards of the ground to carry out another post-mortem.
Just watched the game and it had me tearing my hair out in frustration. It was a pure distillation of our entire season. Pieces of excellent play (usually involving Spenno) interspersed with episodes that would be regarded as rank incompetence if they were done by the Dog And Duck Thirds on a Sunday morning after heavy night on the pi$$. We absolutely butchered at least 3 tries in the first half. and even average sides do not make those mistakes. We do. Again and again and again and again. Danny Cipriani has his hands full with this lot.
Josh Bayliss is going to be picked by Scotland on the wing, isn't he?
Good bye and good luck Rhys, Zach and Henry -we will miss you all. Mostly on a wet Friday night at Sale when we're 21- 0 down after 15 minutes..
My MotM - Tom De Glanville. Great hands, a beautiful step and all the wheels you could want. Now he just needs to learn how to finish off a break.
... IMHO, of course.
Now in Honolulu
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2021:06:13:00:53:46 by joethefanatic.
Josh Bayliss is going to be picked by Scotland on the wing, isn't he?
Good bye and good luck Rhys, Zach and Henry -we will miss you all. Mostly on a wet Friday night at Sale when we're 21- 0 down after 15 minutes..
My MotM - Tom De Glanville. Great hands, a beautiful step and all the wheels you could want. Now he just needs to learn how to finish off a break.
... IMHO, of course.
Now in Honolulu
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2021:06:13:00:53:46 by joethefanatic.
Quote:Optimist
This is a horror show. Where’s Elvis when we need him
I wonder if Bayliss has any 'Blue Suede shoes' ?
Quote:joethefanatic
My MotM - Tom De Glanville. Great hands, a beautiful step and all the wheels you could want. Now he just needs to learn how to finish off a break.
Problem is not many can keep up with him, if Bayliss or Mercer had been on the pitch things might have been different. Bayliss needs to be exploited next year as an attacking threat, perhaps an inside line from Cipriani? His speed and strength for that try was just a pleasure to behold!
Quote:joethefanatic
My MotM - Tom De Glanville. Great hands, a beautiful step and all the wheels you could want. Now he just needs to learn how to finish off a break.
I’m so pleased someone has made this point. Tom is a class act, but does need to work out what to do when he’s one on one with the try line beckoning. Too often he’s done all the hard work only to make the wrong decision at the last.
Iron this out and we have our nailed on full back for the next twelve years.
I thought Tom De Glanville was very good yesterday, he just needs the support around him once he makes the break. His decision making will come he's still young and a raw talent
Rewatching that last try, McNally does so well. Not just the rip, but the line, step and pass to Mercer. Often he's the one who gives way and Ewels stays on, was great to see him on for the 80. Unsung player of the season I reckon.
Quote:hasta
Bayliss separated but didn't engage. The scrum half tackled him without the ball.
Hasta I totally agree, the Saints scrum half instigated the tackle and actually he committed the offence as it was not obstruction by Bayliss. The only thing they could have said was Bayliss grabbed the scrum half but the TMO stated that was nothing. So the try should have stood, same with the Spencer try never a knock on - TMO stated initially that the ball never travelled forward until he acquiesced to Tempest and indeed the Saints player actually slapped the ball down.
Quote:Ali1969Quote:hasta
Bayliss separated but didn't engage. The scrum half tackled him without the ball.
Hasta I totally agree, the Saints scrum half instigated the tackle and actually he committed the offence as it was not obstruction by Bayliss. The only thing they could have said was Bayliss grabbed the scrum half but the TMO stated that was nothing. So the try should have stood, same with the Spencer try never a knock on - TMO stated initially that the ball never travelled forward until he acquiesced to Tempest and indeed the Saints player actually slapped the ball down.
Very disappointing that the ref was actively trying to turn over the decision of the TMO for two of our four disallowed tries. Why consult with the TMO if you’re going to ignore his advice.? We could have saved a lot of time if he had just said I don’t want it to be a try so it isn’t.
Re the Watson knock on moment - I can't have it both ways where I grumble about Craig MK spending ages talking to the TMO and giving way to their view of events rather than refereeing what he sees and being in charge of the match, and then grumble when Tempest refs what he sees, confirms what his view is and makes the decision.
BTW - I think Tempest is one of the better refs in the Prem, he is quick to decide, keen to keep the game moving, cool under pressure [see Afoa/Borthwick/Lam last week] and clear in communication. I hope he gets one the semis next weekend...
Adopted players: 24/25 J Bayliss; [24] O Lawrence; [23] J Cokanasiga; [22] M Green; [21] A Watson; [20] T Faletau; [19] M V Vuuren; [18] T Faletau; [17] D Denton; [16] H. Agulla; [15] L Houston; [14] W Spencer; [13] F. Louw
Family . Community . Nation - [sdp.org.uk]
My mind's been going places without me lately - Bushfire The B52's
BTW - I think Tempest is one of the better refs in the Prem, he is quick to decide, keen to keep the game moving, cool under pressure [see Afoa/Borthwick/Lam last week] and clear in communication. I hope he gets one the semis next weekend...
Adopted players: 24/25 J Bayliss; [24] O Lawrence; [23] J Cokanasiga; [22] M Green; [21] A Watson; [20] T Faletau; [19] M V Vuuren; [18] T Faletau; [17] D Denton; [16] H. Agulla; [15] L Houston; [14] W Spencer; [13] F. Louw
Family . Community . Nation - [sdp.org.uk]
My mind's been going places without me lately - Bushfire The B52's
Ssssh, don't talk too loudly as this appears to be a Ballsout free zone at the moment so would just add a few positive comments. Firstly, we WON,it does not matter how what or when, the fact is that we won the match and in the cold winter months when we are playing hopefully a top team in the Champions cup, will we really still be talking about how the match went against Northampton. I hope that like out team, we will have moved on from there.
I would have been disappointed if I thought that yesterdays performance was the very best that we could have played but we all know that it wasn't! Too many errors and basic mistakes but these can be corrected, we have the players in our squad who have tremendous talent and I don't think we are a million miles from getting it right.
Very pleased for players and coaches and for the vast majority of fans who will have been happy to get a win infront of a live audience, delighted that we have qualified for the Champions cup when we can measure ourselves against the best and hopefully keep improving.
All is most certainly not doom and gloom.
I would have been disappointed if I thought that yesterdays performance was the very best that we could have played but we all know that it wasn't! Too many errors and basic mistakes but these can be corrected, we have the players in our squad who have tremendous talent and I don't think we are a million miles from getting it right.
Very pleased for players and coaches and for the vast majority of fans who will have been happy to get a win infront of a live audience, delighted that we have qualified for the Champions cup when we can measure ourselves against the best and hopefully keep improving.
All is most certainly not doom and gloom.
Quote:TG Kesmo
Very disappointing that the ref was actively trying to turn over the decision of the TMO for two of our four disallowed tries. Why consult with the TMO if you’re going to ignore his advice.? We could have saved a lot of time if he had just said I don’t want it to be a try so it isn’t.
I was at the ground so only saw the incidents live and on the big screen without benefit of hearing the ref/TMO conversations, but I felt both the Spencer and Doughty tries OK. I hope I can find a recording to double check- so far I have only seen the awarded scores.
The number of dubious decisions over tries (both given in error and ruled out in error) has gone out of control this season.
Stephen Jones was scathing in The Sunday Times about forward passes after the Harlequins game. There are also frequent occasions of obstruction and even foul play facilitating tries.A professional sport, professional players, deserve better.
PG
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:06:13:15:17:22 by P G Tips.
Quote:hasta
Rewatching that last try, McNally does so well. Not just the rip, but the line, step and pass to Mercer. Often he's the one who gives way and Ewels stays on, was great to see him on for the 80. Unsung player of the season I reckon.
Agree Hasta and his sidestep to confound Danny Care for his try was equally good!
Quote:shipwreckedQuote:hasta
Rewatching that last try, McNally does so well. Not just the rip, but the line, step and pass to Mercer. Often he's the one who gives way and Ewels stays on, was great to see him on for the 80. Unsung player of the season I reckon.
Agree Hasta and his sidestep to confound Danny Care for his try was equally good!
He has been twinkle toe'd the last few games. Agree that he is a very good player and has become v important to us. The fact he is a massive unit and strong scrummager/mauler counts for a lot in my book.
I thought the doughty decision was odd. The scrum half would never have been obstructed if he had not chosen to proactively tackle bayliss. Bizarre decision making- that was deemed the foul play and the tug back was deemed fine.
The 'knock on' for spencers try was more backwards than one of the passes for a saints try (and several quins passes last game).
I have really rated tempest this season but him and Rose didn't work great together imho
Whilst i stand by my misery guts comments of post game yest I actually think getting over the line in a game the coaches/players certainly deemed important will help in the future.
Could very easily have lost with the last play of the game but actually went 80 yards and put some gloss on the win. Bayliss was pulling away from several backs-impressive.
As I say lots of reasons to be positive but the coaching and leadership at the club needs to improve a lot.
Could very easily have lost with the last play of the game but actually went 80 yards and put some gloss on the win. Bayliss was pulling away from several backs-impressive.
As I say lots of reasons to be positive but the coaching and leadership at the club needs to improve a lot.
I've now seen a replay of three of the four disallowed tries.
For me the Watson dropped ball does not go forward and is anyway dislodged by a Northampton hand - so no knock on. Try should have stood.
For the Doughty try, i agree it was the Northampton scrum half's choice to tackle Bayliss, so in that sense similar to the situation of a "screening"dummy runner in open play. Bayliss was in front of the ball though - so I accept that as a 50:50 call. The ref chose to call against Bath. Given that the scrum half made a dash for Doughty and missed him, the impact of Bayliss' actions could be argued either way.
Unfortunately, Bath have been on the receiving end of a few like that this year, so it was irritating to see the score ruled out.
PG
For me the Watson dropped ball does not go forward and is anyway dislodged by a Northampton hand - so no knock on. Try should have stood.
For the Doughty try, i agree it was the Northampton scrum half's choice to tackle Bayliss, so in that sense similar to the situation of a "screening"dummy runner in open play. Bayliss was in front of the ball though - so I accept that as a 50:50 call. The ref chose to call against Bath. Given that the scrum half made a dash for Doughty and missed him, the impact of Bayliss' actions could be argued either way.
Unfortunately, Bath have been on the receiving end of a few like that this year, so it was irritating to see the score ruled out.
PG
Congrats to Watson and Faletau for making Gatlands 26 man squad for Jersey.
The Watson dropped ball made no sense to me it went backwards. The only possible rationale for it being forward is that’s what you would think would happen. If it was Spot the Ball nobody would have won.
MtT
I think Woody is referring to Spencer's ruled out try, not Watson losing the ball in the act of scoring.
PG
I think Woody is referring to Spencer's ruled out try, not Watson losing the ball in the act of scoring.
PG
Quote:P G Tips
MtT
I think Woody is referring to Spencer's ruled out try, not Watson losing the ball in the act of scoring.
PG
Yes. Thanks PG
Quote:Mike the Taxi
Wasn't it decided that he 'lost control' of the ball?
You might be thinking of the first half 'no try' where Watson clearly did lose control of the ball. For the Spencer disallowed try in second half like PG what I saw was a saints player from behind knoock the ball out of Watson's hand and drops vertically then bounces back. Add in player momentum and it cannot have gone forward according to the RFU definition
Doughty's first effort was clearly lost on grounding and his second disallowed try was very harsh on Bayliss as a) he obviously didn't know he had become disengaged and b) he makes no effort to obstruct the saints player, he was just continuing forward
But golly what was the saints scrum half doing at the final breakdown? The clock was red. It should have been straight back to fly half and out of touch. Having said that the rip from Mcnally was immense, great hands through Zac and then Bayliss blistering speed away from saints backs was seriously impressive
Interesting game, obviously glad Bath won. A result at the end which will be ignored when the old mantra about mental fragility in the last 10 is brought up again by the usual suspect(s).
The chronicle ratings are interesting, its hard to disagree too much with too many of the individual scores - TDG, AW, Spencer, Reid, Beno, Mcnally etc all excellent (as individuals). I would probably reduce them all by 1 or 2, good as Spencer was I don't think that it was the 'perfect' performance? Maybe a 'feel good' by the Chron for the last game of the season. Of the players that weren't great only a couple will be here next season so no big deal.
IMO there were a few nice moments of team play and support but as usual some moments where all the Bath fans would hold their heads. Agree with those above that defence in the back line remains a concern, too many line breaks off first phase by the oppo and JC finds himself having to turn too frequently which isn't something he does very well. Particularly pleasing is that if I had arrived from space and watched that game it would have been impossible to tell the player who was in his second first team game proper (Max Ojomoh) the lad has fitted in brilliantly. Jacques du Toit has impressed me too.
Particular shout out to the lineout and Luke C who had Saints on toast most of the game, huge improvement over last couple of months.
School report for the end of the season, possibly squeezed a B- at the death but if I was in a worse mood may have been a C+. The table tells of an overall average performance over the year and that's probably not far wrong despite a few COVID points etc. One to forget.
One last point to add is that my adoptee this year has done me proud! Well done Tom and looking forward to seeing you pull on the BB&W jersey many more times in the seasons to come.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:06:14:08:02:22 by BathMatt53.
The chronicle ratings are interesting, its hard to disagree too much with too many of the individual scores - TDG, AW, Spencer, Reid, Beno, Mcnally etc all excellent (as individuals). I would probably reduce them all by 1 or 2, good as Spencer was I don't think that it was the 'perfect' performance? Maybe a 'feel good' by the Chron for the last game of the season. Of the players that weren't great only a couple will be here next season so no big deal.
IMO there were a few nice moments of team play and support but as usual some moments where all the Bath fans would hold their heads. Agree with those above that defence in the back line remains a concern, too many line breaks off first phase by the oppo and JC finds himself having to turn too frequently which isn't something he does very well. Particularly pleasing is that if I had arrived from space and watched that game it would have been impossible to tell the player who was in his second first team game proper (Max Ojomoh) the lad has fitted in brilliantly. Jacques du Toit has impressed me too.
Particular shout out to the lineout and Luke C who had Saints on toast most of the game, huge improvement over last couple of months.
School report for the end of the season, possibly squeezed a B- at the death but if I was in a worse mood may have been a C+. The table tells of an overall average performance over the year and that's probably not far wrong despite a few COVID points etc. One to forget.
One last point to add is that my adoptee this year has done me proud! Well done Tom and looking forward to seeing you pull on the BB&W jersey many more times in the seasons to come.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:06:14:08:02:22 by BathMatt53.
Quote:hasta
Saints were losing at that point Gaz.
Thanks hasat, too much footy beer n sun when watching the highlights explains my post
I think re Spencer’s disallowed try the ref had decided no try on the pitch and was looking for ways not to overturn it. The TMO said it didn’t go forward but-the ref overruled him. It strikes me that if you aren’t going to take into account what he says don’t consult him at all.
Quote:gaz59
[
But golly what was the saints scrum half doing at the final breakdown? The clock was red. It should have been straight back to fly half and out of touch. Having said that the rip from Mcnally was immense, great hands through Zac and then Bayliss blistering speed away from saints backs was seriously impressive
If he had done that they would have lost anyway would they not or am I remembering the score wrongly?
Interesting that we did such a number on Saints' lineout, after shipping a potential cup final a month back by having our own lineout dismantled. It kind of sums up our season. It's almost as if there are 6 components to playing rugby and we have 5 coaches - so one facet of the game gets forgotten each week.
Quote:Optimist
Interesting that we did such a number on Saints' lineout, after shipping a potential cup final a month back by having our own lineout dismantled. It kind of sums up our season. It's almost as if there are 6 components to playing rugby and we have 5 coaches - so one facet of the game gets forgotten each week.
I think its because the skills and routines are still in the early learning stage as opposed to ingrained in muscle memory and an automatic function.
Hasta's whack-a-mole analogy!
Quote:Bath HammerQuote:gaz59
[
But golly what was the saints scrum half doing at the final breakdown? The clock was red. It should have been straight back to fly half and out of touch. Having said that the rip from Mcnally was immense, great hands through Zac and then Bayliss blistering speed away from saints backs was seriously impressive
If he had done that they would have lost anyway would they not or am I remembering the score wrongly?
Nope it was me misreading the score when watching the highlights after too much footy beer n sun but in defence my mistake was aided and abetted by the offy report which has Priestland as converting the last try
Has the resident Bath forum smellfungus commented on the win yet?
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
No but something like this
1. Papers up the cracks
2. Can’t keep the ball
3. No phases as per
4. At least there was a crowd to cheer the lads out
5. Why can’t we have a birdie song
Have I missed any?
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:06:15:14:40:12 by CoochieCoo.
1. Papers up the cracks
2. Can’t keep the ball
3. No phases as per
4. At least there was a crowd to cheer the lads out
5. Why can’t we have a birdie song
Have I missed any?
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:06:15:14:40:12 by CoochieCoo.
Quote:CoochieCoo
No but something like this
1. Papers up the cracks
2. Can’t keep the ball
3. No phases as per
4. At least there was a crowd to cheer the lads out
5. Why can’t we have a birdie song
Have I missed any?
Didn't form a tunnel out of the changing room for Zach and anyone else leaving.
Dropped passes
Couldn't score against 14 men
Didn't have a sing song at any time ever in the last 10 years
Bruce ran over my roses
Bruce's dog sh@t on my lawn
Oh dear, I've started something...apologies BO I was only making mischief.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:06:15:16:11:19 by BathMatt53.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:06:15:16:11:19 by BathMatt53.
Typical sniping from the mod who threatens to ban others for sniping, whilst sniping himself. Never change CoochieCoo 
An absolutely stunning 80 minute performance, full of cohesive multi-phase attacking rugby showing a team full of star names at their absolute best.
In reality, nice for the crowd and those leaving to get a win to finish off.
An absolutely stunning 80 minute performance, full of cohesive multi-phase attacking rugby showing a team full of star names at their absolute best.
In reality, nice for the crowd and those leaving to get a win to finish off.
I think you need to look up the difference of sniping and parody bo but of course you have your own special interpretations as usual. Bans are only given for breaking the rules parodying is not disallowed otherwise we wouldn’t have any contributors!
We could do with a bit more parodying around the rucks by Spencer I think - just to draw in those apologists, before releasing it to let the whingers to do their stuff.
Quote:Optimist
We could do with a bit more parodying around the rucks by Spencer I think - just to draw in those apologists, before releasing it to let the whingers to do their stuff.
Like dropping the ball you mean!
Quote:CoochieCoo
I think you need to look up the difference of sniping and parody bo but of course you have your own special interpretations as usual. Bans are only given for breaking the rules parodying is not disallowed otherwise we wouldn’t have any contributors!
Embarrassing.
Quote:ballsoutQuote:CoochieCoo
I think you need to look up the difference of sniping and parody bo but of course you have your own special interpretations as usual. Bans are only given for breaking the rules parodying is not disallowed otherwise we wouldn’t have any contributors!
Embarrassing.
Oooops I appear to have accidentally touched a raw nerve! Sorry bo I am sure it won’t last long!
Yep, rolling around laughing at your posts = touching a nerve. Absolutely.
Give us a birdie song and we can all then live happily ever after!
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:06:16:00:33:08 by CoochieCoo.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:06:16:00:33:08 by CoochieCoo.
Quote:Optimist
We could do with a bit more parodying around the rucks by Spencer I think - just to draw in those apologists, before releasing it to let the whingers to do their stuff.
What do you think you are up to Opti, far too clever for ere
Back to the rugby, notable that Chudley didn’t get on, even for 30 seconds, for what would have been his final game for us. Shows the drop off/lack of faith between our first choice 9 and the rest. That has to change as Spencer can’t play every important minute and only be replaced once we’ve definitely won or lost. I don’t expect a 9 signing, but it’d be nice to have someone we can call on to give Spencer a rest, especially as Green and Fox aren’t trusted yet, although next year may be their year.
9 (like 2) is a strange position and, I’d imagine, very difficult to recruit for as you need a very good option on the bench who knows he’s second choice. It’s not like back row or back 3 where you might come on in a couple of positions or like prop where rotation happens at 50/60 minutes. Most teams in the Prem seem to have a solution - but we are a long way short. Since Cook and Stringer, we’ve barely had 1 top 9, let alone 2. But we need at least 2 if we’re to get out of our slump and give Cip half a chance of making an impact.
9 (like 2) is a strange position and, I’d imagine, very difficult to recruit for as you need a very good option on the bench who knows he’s second choice. It’s not like back row or back 3 where you might come on in a couple of positions or like prop where rotation happens at 50/60 minutes. Most teams in the Prem seem to have a solution - but we are a long way short. Since Cook and Stringer, we’ve barely had 1 top 9, let alone 2. But we need at least 2 if we’re to get out of our slump and give Cip half a chance of making an impact.
Quote:dr.bath1865
Back to the rugby, notable that Chudley didn’t get on, even for 30 seconds, for what would have been his final game for us. Shows the drop off/lack of faith between our first choice 9 and the rest. That has to change as Spencer can’t play every important minute and only be replaced once we’ve definitely won or lost. I don’t expect a 9 signing, but it’d be nice to have someone we can call on to give Spencer a rest, especially as Green and Fox aren’t trusted yet, although next year may be their year.
9 (like 2) is a strange position and, I’d imagine, very difficult to recruit for as you need a very good option on the bench who knows he’s second choice. It’s not like back row or back 3 where you might come on in a couple of positions or like prop where rotation happens at 50/60 minutes. Most teams in the Prem seem to have a solution - but we are a long way short. Since Cook and Stringer, we’ve barely had 1 top 9, let alone 2. But we need at least 2 if we’re to get out of our slump and give Cip half a chance of making an impact.
Are there 9s who can sit on the bench week after week and come on for 20-25 minutes and perform, tough job.
(
It feels like the coaching team have been somewhat in thrall to Spencer .. he came from the most successful/winningest club in the country, which probably gives him more authority than our DoR, frankly. They never take him off, and it feels as though he dictates tactics more than anyone. We've had weeks when he's kicked virtually every ball and slowed everything to snail's pace, and other weeks when he runs everything and plays at a really high tempo. His only concession is our exit strategy when Rhys is playing is to pass back and kick out through 10.
Incidentally, in this statisticstastic modern world of ours, is there not one that measures the length of clearance kicks to touch? Hard to imagine many do it better than Rhys. His clearances must have covered thousands of metres over the course of the season.
Incidentally, in this statisticstastic modern world of ours, is there not one that measures the length of clearance kicks to touch? Hard to imagine many do it better than Rhys. His clearances must have covered thousands of metres over the course of the season.
Quote:Optimist
It feels like the coaching team have been somewhat in thrall to Spencer .. he came from the most successful/winningest club in the country, which probably gives him more authority than our DoR, frankly. They never take him off, and it feels as though he dictates tactics more than anyone. We've had weeks when he's kicked virtually every ball and slowed everything to snail's pace, and other weeks when he runs everything and plays at a really high tempo. His only concession is our exit strategy when Rhys is playing is to pass back and kick out through 10.
Incidentally, in this statisticstastic modern world of ours, is there not one that measures the length of clearance kicks to touch? Hard to imagine many do it better than Rhys. His clearances must have covered thousands of metres over the course of the season.
Spencer's clearance kick from our 22 in the first half into Saints' 10 metre line was impressive. His sprint to get to and swamp the Saints' player who took it from their quick throw was insane and in my view was the critical play that led to Faletau's try
Agreed gaz. He's been immense for us - can you imagine what your season might have looked like if we hadn't landed him? But I think having Cipriani as another more forceful tactician outside him could free him up a bit.
Immense he has been. Can't praise him highly enough. I think my point wasn't necessarily about Spencer being good but rather about our other stable of 9s not being up to it. Clearly, for whatever reason, none of them offers either an alternative (gameplan, style) that changes the game or sufficient quality to allow Spencer a rest.
You can see Spencer's will to win at almost every break in play and his reaction when a team scores against us is often priceless. He hates it. Absolutely hates it, and whilst I know no professional rugby player likes conceding a try and not all of them have to scream to high heaven when we concede, it's nice to see the passion and Spencer's commitment to driving the team to improve.
He and Cipriani might be a perfect combination and, between them, they might be able to unlock the undoubted potential of the rest of the squad, especially the back row and back 3. It's an almighty 'might', but I do live in hope that the halfback void in our squad looks a little more filled than for many seasons.
You can see Spencer's will to win at almost every break in play and his reaction when a team scores against us is often priceless. He hates it. Absolutely hates it, and whilst I know no professional rugby player likes conceding a try and not all of them have to scream to high heaven when we concede, it's nice to see the passion and Spencer's commitment to driving the team to improve.
He and Cipriani might be a perfect combination and, between them, they might be able to unlock the undoubted potential of the rest of the squad, especially the back row and back 3. It's an almighty 'might', but I do live in hope that the halfback void in our squad looks a little more filled than for many seasons.
The 9 question and the Chudley/Green treatment is an interesting one for me. You could argue that this season Hooper wrote off half way through and in his mind Green was definitely the 2nd choice 9 next year, knowing Spencer is 100% first choice. So rather than sit Green on the bench for the season, send him off on loan to get him a load of game time and improve under and learn under different coaches, and then come back with more experience and time on the pitch under his belt. This would then leave Fox to be third choice next season, which I'm happy with if Green has improved.
Where this theory breaks down is if Hooper had indeed given up on this season, why not play Green with Spencer on the bench. Who knows. But I don't expect a 9 to come in with any cash going elsewhere.
Where this theory breaks down is if Hooper had indeed given up on this season, why not play Green with Spencer on the bench. Who knows. But I don't expect a 9 to come in with any cash going elsewhere.
send him off on loan to get him a load of game time and improve under and learn under different coaches
Seems like a decent plan for the squad...
Seems like a decent plan for the squad...
Quote:woodpecker
send him off on loan to get him a load of game time and improve under and learn under different coaches
Seems like a decent plan for the squad...
Might make for a busy calendar for them!
Quote:woodpecker
send him off on loan to get him a load of game time and improve under and learn under different coaches
Max Green is 25 now, surely he's either good enough or not by this point? Fox out on loan wouldn't be a bad plan though.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Totally my view, Bath Otter. Green was identified as 2nd choice next season from once Chudley got the move. He was out on loan to get quality time playing - Chudley covered Spencer but we knew he was going and so there wasn't a need to get him on the pitch unless Spencer was struggling. Fox still needs some work at this stage - and was used for the 'A' team games - where he showed admirable strengths, but from what i saw (yeah, here in Fiji, dontcha love the internet) has some work to do on his kicking from the rear of a caterpillar. Don't we all.
OBinFiji
OBinFiji
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